Male gaslighting at work

[JazzyBBBG]

Ok so I could have put this in AIBU but think may get more measured responses here and also want to see if you agree.

Colleague at work. I am head office think head of customer service type, he is branch based GM. We have to work together a lot due to an ongoing issue at that location. We get on well. So I thought. He presents as everyone's friend, easy going etc etc. often calls me just for a chat but drones on about all manner of things including personal things that to be honest I'm not interested in knowing often including how brilliant he is and isn't paid enough to be here etc.

More recently though he has started to make comments about my work and push back on central initiatives. But when he does it's very personal but delivered in his "I'm so nice I'm everyone's friend" vibe.

Bear in mind I am effectively senior albeit our roles sit in different structures . However in the last two weeks he has told me I need to be "nicer" to his team (I am nice to them but I also have to pull up on standards not being met and point out issues and whenever I do that it is met with defense.) saying I shouldn't be involved in some things that are on my job description! I was quite floored by this to be honest and probably didn't respond as robustly as I could have.

Since then when I put recommendations in being told "I've talked to the team we aren't going to do that for XYZ (insert random reason)" bear in mind again most of his team are very junior and not experienced in the wider issues of our industry. I'll reply explaining why this should be done and either be blanked or told I'm bullying them! Then potentially either a lengthy "let's be friends call" or a few days silence.

I feel like I'm being totally gaslighted and did to be honest lose my shit yesterday as I just find it so patronising. But the whole phone calls and messages I get as well it's just really weird.

No one senior would be particularly interested if I escalate it and he is perceived extremely positively due to this fake affable nature.I feel like there's an agenda here but I don't know what it is. Just male arrogance or something more I don't know. Any advice or views welcome. Thanks

I would forget the telephone calls, and put everything in writing.

I certainly wouldn't answer the phone to him again! Get absolutely everything in writing. He will throw you under the nearest bus, make no mistake.

Is he David Brent, and are you Jennifer?

He sounds really annoying. Are the ‘ongoing issues’ down to his management style?

Haha I never really watched the office so not sure. He's technically v good at his job but does have a massive ego where he thinks he's above what he's doing. However everyone else just thinks "oh it's Mark lovely Mark isn't he great" (Nb not his real name). Im not sure what I did to be on the receiving end of the phone calls.The issues are external impacts so not down to him.

As suggested you need to get everything in writing, so follow up phone calls with an email addressing the points made in the phone call.

Start a diary of his behaviour, all comments, snide remarks. Date/time/remarks/how it made you feel/evidence eg witness or email.

Start to challenge his remarks eg "I'm sorry to hear you think I'm bullying you Mark, could you be more specific so we can resolve this. In what way do your team feel bullied?"

"I understand (paraphrase), however it's my job to set deadlines for this project and it's the job of your team to meet those deadlines so I'm afraid I don't agree with the bullying accusation and it would be appreciated if you could stop making it.

Moving forward, I expect A,B and C to be completed when required or I'll be forced to escalate. I'm sure you understand that this has a knock on effect..."

Contact Acas and check your employment handbook for procedure because it sounds like he's bullying you.

Thank you @MiloMinderbinder925

I mean that sounds like normal office life. Everyone in a bigger organization must know personally or been told about someone like this.

I agree with having communication in writing. Possibly let someone else maybe your manager at least know how this person is acting and that it's impacting work.

No one senior would be particularly interested

Maybe not, maybe they will, but at least letting them means you have raised the issue and so covered yourself.

Agree with making sure things are in writing, even if it’s just follow up emails documenting phone calls.

And agree with raising it with your manager just so it’s covered if things really escalate. I might initially do it more in a “Mark seems to be struggling with some of the requirements. Keeps suggesting his team can’t cope and feel bullied by requests that everyone else is managing fine. Do you have any insight into why he’s having such a hard time?” sort of way (if you think that would go down well). Just to give them a hook for thinking of him as not the capable, affable GM he paints himself as. Then they’ll be more prepped if his insubordinate treatment of you continues and undermines you and you have to make a proper complaint.

When he criticizes you, would a short laugh and “That’s not really your call, is it?” Work? It’s hard to suggest what to say without knowing you both well and the tone and culture of the company. But practicing some lines you can use to indicate his “feedback” is out of place and you don’t accept it might help.

I experienced similar to this and it damaged my reputation, I still don’t know how I could have handled it. I did take it to our mutual boss who it turned out didn’t get it and was taken in my the man.

