How much would you pay/should I charge?

[WeatherbyGeorgeDuPree]

I've been asked to quote for a cake, but I haven't a clue how much to quote. Please have a look at these cakes and give me some idea what might be a sensible amount. As made, they each gave about 25 servings of 2"x2". I would estimate that they cost about £20-£25 to make. Apart from the baking, the bus and the owl were probably about 2h work, the guitar rather more.

PS This is not a stealth boast, it's a genuine question. I've NCed so that I can disappear again.

Our local bakery would charge upwards of £60 for something like this. Yours look considerably nicer, in fact. They're fab

So; more than £60...

I think £ 50 to £60 for the first 2 and £ 80 for the guitar.

Thanks.

So for cakes of the same style and standard, but a little bigger, another £5-£10? Or would the cake have to be substantially bigger to make it cost more?

Locally, East London, people charge £60 - £70. A cake with more elaborate icing or figures, anything up to £100.

Firstly, have you worked out your costs thoroughly? Including gas/elec for baking, boards, boxes etc?
When you say 2 hours work, is that just for the decorating or have you allowed for prep/cleaning time as well?
And finally, how much do you want to earn per hour?
I have a cake business (although not working at the moment) and my cakes start at £50 for a 6" round cake.
Also, if you are planning on selling (which I assume you are), are you registered as a food business with your local council? It's free to register, it just means they inspect your kitchen to ensure it's clean.

Thanks.

I don't want to run a business. I'm very much an amateur and I generally only make cakes for my family and close friends, as gifts. But someone I do not know personally has either seen or been told about my cakes, and wants to commission one.

The two hours is from unwrapping the cooled cake from its baking paper, to being ready to put it in the cake box for delivery. It does not include setting up and clearing away (though TBH clearing away really does not take long). Depending on the design, it might be 2h in one go, or it might be spread over a couple of evenings.

The rules used to be that if money changed hands (from a stranger, not friends and family), you are by default in business and have to be registered. It's because of food hygiene and public safety, although clearly cakes are very low risk!
I don't know if they've been relaxed, there was some talk about it, I think as so many people were doing exactly what you would be doing and making one or two cakes. Might be worth searching on your councils website anyway to see what they say?

I know I am going to sound boring and more than likely come last in any popularity contest but you should not be charging a penny if you're an unregistered business. This could really come back to bite you in the behind. Legal and registered home bakers have to go through hygiene checks, have insurances in place etc. I'm not sure why you feel you can bypass this process for "1 or 2" cakes now and then, bypassing the registration process not only puts you and potential customers at risk but it can have negative long term implications in regards to inland revenue if you are caught.

It seems a shame that many, many home bakers take the time to go through the process properly and as a result have certain overheads just for others to be able to charge minimal prices that legit cake makers struggle to match just because they just do the odd 1 or 2 or somehow just feel that registering is not for them.

It's one cake! If that really was the default rule; wouldn't everyone who's ever flogged anything on eBay become liable? Or is it just because it's food?
Op, if it's the Fire Engine one; charge £80 at least.

Min £70.

"minimal prices that legit cake makers struggle to charge"

I'm not undercutting anyone.

Professional cake decorators would make a higher profit than me because they would spend less time and effort for quite possibly better quality results. They would buy their ingredients in bulk and VAT free. Yes, I know they would be paying VAT, insurance and business rates.

If anything, I undercut professionals when I make cakes for free! Yet there's nothing underhand about that.

Just in case tone-of-voice isn't coming across, I'm not shouting. I've thought carefully about your post. It's a legitimate POV. But what about all the little transactions like paying a babysitter, or selling home-made stuff at a carboot stall or on eBay? It's not enough of a transaction to raise my non-existent income far enough for me to pay tax, so how is it any business of the IR?

Hi Weatherby,

What I said I'd not just a point of view, if you charge for the cake without being registered then it's illegal. Obviously I understand that it us not up there with the greatest crime of the century! I do have perspective and I don't mean to come across as obnoxious and righteous and I apologise if I am.

It's very important that you are registered, it enables people to know that your premises where you bake are clean, that you store things correctly, you've passed an inspection and have at least basic hygiene standards in place fit for commercial use and that ultimately you are insured....

Professional (registered ) cake decorators do not spend less time and effort, yes they may find things easier but they wouldn't be very good if they put in less effort and 'churned' them out. That is often an 'argument' used by unregistered cake makers that holds no water in justifying the point. Registered, legit home decorators are just like you, they don't have faster hands or a speedier oven or self icing sponges. What registered cake makers do have though is associated costs that come with being legit, costs that you wouldn't have to cover and do not have to factor into your charge.

Just to also add many, many registered home bakers do not buy their ingredients in bulk at trade prices, it's just not an option, unless you're pointing to shop owners, bakeries etc? Which is an entirely different spectrum. The average home baker would have the same cost as yourself, yet would have gone to the effort of bring registered and would be adequately insured...

The cake decorating 'community' is massive, and people do talk. Someone is likely to 'report' you, I've seen it over and over, a friend of mine had a fb page sharing the cakes she made for her family, she was reported as an unregistered business?! She was sharing baking days with her kids etc!?

You obviously have a massive talent in decorating cakes, why not just register? It's so simple and removes the worry. Your cakes are fantastic, you should really look into taking it further.

I've heard the ebay comments before, I don't agree with 'just because someone else is then I will' justification. I'm a bore I know, but when health and safety is involved then I think that's a pretty irresponsible attitude to take.

I am sorry if I come across as a pain, unfortunately I've seen your situation end in tears and cause lots of hassle, whatever you decide to do, you obviously enjoy cake making, they are very good.

Sorry for all the typos, it's early and my ipad is rebellious at this time of the morning!

Stormswept, thank you for making such detailed posts. I'm not in any way being sarcastic, and you don't come across as negative or a pain.

But there was a time when I considered trying to do this professionally, and I calculated costs of buying ingredients in larger quantities (not necessarily bulk). Even with paying VAT it worked out cheaper. For example, right now I have to buy things like icing in small packets, and there is a lot of wastage as leftovers cannot be kept for use a couple of months later. Whereas if I was making even one cake a week I could reuse opened packets of icing, so there would be less wastage.

And regular bakers certainly work faster. Again, from experience when I've made several cakes in a short period of time.

My point about babysitting, eBay etc is not that others do it so why shouldn't I, but that these small, irregular transactions are tolerated. It is accepted that people can trade or hire themselves out on an occasional basis without being considered a business.

It's because it's food though, with the potential to cause food poisoning.
Anyway, slight derail but you can freeze opened packs of icing for use later. Just don't touch it until it's completely defrosted because it goes sticky then dries out again.

Of course it is, op. Honestly! A cake every now and then for people you already know does not make you a business. Anymore than setting up a car boot sale every couple of weeks obliges you to register as a limited company.