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Feminism: chat

Abusive messages and looking the other way

19 replies

Blueelephantsw · 04/04/2022 01:32

NC as potentially outting and apologies may be quite long.

My DH is still in contact with his school friends. We live all over the country but meet up for weddings and christenings and pre covid maybe another once a year.

Until fairly recently, DH and I lived England and reasonably close to a couple of the friends. I only ever saw the friends at group events except for one Max. We were both keen horse riders growing up and on a handful of occasions, we went to horse racing events together, just us, I think DH maybe came once but he isn't that interested so was pleased I had someone to go with.

DH and I started spending more time with family who live else where in the UK during covid and have since moved so we have rarely seen Max since covid began if at all and we don't keep in regular touch.

A few months prior to covid kicking off, Max came out as gay. Since then, he has started making new friends and has had a couple of medium term partners, one of whom lived with him for a few months. Whilst we haven't seen Max during this period, it's clear from his social media that he has changed a lot and his political views in particular now strongly oppose mine and DH. Max made a few choice remarks in the WhatsApp about DH and my political views during covid which was surprising but dh accepted them as 'banter' . Many of DH friends have different political views, it's no problem to us. Most of his friends are not really into politics so it's not a topic thats really discussed but as a member of my family is an MP and my family regularly support this person, people are well aware of my persuasion. Before meeting me, DH wasn't particularly involved with politics whereas now, we share many views and he has attended events with the MP family member. Its not something we really speak about with others though, because who needs the hassle of divisive topics, particularly when amongst friends you rarely see.

Last summer, DH and I were visiting family abroad when out of nowhere, Max started sending messages to my DH via their school friends WhatsApp group about what a terrible person DH is. He said that DH has been brainwashed by me and is a different person as well as a load of nasty messages including that he never wants to see either of us again and he hopes I die.

Not long after, a friend was having a small engagement meal. Max was going and it was going to be a small group. We spoke to the engaged couple about the Max situation and we said we didn't feel that comfortable but also, due to flight times, we also would have needed two nights in a hotel which seemed excessive so we sent apologies. 9months has passed since then and in that time, there has been no reason for DH or I to need to see Max.

On Friday evening, we attending a christening with a meal and dance in the evening to celebrate. Max was attending but as it was a large group, we didn't think much of it. For the christening in the morning, I didn't actually see Max at all and at the celebration in the evening we were at different tables for the meal and there was enough people there so DH and I were able to avoid him without actively avoiding him. After the meal, there was one instance when I was having a photo taken and he came over to speak to some of the people I was with. Without any fuss, I quietly sloped off.

Later, at the dance, he came over to my DH and gave him a hug from behind and tried to pull me in saying 'blue elephant it is wonderful to see you'. I stepped away from the hug and said Max, I saw what you wrote about me, how can you say that yet also say you want me to die. Max walked off.

Later on, DH and I were leaving to head to our hotel as we had an early morning flight home. On the way out, one of DH friends who is probably Max's closest friend, was smoking a cigar outside said what's happened between us and Max, Max had told him that I had said some terrible things to him when he was just trying to chat. Quite bemused, I told him that's not what happened and I had simply repeated some of the things that he had said about me in confusion as to how that marries with him being thrilled to see me. The friend was quite confused, he said his loyalty was with Max but he was sorry that this happened. DH and I had a taxi waiting and said we had to go but it was a lovely day and night and great to see him.

In the morning, DH woke up to the group WhatsApp again filled with vile messages about DH and I but particularly aimed at me. The messages are truly awful.

None of DH friends have called out Max behaviour this time nor last time. DH spoke to one friend about it and he said to DH that he agreed it was wrong but everyone had a lot going on in their own lives and don't want to get involved and just to ignore it.

On the one hand, that's fine. Going forwards, I will just avoid Max completely at all future events. However, the reaction of the others is quite upsetting. At work, we are constantly told, if you come across anyone being talked down to in any way, you should speak up, as part of diversity and inclusion. If you don't speak up then you are condoning the behaviour and complicit. These other friends wouldnt want their own wives spoken to like this. They have seen the level of abusive messages that were levied at dh and I but mainly I, and they are happy to accept that.

AIBU to not want to attend any events hosted by any one of them nor have them in our home any time in the future? Happy for dh to attend events but I don't think I want to spend any time with people who accept someone being treated like this.

Max has always been a class clown type character. I believe if it was anyone else in the group speaking to a women the way he has written about me, people would be horrified, but he gets away with it.

Wwyd?

OP posts:
Xiaoxiong · 04/04/2022 02:02

I think you leave the WhatsApp and don't bother with any of them. If they can stand by and see those messages and not even send you a message privately to check on you, then they probably agree with Max or don't care enough about you to put themselves out. And why would you want to associate with people like that's

I know you probably want to "clear your name" but I think a dignified exit is better than any attempt at getting them to see your side of the story.

SheldonesqueTheBstard · 04/04/2022 02:12

I would not bother with them either.

It is fine having a difference of opinion or political leaning - not at all fine to send horrible messages.

Not wanting to get involved is understandable to some level I suppose but it isn’t something i could ignore - more so when this Max is bang out of order.

