Sick to the back teeth of useless men using weaponised incompetence at work. Is it just me?!

[OscillateItsTitsALot]

Sorry but I’m so annoyed I can’t sleep thinking about how utterly infuriating I find the men in my workplace.
I work in a small organisation of 14 people, in a management role.
2 of the staff are men.
100% of the men in the organisation are absolutely useless in basic tasks and I’m getting really sick of it. Some of the women treat them like they’re particularly stupid toddlers as well.
Recent examples include:

• the men messaging women more senior than them for email addresses they could get themselves if they just spent a few seconds looking in the online address book
• On a recent work away day, one of the men asked me if I could give him directions to the restaurant we were all meeting at. I told him it will be available on Google Maps.
• Occupying the vast majority of time of our shared executive assistant because they can’t do things like organise their own travel or book hotels (the EA role is focussed around setting up meetings and finance work, we are all expected to make our own travel arrangements and to only use her if it’s a complex requirement). One of the men apparently needs the PA to put a reminder in his calendar for when he has to set off from his house to the train station, because he forgets otherwise
• A female colleague created a special word document recently because one of the men kept forgetting the work he’d been asked to do. She updates it for him. She’s more senior than him, and I’m quite annoyed she’s gone to these lengths rather than just telling him to start making lists himself
• One of the men asking if he can have no meetings before 10am because the school run tires him out. He has 1 child.
• They both take an eternity to respond to a simple Teams message. The incompetence they can get away with is something I feel women would be going through a disciplinary for.
• They’re always tired, or having to go out and run errands for their families or taking an hour to do the school run so can’t be available for meetings between 3 and 4. I feel when women do this, it’s seen as almost a sackable offence and at the very least a sign of incompetence. But when men do it they’re tired little heroes.

I have raised with other managers that we need to have better expectations and not set a standard whereby women are doing the work of men displaying weaponised incompetence. However it was met with what I can only describe as bemusement and “Well you know what they’re like, they need a bit of hand holding sometimes”. These are men in their late 30’s and 40’s FFS.

There are only 3 women who pander to the men but they’re quite protective of the men, and are quite Senior so what they say goes.

Does this happen in other workplaces? I’m sick of picking up the slack for them, for the constant mistakes and moaning about being tired from being dads. I am looking at other opportunities, I can’t work much longer in a workplace that treats women so appallingly

I have never worked anywhere that would tolerate that. Are these managers not very bright or something? I just… No. I wouldn't survive a week in that environment.

amending hours for the school run, I have definitely come across yes. That is not specific to the sex of the person doing the school run. But the rest of it, no.

And why would a senior person do a task list for someone? I don't get it.

I work for a huge organisation but in a team of 14.

There’s one senior woman who babies the two men in the team. Helping with to do lists and organisation and planning. even though it’s within their role to do that and not her job. She seems to think it’s cute and just the way they are.

They play up to it and it’s totally weaponised competence.

also the women in the team are held to a different standard, if they don’t do something her way she gets annoyed and frustrated but it’s perfectly fine for the men to not do it/do it badly.

Honestly th managers are odd balls. I can’t work them out at all.

the school run thing - I sometimes do it but on an understanding that it’s done as quickly as possible, not an hour in addition to my lunch hour! The men have a full lunch hour then do the school run then complain they’re so busy and have no time

Is there any way in which you could fail to do one of these "reminding" tasks so that it causes a huge disaster which lands on one of these bosses? Thinking of a huge organizational cockup of something that is in the particular managers remit that will make them look incompetent.

Unfortunately I deal with this a lot at work. I can't tell you the amount of office rows there has been because a man would go find a woman to do a stupid job they needed to do themselves such as cleaning up a spill or putting new loo roll in the toilet or even changing the paper in the printer! It's entitlement. Most women tell them to jog on but the newer women always take time to snap.
Not long back there was a blazing argument when a male colleague was on the phone to a client and put them on hold to click at a female member of staff who was senior to him and say "grab me a coffee" and then got back on the phone. War broke out.
Asking for phone numbers from spreadsheets they have access to, expecting the women of the office to organise events, asking where things are. It's pathetic how grown men act.

It’s a team of 14 and you are in a management role. How many of the people you have issues with do you manage? What is in your direct control to change?

