Bad men and good. Debrief.

[mauvish]

Here for a debrief.

I travelled on a train this afternoon. I got to my seat to find a large young man (rather Hagrid-like in appearance) sprawled with his bag across it and the one next to it. "Scuse please!" I said, indicating his bag. I think I gave him a polite smile; I would normally do so as a smile usually works, so I presume this was no different.

He glared, moved his bag then almost as an afterthought said "You could be more polite".
Me (confused): "Sorry?"
Hagrid: "You could be more polite when you ask".
Me, still confused: "I said excuse me"
Hagrid: "Ah but you didn't did you"
Me: "I did, I said scuse please. What exactly did you want me to say?"
Hagrid: "You should have said "Excuse me". You just said "scuse".

Other surrounding passengers start to ask what's wrong so I said to them, "He thinks I'm not polite because I said "scuse please". Apparently I should have said "Excuse me".

Hagrid starts getting very pissy as the surrounding passengers start laughing about this, and I try (and fail) to say something clever along the lines of him being a linguistic expert.

Hagrid, standing up: "Tell you what. I'll move, shall I?"
Me: "OK"
Hagrid "Fuck off"
Me, as the seat becomes available, "Excellent" (quite quietly and still in the polite tone I've used throughout).
Hagrid, as he starts to move away. "and you're a CUNT!"

Older man (maybe about 40?) sitting behind Hagrid interjects, takes off his headphones and loudly and VERY firmly tells Hagrid not to speak like that, it's disgusting, he should never speak to anyone like that.

Hagrid flips him the finger and moves down the carrraige. (Exit, pursued by a bear, maybe). The surrounding passengers all congratulate me on remaining calm, say how horrible Hagrid is; I heap praise onto Mr Nice Guy who goes bright red.

I am so glad that Hagrid did move, it would have been awful to have had to sit next to him for the following hour. But I worried all the way home that he would get off at "my" station, see me and give me grief; I was rehearsing how I would react if that happened. I'm an older woman, not big; he could have been physically very threatening.

And that is the power that these men have, without laying a finger on us; to get inside our heads and make us worry for our safety.

I'm thankful that I didn't see him at my home station. And I'm also very grateful to the man who spoke out loudly in my defence (and to the other men and women who formed the Greek chorus of support behind him). We need more like him, and I thanked him again before I got off the train.

Thank you for reading. I feel a bit better now.

I really sorry you had this to deal with...it can be really intimidating when a man takes this tact.

I'm in my 50's and have absolutely no fucks left to give, so I'm not scared to speak my mind and say it how it is....male or female, but like you believe staying calm and polite works better.

I feel angry and shaky at just the thought of that interaction op. What an absolute wanker. Thank God you’re ok.

He has probably gone on with his day and not given it a second thought. This is what angers me. The quiet fear it induces in women when men throw their physical or verbal weight around. They have no idea. Or maybe they do.

I’m glad people laughed at him though. That public ridicule must have stung. Good. ‘Men fear women will laugh at them, women fear men will kill them.’

It was clearly an attempt to bully and belittle me.

I will NOT be bullied nor belittled by a Hagrid! And thankfully the GBP who were there on the train, agreed!

Well done, OP.

Well done, Mauvish. I would have wanted to respond calmly like you did, but I doubt I would have been able to keep it together as he escalated. My body has experienced male violence and I tend to freeze, even though I would prefer to squash idiots like that with a cutting remark.

You did brilliantly. And cheers to the older man and everyone else who backed you up. Solidarity is power!

And yes, laughter is the best weapon xx

Well done Mauvish.

YOU were rude to him. "scuse me" is rude.

Well done @mauvish I wouldn't have had your ovaries of steel to deal with that twunt. And I'm so glad you had support, that makes all the difference.

I was swimming up and down a single lane at the pool.
All the other lanes are empty.
A man starts swimming towards me and asks if I am swimming in this lane.
I say yes. He tells me to eff off.
I tell him in no uncertain terms what I think of this.
He tells me to piss off. I again tell him exactly what I think of this.
He goes away. He tried to intimidate the wrong person. I am sick of these types.

