Angry with patriarchal family - and it's the other women who perpetuate it...

[Onemoretimeround]

I woke up feeling so angry today. I'm 45, live with a partner, chosen not to get married, don't have kids, have a good career, we share bills and household chores - for background. Also come from a family where all the men were boarding school educated, no other women work, women 'can't be good mums' if they work, etc. I have one brother who's never happy with his lot despite being loaded and having a wife who does everything for him. All blame seems placed on the women. My mum died 15 years ago. She was the only woman in the family not in the patriarchal mindset. My sister in law chose to tell me she thought my mother was self-centred last week because 'she did what she wanted' - mum was an incredibly kind, giving person and a great mum (who left my dad, and lived on her own from 40 to when she died at 64). I was furious. I wrote this message to my sister in law earlier.

I am just do done, and so angry, and don't know how to deal with them all anymore...I want to scream!

Advice welcome.

My message - I wasn't ok about the 'self-centred' comment. Please don't say that to me again as it's been said a few times. I would never say what I think of your parents to you. I am just so over the family's judgement of women, and women upholding patriarchal conditioning. I see it in others, with all the little comments about XX not being a good mum because she kept working a bit, or a good wife because she's not nudging XX to sort family plans (poor XX, that's just what he's like so it's not his problem), or her niece being 'selfish' for being a firefighter which is a role 'women shouldn't do'. Dad saying women shouldn't be allowed to play football. My brother getting away with ignoring stuff or being moody, with no judgement. I never hear these comments about men, or anything like the same judgement. XX being condescending and off with me for not stepping in more to care for dad, but he'd never be like that with my brother. All dad's comments to me that I shouldn't have an opinion when I was growing up, and not being a 'good enough girl' etc etc. I have hit midlife and I am pretty furious about it all.

@ThatTealViewer it's just the men are the ones who tend to sit there in silence, getting away with everything, while the women spout the stuff judging other women. So I hear it mostly from women, not the men. On the other hand the friends I choose are the ones who are anti-patriarchy, so they never come out with any of this. But I take your point that perhaps I have internalised some of it, and important to check that as I think it's hard not to when you've heard it all your life. They didn’t create the patriarchy, they’re victims of its brainwashing in a way but that doesn’t make it any easier.

I hate visiting families like that. The women including guests are expected to congregate in the kitchen and wait on the men who are all sitting talking in the living room or garden.
I dont go any more. I cant stand it.

OP, it's not only frustrating for you, it's about a woman you loved and admired who has since passed. It's insensitive as well as the rest. The letter was great to help you get it off your chest. I think it's right to have deleted it.

In these situations where something has been said and I was off guard so didn't respond, I just think of how I would assertively yet succinctly challenge anything like it next time. Just prepping in your mind can be very cathartic and you'll feel confident going into any future engagement with them.

That's a really interesting one. I've been thinking about this a lot. In my family, it is the women, in fact mostly my mother, who perpetuate a 'men first' narrative. Men are idealised, can do no wrong etc Anything that does go wrong is the fault of the women -- selfish if they choose to remain child free, if they work too much. If you dare to disagree and you are a certain age you 'need HRT' If you are not a certain age, you are 'troubled' or 'difficult' My pretty cousin was described as looking 'too available.'

It's a weird one because although the men benefit from it, they are not the ones driving the misogyny as far as I can see. They are sort of passive beneficiaries of it. It's weird.

It takes a lot of unpicking when you have lived with it for so long so I admire you for beginning that. But there is no way anyone in my family would change or start to see things differently. I hope yours do.

@AlexanderArnold THIS!! So much this. I have to accept nothing will change and make peace with it all, by getting it out here and not at those who are either victims of it themselves or men who benefit. It's so hard though when you suddenly see it all and just have had enough. It's ALWAYS the women who are at fault. Argh.

In your shoes I would be very angry about the comment about my mother. Very angry indeed. Interesting as I relate to the sun shines out of my brothers arse!

I'm lucky and grateful that the education I had taught me to think independently and I'm very confident in expressing opinions and beliefs. I call out shit that crosses my values.

I also just feel a bit sorry for people who are small minded. I don't know. I try to see it from their point of view and understand the nuances. But me and my best girlfriend discuss how it's a generational thing. She somehow manages to turn things into 'but they care about your welfare' and I think she is herself somewhat blinkered.
Small minded attitudes just make me feel more grateful and not take freedoms for granted.

Not sure what the lesson is there, rise above it, I guess.

It's exhausting and depressing once you notice it. And the women who do things differently, like your Mum (or on my case my aunt and one sister in law) just get all the criticism heaped on them by the other women. The men don't need to say anything, it's all done for them.

I think it's good your wrote a positive message about your feelings for your mum and your experience of her. Maybe that's the way to start changing the narrative, bit by bit.

If you have come across anything written about this please let me know as I would love to think it all through a bit more, maybe how it plays out on the level of wider society as well.

So did SIL have any response to your amended text?
She sounds like quite a piece of work. The nerve of her, putting your late mother down like that.
I'd be as low contact with her as possible if I was in your shoes.

I’m pleased you spoke your mind @Onemoretimeround. As I said before, I’m sorry for your loss. It’s funny that your family considers “feminist” an insult or criticism. You should take it as high praise indeed. It proves that you and your mum have broken the mold and evolved. They can stick to the antiquated, outdated patterns and be miserable and lonely, wondering why the world doesn’t work they way they think it “should”. I’m be try proud of you and your mum for breaking free.

it's just the men are the ones who tend to sit there in silence, getting away with everything, while the women spout the stuff judging other women.

it’s difficult to work out who you are angry at. It’s ok for women to speak up and say things other people don’t like, and it’s ok for men not to want to get involved in family drama

I absolutely get your anger. I would be beyond furious at that comment about your mother.

Now that you've deleted your original message (she might have viewed some on her lock screen, but that's isn't always all of it) I would write something much more succinct. Something like:

"How dare you make such an offensive remark about my mother. She was worth far more than any of you will ever be. I'm done with the misogyny of this family and people like you!"

More punchy and direct, not so long that she might just view it as verbal diarrhoea (sorry) and not even bother to read it.