No this does not happen in my workplace and I don’t think it’s a “man thing”, it’s a useless worker thing which needs to be dealt with by your managers. Not sure why this is in feminist forum tbh

The booking hotels and travel, tell the EA to stop doing it. If any have been booked recently then cancel them.

Or get the EA to book the wrong accommodation so if you are supposed to be in a hotel in Preston, book him/them into a B and B in Blackburn.

I manage 1 woman so very little control though I do shield her from having to do menial work for the men. I have told her to tell me when they ask her to do something. It’s a lot.

Bit of a coincidence all the mess are but the women are all perfectly fine?

Doesn’t happen where I work and I don’t think it’s a ‘man’ thing. You just seem to have a disproportionate number of incompetent staff.

I managed a team of 12, mostly men. In my experience, it’s generally the women who are on the less competent, or ‘ditsy’, side.

Because women picking up the slack for men is a feminist issue

If you think it’s a troll thread you should report it rather than troll hunt, which is now allowed on MN.

But no it’s not. Plenty of women do school runs too but they don’t behave like doing so is a second job in itself

Hadn’t thought about this before but there are FOUR men (older (if it matters) and only one senior!) in my company who will not adopt new technology/process, feigning incompetence, and we bend to accommodate them. They’re not even high performers! It’s actually mind blowing now I’ve written it down!

You say that you "can’t work much longer in a workplace that treats women so appallingly", but you haven't actually given any examples of women being treated appallingly in your workplace.

Aside from the deliberate misuse of the EA, what you've described is behavior that you personally find irritating (as most of us would), but which your colleagues seem happy to at best ignore or at worst encourage. You say that you feel women would face disciplinary action or the sack for similar behavior, but unless that's actually happened, I think the issue at your workplace is one of bad management more than anything else.

Sounds like an issue with 2 particular people rather than a feminist issue and why is no one dealing with them? I have worked for 30 years in different companies and never observed any of this. I am also a manager.

But no it’s not. Plenty of women do school runs too but they don’t behave like doing so is a second job in itself

Sure they do.
I have worked in many workplaces where people (men and other women) passive aggressively complain about the mums "always taking time off" for kids.
It's far more common for women to have to rush home during the day because they've got a call from school about a sick child, or not be able to come in at all for the same reason, which is a feminist issue that it's usually women doing this of course.
When men do actually do it, as in your workplace, they are also berated for it!

We have a bit of this at work but not as bad. A random man who I don’t even really work with asked me to sign a birthday card for a colleague on behalf of him “as he didn’t know what to say”. I just laughed in his face and left it on his desk! The frustrating thing is there is a woman in his team that does this stuff for him. I make it my mission never to do something for a man they can do themselves.

Didn’t take long for the handmaidens to arrive. Not a feminist issue my arse.

OP I can only imagine how frustrating it is to hand hold these babies. I spent 2 years managing my manager because he couldn’t do the job alone. It’s pathetic.

Imagine what it’s like living with these overgrown toddlers. I don’t know how any woman could be attracted to them.

I am not a hand maiden thanks. Just not keen to turn every useless man into a feminist issue. I have worked with both useless men and women in my time.

Well I’ve raised the issue of women doing menial work for men, and it was dismissed and came with flippant responses. I think knowing this happens and allowing it to continue is a pretty awful way to treat women in the workplace.

And yes I have been (rightly) pulled up on mistakes I’ve made, but the men make worse mistakes on a regular basis and absolutely nothing is said.

These (particularly the second) are utterly ridiculous, not only will it put the EA in a really awkward position - OP is the manager she should tell the MEN not to use the EA for that reason not expect someone more junior to take all the flack - but it will also make the organisation look very bad if they miss something they've committed to.

Can you imagine "sorry I missed the conference, my manager told our EA to book me a hotel in the wrong place to teach me a lesson." At most you'd think the male was a bit lazy but you'd assume the manager was psychotic and wouldn't be keeping as far away from the whole organisation as possible.

Yes I assure you I won’t be putting someone else’s job at risk just to prove a point. I’ve ignored those silly posts

@TartyTara but it IS a feminist issue despite how much you protest. It is because these men are expecting women to pick up their slack through weaponised incompetence. It’s a modern iteration of what women have been expected to do for eons.