Start taking notes.

Follow up every phone all with an email.

Is your boss supportive? If so, start getting them onside now. I’d do it in an innocent way like you can’t quite fathom why he doesn’t grasp what you are saying, not a, ‘he’s a manipulative narcissist sort of way.’

He sounds like trouble. Watch your back if he is publicly popular.

I don't think this necessarily has anything to do with him being male and you being a female and it doesn't necessarily sound like gaslighting.

Having been in the position of the GM, it sounds as though he feels that he knows his shop/hotel (whatever it is), better than you do. Perhaps he and his team feel that they know what initiative's will work, and what won't. Sounds like you however believe that you know best. Compromise - go and listen to him and his team; you are far more likely to earn their respect and admiration that way.

Just to follow up... he's on leave this week and started whatsapping my personal phone with total unnecessary stuff nice as pie. Which is most odd after he was pretty vile the last day he was in the office.

No whatsapping on your personal phone. Just ignore him.

Everything in writing on work devices from now on.

It’s classic abuser behaviour. Reeling you back in after going too far.

This! Be unavailable for his personal bullshit calls and make excuses if confronted regarding why. The fact you are listening to his calls and personal stories has given him the very clear signal that you are a perfect victim to his narcissism. You must disengage fiercely.

I watched a great video today by Chase Hughes ref narcs in the workplace. Every single interaction has to be documented. Everything in an email - ' hey xyz , good to catch up today. You mentioned x,y,z issues with staff. I think it might be best going via HR on that one. Anything I can help with further ,let me know '. Copy in whoever needs to be copied in. He'll soon piss off and find another victim

Stop being friends with this prick. Yellow rock the fucker. Probably capable of more damage than you realise. Distance at all costs. Don't call him a gaslighter to anyone. You'll be painted as the problem.

No no no. Do not reply. Don't open them and leave them on unread! If he confronts you, you say oh I'm so hectic atm,I haven't had chance to breathe this week 🤷. I'd possibly change my number tbh. I feel strongly you are vulnerable here and he will fuck things badly for you.

You are not setting boundaries with this guy and he sees this a mile off. It will escalate if you don't nip this in the bud.

This sounds quite strange and a bit upsetting for you. I’d keep it written and work related. No replying to the personal WhatsApps. I’d also do some dashboards on metrics per team with his listed as ‘have said x y z means their team should continue etc.’ In very professional, objective language. Or sound out a colleague- you know the whatsit they are all supposed to do, mark says x y and z mean his team shouldn’t and I don’t see how that holds water. Is there any reasonable justification here, or do I have to shut it down?

professional professional professional. I am not sure I’d stop picking up the phone at work but I’d be fake friendly, and remind yourself that’s fine as that’s what he is doing.

@Pleaseshutthefuckup do you have a link for the video? Thanks

Change your settings on your phone so that he can't see whether you are online or not. He won't know whether you've read those messages. I hope you haven't replied to them but if you have then stop now! I agree with documenting absolutely everything and responding to phone calls with a follow-up email. It really is classic abuser territory.

I can't recall the particular video. I've been watching many videos about narcs and gaslighters ( have my own ), and lost track.

Search up Chase Hughes. Dr Ramani is also fantastic. They will both reference gaslighting at work. There are many people online advising ref tactics to handle these beastly people.

Do you think there's something in this OP? It is frustrating when you know your patch and team and someone else who doesn't applies a one size fits all solution across the area. Not saying this is the case and it's not appropriate how he's communicating it, but perhaps worth reflecting.

@Mirroar potentially, but that still doesn't stop it all feeling a bit creepy.

It's hard to say without knowing the situation but I did also wonder if he'd tell a similar story given that OP isn't his boss.

I do wonder if people are jumping to conclusions because he's a man - this is the feminism section after all and the mention of 'male gaslighting' brings with it certain connotations.

I think it might be viewed differently if we switched the sexes around....

Sarah is good at her job, well liked by the team, and seems to go out of her way to be nice and build a rapport with her colleagues. Derek, on the other hand, is prone to 'losing his shit' at work and seems to have concluded that Sarah is waging covert psychological warfare against him ever since she refused to defer to his advice on how to manage her team.

He is now making disparaging remarks about 'female gaslighting', calling Sarah 'fake' and stating that her team are all 'junior' and should listen to him instead. All this while acknowledging that she and her team know their patch/customers well and might not benefit from a 'one size fits all' approach and that it's unlikely his boss would side with him on this.