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Feminism: chat

Rape Convictions

57 replies

InAMess2023 · 22/12/2023 08:38

Apologies for the heavy thread so close to Christmas. This has been weighing heavily on my mind, not sure what I'm even asking for but sick of feeling utterly powerless.

I'm currently receiving therapy after an abusive relationship which included rape, it ended a long time ago but I'd never really processed those feelings. Plus I didn't even appreciate that's what was happening as a) he was my partner, and b) it was more just allowing him to do what he wanted to me because the alternative (physical hurt) wasn't worth it.

But then you learn that only 1% of rape cases end in prosecution - you pretty much need a witness or confession! I never thought about it until it was brought up in my therapy group that any member of the public can sit on a jury and bring in their preconceptions. There's a famous case I've followed closely and almost every comment from men implies that it's false allegations, the woman is a gold digger, she deserved it due to what she was wearing/past history, women lie all the time etc etc etc. just this morning someone responded to me calling me a 'slag' - just for disagreeing with female abuse.

Question is what the hell can be done about it?! Apparently there is a petition to get any jury members in this type of case to undertake 'rape myth' training but I doubt it will do much good. I know I'll never get justice for myself but I just feel so powerless that so many others never will either! I'd love to be able to actively do something about this but I'm at a total loss...

Thanks for reading if you got this far and Merry Christmas!

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InAMess2023 · 15/01/2024 18:13

I really don't know how to word this properly as I really don't want to cause any sort of offence but surely with male on male rapes there would be more physical evidence...?

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SapatSea · 18/01/2024 10:14

This article written by a barrister who takes on rape cases is very interesting. He claims that younger colleagues don't want to deal with them, they are complex, time consuming and have a low rate of success and are "not fun" like the drugs and armed robbery criminal cases. It also explores the problems with remote victim witness statements and the crumbling state of our courthouses and system where barristers are leaving criminal law in droves, the years long delays in prosecuting cases but being expected to remember everything in minute detail and how difficult it can be to schedule and retain your time slot for a trail. He recalls hearing jurors laughing in an adjoining room when they were deliberating on a gang rape trial. It makes depressing reading. He also discusses the "he said, she said" nature of the evidence and discusses two rape trials he was recently involved with.

He thinks that we need to find out more about how jurors come to their decision and would like a structured debrief of jurors after cases. He also wonders if an issue is that in a criminal case the victim is just a witness and doesn't have her own lawyer (just the DPS appointed one for the crown) often the victim hasn't even met the barrister prosecuting her case.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/jan/17/the-inside-story-of-two-trials-its-as-bad-as-ive-ever-known-it

The inside story of two rape trials: ‘It’s as bad as I’ve ever known it’

In sexual assault cases, the work of prosecution barristers is complex, poorly paid – and essential. With conviction rates extraordinarily low and barristers quitting criminal practice in droves, the Guardian shadowed one prosecutor for two years

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/jan/17/the-inside-story-of-two-trials-its-as-bad-as-ive-ever-known-it

SapatSea · 18/01/2024 10:31

InAMess2023 · 05/01/2024 19:21

@Usernamen I think the only time I've heard it be proved is if there were messages eg someone saying they didn't want it and the other apologising, saying I know, etc. (or in my case well if you don't do it with me I'll find someone else and you know it)

In terms of emotional abuse/coercive control that wasn't a crime when I was in that situation but if the evidence on my phone would have been enough to prove it in that case. Easier to prove than rape definitely

The article talks about just such a case where the man rapes his partner after she has said "no" and there are follow up texts between them. Sadly, in this case the crown lost the case. The man states in his examination that no one in the room has been inside the relationship they had between them. In the texts he doesn;t admit to rape but more an apology if he hurt her. The misreading of signals defence wins yet again.

AdamRyan · 18/01/2024 11:48

That's a brilliant article sapat
Really shows what women are up against when men can be found "not guilty" on the reasonable belief clause for this:
"The case rests on a question of consent. The defence will argue that even though she said no – this is not denied – the way she rolled on to her front was understood as a yes."

InAMess2023 · 18/01/2024 12:06

In my support group we've been repeatedly told that just because you didn't say no, doesn't mean you said yes. But how on earth could this ever be proved? I'm sure many women like myself who had this repeatedly happen within an abusive relationship would have gotten to the point where it was easier to just let them do what they wanted instead of face the emotional and often physical pain you risk for yourself if you anger them further by trying to say no...

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AdamRyan · 18/01/2024 17:40

InAMess2023 · 18/01/2024 12:06

In my support group we've been repeatedly told that just because you didn't say no, doesn't mean you said yes. But how on earth could this ever be proved? I'm sure many women like myself who had this repeatedly happen within an abusive relationship would have gotten to the point where it was easier to just let them do what they wanted instead of face the emotional and often physical pain you risk for yourself if you anger them further by trying to say no...

The only thing that helps me about those kind of thoughts is trying to keep hold of the idea that life is all about perspectives, and in your life your perspective rules. You were raped. You know you were. That's all that counts. Be kind to yourself. You don't need a guilty verdict to validate your experience Flowers

InAMess2023 · 18/01/2024 17:58

Thank you @AdamRyan. Because of the circumstances I didn't even see it as that for a long time, hence me only accessing support years later. I know he's still out there and hasn't changed so I can only hope one day he will face what he deserves and I can finally get some sort of closure and justice.

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