Scuse PLEASE. I'm a big believer in saying please and thank you.

Since "Scuse" is just an abbreviation of "excuse", could you (please) explain what you feel is rude about this?

If Scuse is rude, how rude (on a scale of 1-10)? Where on that same scale do fuck, cunt, bullying strangers and hogging two seats on a busy train fit in?

Oh give over. His bag was on her allocated seat. ‘Scuse me’ is a perfectly British (minimal interaction) way of saying move your bag on a train. The man ended up verbally abusing her and called her a cunt. You’re really saying she’s at fault here? You’re wrong.

I don’t agree that it’s rude.

It’s also out of order to sit your bag on an empty seat on a presumably busy train. Clear sign you don’t want someone to sit there and is a dick move.

Agree with you OP it’s so easy for them to intimidate us. I’ve noticed since I got a sweet new car that male drivers cut me up more, shout and gesture more. Didn’t happen in my battered old tank of a car!

"'Scuse me" is a normal way for many people to say "Excuse me". It's a little less formal than "excuse me" in most places (though for plenty of people it's the only way they say it) and often associated with working class dialects. But it's not rude.

Why yes! The OP saying “scuse please” (not “scuse me”, btw) is rude. The young man sprawling across 2 seats, then telling OP to fuck off and calling her a cunt is just ordinary, polite discourse.

I don't believe a word of this story.

Hagrid would never speak to someone like that.

And on today's episode of things that definitely didn't happen . . .

Yeah you're so right. Abbreviating "excuse me" to "scuse please" is SO RUDE and definitely deserving of being called a cunt.

Give your head a wobble.

Scuse is more informal and friendly I think. Not that you should have to even ask someone to remove their bag from your seat. Another ploy - they often plank a large bag on the table for good measure. Women can be as bad in this regard , if less intimidating. I'm glad the nice guy was backed up too. That needs to happen more often.

Another one adding that "scuse please" is slightly informal and not uber polite, but is most definitely not rude! I wouldn't use it to elderly people on a train as it feels a little lacking in respect but I'd definitely use it to someone my own age (40s) or younger.

And tbh someone sprawling over 2 seats is already being rude and inconsiderate without even opening his mouth so isn't deserving of full respect in the way he's addressed.

Scuse me said with a smile (exactly what I'd do here) is pitched perfectly, and anyone who reacts as he did is clearly spoiling for a fight.

Whether what you said to him or the way you said it came across as rude or not, it doesn’t matter. His reaction was unacceptably difficult, aggressive and disrespectful. As you say, he was much bigger and younger than you, so verbal abuse can feel very intimidating.

And that’s why men should be respectful, polite and calm to women, especially if they’re particularly big and/or strong. A man can generally overpower a woman, physically, and women have to be mindful of that.

You’re presenting this as a one-sided situation, but your own description suggests you weren’t entirely neutral in how it unfolded.

Calling him “Hagrid,” even if just for the post, signals a level of mockery from the outset. Then trying to make a “clever” comment about his language—especially in a carriage where others start laughing—comes across as public needling rather than de-escalation. Most people won’t take well to being made the butt of a joke in front of others.

The “Excellent” at the end also reads less like relief and more like a small victory lap, which reinforces the impression that this wasn’t purely about feeling unsafe, but also about scoring a point.

None of that excuses him telling you to “fuck off”—that’s clearly out of line. But it does suggest this wasn’t entirely passive on your part either. You engaged, added sarcasm, and contributed to the situation becoming adversarial.

There’s also a practical point: if you genuinely felt at risk, engaging like that isn’t the smartest move. It can escalate things unpredictably, especially in a confined public space. Disengaging would usually be the safer option.

And more broadly, you don’t know what someone else might be dealing with. That doesn’t justify bad behaviour, but it is a reason to avoid mocking or escalating things where possible.

A more direct reading would be: you didn’t just find yourself in a bad situation—you played an active role in shaping it. The sarcastic comment, the crowd dynamic, and the closing remark all point to you instigating and fuelling the interaction rather than trying to defuse it.