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Feminism: sex and gender

Original poster

D of E expedition: mixed sex groups

72 replies

trytopullyoursocksup · 12/02/2023 07:48

Is this the norm now?
My 13 year old says they have been "given" their groups. Hers includes 2 other girls, a boy she is friends with and a boy she doesn't particularly seem to know well (she has never talked about him before).
I feel weird about this. is there anything I can do? A million years ago, my friends who did D of E (I didn't) were all at a girls school and went with other girls - but I also seem to remember that they chose their groups among themselves. Which is may be irrelevant.
I don't really expect anything bad to happen. But if it was a party or a social event, I would be saying no mixed sex sleepovers. I am not happy about that line being weakened and I don't know what to do
thoughts please?

OP posts:
RoseThornside · 12/02/2023 08:50

Yes, mixed sex groups for the walking, single sex tents at night. When your dd says she's been given her group, she means for the walking.

Oakbeam · 12/02/2023 08:54

I did DofE way back in the 90s and it was mixed sex groups

I did it in the 70s and we did have one expedition where we mixed at the campsites but walked separately. If I remember correctly, the boys’ expedition was longer than the girls’ then so not really compatible.

Parisj · 12/02/2023 09:12

As an aside, my very active sporty dd was in a mixed sex group for gold. They chose an ambitious route. She and the other girl really struggled, she said. The boys at 17, and all into various mountain sports, were just so much faster and stronger due to being male. However they recognised that and worked as a team. Obviously on DofE someone is always going to be struggling, and my dd probably learnt something about sex differences and about her own resilience. I think it's probably less of an issue at the younger age for bronze and silver but I don't know as she had single sex groups for those and they weren't all hardcore sporty types like Gold.

sunshineandshowers40 · 12/02/2023 09:18

When I did DofE in the mid 90's I was in a mixed group although we chose our own group and were all friends. We walked together but we slept in different tents. Was good fun.

bigbabycooker · 12/02/2023 11:06

I think mixed sex groupings are a positive if not sleeping in same tent.
For bronze, everyone is basically on the same site at night with teachers. I think it is really nice to have activities where boys and girls can cooperate - surely, this is a type of thing that, correctly done, helps boys see girls as "people" and potential friends?

tillyoumakeit · 12/02/2023 11:23

bigbabycooker · 12/02/2023 11:06

I think mixed sex groupings are a positive if not sleeping in same tent.
For bronze, everyone is basically on the same site at night with teachers. I think it is really nice to have activities where boys and girls can cooperate - surely, this is a type of thing that, correctly done, helps boys see girls as "people" and potential friends?

And indeed vice versa...!!

sevenbyseven · 12/02/2023 11:27

Same at my daughter's school - mixed walking, singe sex tents.

Oblomov23 · 12/02/2023 11:28

What exactly do you feel weird about? Having mixed groups for walking is often ideal. The sleeping tent will be single sex. I can't grasp the concern.

ByTheGrace · 12/02/2023 11:35

DD's group was single sex, it wasnt initially, but the boys dropped out. I'm a bit surprised at the comments about sharing the camp site with teachers, our groups had to sort out the campsite booking and there were no teachers at the site. I thought that was the point?
They fell out horribly, DD said silver was never going to be an option!

Oakbeam · 12/02/2023 11:47

our groups had to sort out the campsite booking and there were no teachers at the site

Same here, although we didn’t didn’t use camp sites as such. We had to write in advance to landowners and ask permission to camp on their land.

CakeCrumbs44 · 12/02/2023 11:51

We had mixed sex groups when I did D of E, about 18 years ago. We didn't share tents just walked in a group together (although some of the girls did try to sneak into the boys tents and the teachers stopped them!)

Original poster
trytopullyoursocksup · 12/02/2023 12:24

ok thanks, this all sounds more supervised than I thought (at night) and yes probably a non issue. My dd socialises with boys often, and walking with boys I would expect. Single sex tents as a norm I would also have expected but I didn't know what "group" means. I think some admin has gone missing and I need to hunt it down and then I would more fully understand the whole thing. Thanks everyone

OP posts:
ByTheGrace · 12/02/2023 13:22

Oakbeam · 12/02/2023 11:47

our groups had to sort out the campsite booking and there were no teachers at the site

Same here, although we didn’t didn’t use camp sites as such. We had to write in advance to landowners and ask permission to camp on their land.

I thought that was the whole idea tbh. Their teacher did meet up with them at way points just to check they were all healthy, but that was it!
We live rurally, but there are lots of small farm campsites, so they had no issues there.

RedAndBlueStripedGolfingUmbrella · 13/02/2023 15:19

They were mixed sex groups when I did my D of E expedition in the early 90s.
Didn't think anything of it, had a great time.

maddy68 · 13/02/2023 15:28

I have run Dof E trips for years. They are mixed. Always have been. Why do you think that's an issue? They usually have one man tents to carry sometimes two man. Then they go in single sex tents.

What are you worried about?

maddy68 · 13/02/2023 15:30

ByTheGrace · 12/02/2023 13:22

I thought that was the whole idea tbh. Their teacher did meet up with them at way points just to check they were all healthy, but that was it!
We live rurally, but there are lots of small farm campsites, so they had no issues there.

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There are always teachers on site

ByTheGrace · 13/02/2023 17:14

maddy68 · 13/02/2023 15:30

There are always teachers on site

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Certainly not in our case. In fact I've never heard of teachers camping with the students (or even being on site).

MrWhippersnapper · 13/02/2023 17:46

I do Bronze and Silver, teachers are always on site

Talipesmum · 13/02/2023 17:48

My son did bronze last year with school and is doing silver this year and there were teachers camping on site with them, bless their tired volunteer hearts!

Talipesmum · 13/02/2023 17:50

Bit disingenuous for people to ask “what could you possibly be worried about” when the OP is asking about mixed sex mass camping in a field, possibly unsupervised (as far as she knows). As I said, ours was supervised.

MrWhippersnapper · 13/02/2023 17:57

They will be supervised, the DofE website has staff ratios.

bigbabycooker · 13/02/2023 18:54

@tillyoumakeit

Yes, sorry and vice versa!

GiraffeLaSophie · 13/02/2023 19:06

ByTheGrace · 13/02/2023 17:14

Certainly not in our case. In fact I've never heard of teachers camping with the students (or even being on site).

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I think leaving a load of 13 and 14 year olds in a campsite alone overnight is a pretty big safeguarding issue.

How long ago did your daughter do DofE?

MrWhippersnapper · 13/02/2023 19:16

Staff have to stay with them unless it’s Gold and they’re over 18

toomuchlaundry · 13/02/2023 19:24

For those of you in the South West you may have heard of Ten Tors, where youngsters do 2 days of hiking on Dartmoor. Have mixed groups and if necessary mixed tents. No adults walk with them and higher age groups have to camp away from supervised areas