Right. Ds's behavior is off the wall. I need help.

[colditz]

I went to the playschhol picnic, and ds and I sat next to a little girl who had a fruit shoot, a Lunchable and a packet of Haribo for her lunch. Out of Mumsnet research, I watched this girl's behavior for the afternoon. It was impeccable.

Meanwhile, my son, of the same age, stuffed a cheese sandwich on brown, (made with butter, not marg), a chopped up apple, some breadsticks, and a chocolate biscuit.

He then teararsed around, pushing, squealing, shouting, jumping queues, rolling about when he should have been sitting down, throwing a massive tantrum, and generally giving every parent present a reason to let their children subsist on crappy food.

What am I doing wrong here? I have made a determined decision - ds is getting no more chocolate, no squash, nothing made of oranges, no sweets ever (which he hasn't had anyway), no cake that isn't homemade - what have I missed? Is there anything else I can cut out of his diet without consulting a dietitian?

I think it's just the energy surge they get from the food, isn't it? Nothing to do with additives, e-numbers etc.

DS doesnt get any. additives I mean not food. But you would think he was given irn bru by IV

My dad doesn't help, he is always asking what thwe hell I have been feeding him ("Have you been giving him coke?")

Yes, Dad. I often give my hyperactive 3 year old coke at 7 pm, who wouldn't?

It may well not be food. Some children just are very lively, particularly when they've eaten and got an energy burst. Having said that, I do have a food-intolerant child.

DS2 doesn't seem to react to food at all, but DS1 reacts to lots of things - not always immediately and not always the obvious things. I always recommend Sue Dengate's amazingly informative website to anyone who thinks some of their child's behaviour might be caused by food.

In DS1's case, it turns out apple juice and mature cheddar make him more hyper than maple syrup and pancakes. Not very healthy , but true.

DS1 is completely different 'on diet', but he is still a very lively, volatile and excitable boy.

oh, you poor thing. But really, do consider that food and his behavior are probably fairly unrelated. If you aren't feeding him coke and sugar all day, it probably won't make too much difference to his behavior if you give him junk food or healthy food. Now, please don't think that I'm suggesting that you should give him junk food (my ds is known as the kid who gets the healthiest lunches at school). But do consider that diet may not be the cause or solution to your problem and put your energies elsewhere.
I think you might be better off taking for granted that he is an extremely active child and figuring out tricks to channel his energy. Also, maybe you are better off not putting him in situations where he has to stay still. You could also try to teach him where he is allowed to be active and where he isn't and be reasonable in your expectations and don't worry what other people think. Let them give you all the pitying looks they want...it's their loss not having a wonderfully active and bright child like yours!!
Anyway, it seems to me that a playschool picnic should be a place where a child can run around and be active. And if he doesn't want to sit still and eat because he is excited by all the activities and friends, then let him run around. And if the other parents tutt too much, then take him to another place where they appreciate diversity. On the other hand if you are in an indoor setting like a restaurant, then he should be expected to sit still for some period of time. But don't expect him to do it for an unreasonable amount of time. I think that it's perfectly possible for a child to be active, but disciplined.

My dd is 3 and very very active AND talks non-stop. I let her run around the playground in whatever state of undress she wants making all the noise she wants, but if we go out to dinner (which we do quite regularly with our children), then I expect her to sit still amd talk quietly. However, I usually provide a break every 20 minutes or so...take her to the bathroom or get up to see what the chef is doing or send her to get me a menu, etc. As she gets older, I will expect her to sit still for longer. My ds (5) is also very active and was forever dismantling things as a baby. He has calmed down a little and is already fairly good at understanding how to channel his energy into location appropriate behavior. I know full well the pitying looks you are describing and the tut-tut's from people. They do decrease as the children get older. And also, I have gotten better at picking where I go with my children with respect to their energy level.

By the way, I too was an extremely active child and was known for many years as the jumping jack girl as I couldn't sit still and would always do jumping jacks in place if i was required to stand in one place. In fact, when I was 4 we moved cities and my mother put me in a new nursery that was a complete disaster. They tried to make me sit crosslegged in a circle for long periods of time listening to stories and they tried to make me take a nap everyday. (It is the only unpleasant memory that I have from my childhood) My mother switched nurseries after a week because it was clear that the expectations were not going to work for me. That wasn't to say that I was a naughty or undisciplined child. In fact, I was an extremely obedient and well behaved child, I just couldn't sit still for long periods of time. (I still can't!!!) And if it makes you feel any better, my father is a famous scientist whose specialty is cancer and nutrition and I grew up on the healthiest food you can imagine.
And don't worry, hyperactivity doesn't doom your child to a life of failure. I was extremely good at school, got perfect grades and went to the best university in the country (doing jumping jacks all the way).

ps. It won't kill your ds to get sweets once in awhile. Use them sparingly and they can be really effective. I have found that sweets make an excellent bribe if you are trying to get your child to sit or stay still. Lollypops work very well as a silencer! A little sugar is perfectly ok and letting them have a little can teach moderation. And if they only get them on special occasions, they still think of them as something special that's worth a little extra effort.

good luck.

colditz - I really do empathise - my ds2 was born with a fully-formed big personality. He fills an empty room, IFKWIM. Patience and consistency, IME pays off even more than being militant about food. Although, from a healthy point of view, that's obviously very good.

If one more person says to me ''my, you've got your hands full there', I will scream, but as he has grown older (he's 6 in october) and learned some self discipline, and social niceties, he is well-mannered, gregarious, has a great sense of humour, very intelligent and curious about the world. He just needs lots of exercise and regular opportunities to let off steam. And is very extovert and LOUD!!
I'm sure your ds will turn out into a fabulous little boy!

For most children, the "Coke and sugar" thing might be true. But for my son a healthy diet of lots of fruit and vegetables is terrible. He has to eat a limited range of fruit and vegetables to minimise a whole range of physical and behavioural symptoms.

So while Colditz's son may well not be affected by food, he might be! And he might not be affected by the things people generally assume are problems.

DS1 is fine with wheat/gluten and dairy/casein, but has problems with artificial colourings, flavourings, preservatives, sweeteners, flavour enhancers, and, more surprisingly, naturally occurring food chemicals (in his case salicylates and amines). I used to feed him a diet high in grapes, tomatoes, broccoli, cheese and freshly-squeezed orange juice. Turns out all those things turn him hyper.