They just don’t sound like friends. They are certainly not acting like it.

user1477249785 · 04/04/2022 02:13

Actually I disagree with the poster above. That makes it too easy for the bystanders. I'd personally reply on the group chat with something non aggressive but that basically said you were disappointed to read the messages and disappointed that others were prepared to remain silent in the face of it.

Sounds awful op. I'm really sorry

Earlydancing · 04/04/2022 02:20

Is this all because Max doesn't agree with your relative's politics? That's mad. I can see why you wouldn't want to have anything to do with any of them. I wouldn't either. Perfectly reasonable to not want to socialise with them. I understand people not wanting to make a big thing out of it but true friends wouldn't stand back while you were being abused. Even if they didn't chastise Max online, I'd expect them to reach out to you privately. And if they don't, are they really friends? They don't seem like much of a loss.

And I agree with the above poster, I think I'd say something politely on the group as well to express your sadness and disappointment.

LadyOfTheCanyon · 04/04/2022 08:52

I agree that you should say something but I also think your husband should say something - they are his school friends after all.

If the situation was reversed I certainly wouldn't stay silent while one of my friends harangued my husband publicly and everyone else stayed silent. Nor would I expect him to just slide out of the group silently.

Max sounds vile, and possibly a bit unhinged/ jealous of your DH. Does he have a crush on him?

oliviastwisted · 04/04/2022 09:00

OP the group will likely not get involved in this as you are finding. I think the best thing your DH can do is pull his closest friend aside and show the messages to him and take it from there but still I don’t think much will happen.

It is absolutely shit. I’ve been there within a family situation where there is abuse and everyone just says nothing and leaves you to handle the abuse alone. It is one of those dreadful sides of human nature and group dynamics.

oliviastwisted · 04/04/2022 09:03

Oh my God I just realised he actually did this on the group what’s app. I’d definitely leave that what’s app group they are awful people going along with that.

Blueelephantsw · 04/04/2022 09:33

To clarify, I am not in the WhatsApp group, none of the wives are. It’s just DH and the school friends but my DH has shown me the messages and his replies. He has really stuck up for me which means a lot.

DH’s oldest friend did message him privately and told him to ignore Max and that he does this sometimes after a few drinks. When DH said he was disappointed that no one had stepped in, he made a load of excuses for himself and a few others having a lot on in their lives and not wanting to be drawn in. I don’t think it takes much to send a message but the argument doesn’t stand because some of the reasons were not around last summer when the situation originally happened. If people felt compelled to say something they would imo so they just don’t.

Yes, the original messages sited my political persuasion and DH getting on board with it as his main reason for hating us. The messages on Friday didn’t mention the politics just strong insults aimed at me.

I don’t think it’s fair for me to say to DH that he has to cut himself off from the rest of the group. Whilst Max is always present at big events, DH doesn’t keep in direct contact and wouldn’t have any reason to meet up with him individually. There are a few from the group that are DH’s longest friends and the one I mention above is probably his closest. He was best man at our wedding. They would likely come and visit DH a couple of times a year going forwards because the place we have moved to is close to the sea and DH friends enjoy sailing. It has been loosely mentioned since we announced we were moving that they would all be keen to do this. I am completely fine with DH doing this. He has moved his life hundreds of miles across the UK for me and I don’t want to insist he cuts off his friends. He doesn’t have many friends here yet as he works away a lot. However, Aibu to say they can come and go sailing but they can’t come to our house or stay here as part of their trip? I also feel bad il be leaving DH to attend future events himself especially when he has done his best to stick up for me.

It’s just such a shame, we didn’t see these people much anyway but Max has ruined it all. I really don’t understand where it came from, out of all DH friends, he is the only one I’d met up with separately and at one point would have considered him a friend of mine too, not just DH friend.

I don’t think he fancies my DH. I think he is angry that we have not just rolled over and forgotten his behaviour. Being the class clown type he is usually met with ‘oh that’s just max the jolly idiot’ type responses.

OP posts:
oliviastwisted · 04/04/2022 10:11

You seem to be a very strong person Blue for what it is worth I agree entirely with your assessment of the situation and I think you are right to support your husband maintaining his friendships. I also understand your hurt too.

Max’s behaviour has nothing to do with politics or you it has to do about how he feels about himself. He is obviously in a shit place and he is taking that out on your husband and you. I mean as you said upthread who cares about other people’s politics really. If you get on with someone it is just one of those topics avoided and moved past. Politics only gets in the way of people choose to let it.

I suspect over time if friends do join you they will tell you that they do not support Maxs behaviour towards you in any way.

They may feel that they do know that he has good qualities too and they are focusing on trying to be friends with him when he is at his worst in the hope that he gets past this period in his life but it is equally also possible that he will end up being a twat to some of them too.

Blueelephantsw · 04/04/2022 10:37

Thanks @oliviatwisted I completely agree..

I got on well with many of the friends wives and I’m sorry that I won’t see much of them again, if I decide to ban them all from staying with DH and I but I just can’t get over people standing by and watching someone receive such unwarranted vitriol.

OP posts:
Brefugee · 04/04/2022 14:00

gosh how awful. I would ask your DH to put a message in the group that he doesn't appreciate Max attacking you and that it isn't in the spirit of friendship.
Then he should leave the group (if he wants) but he most definitely needs to make a comment, otherwise his silence adds to the silence of the others in not calling Max out on or even acknowledging the comments.

If your DH has private contact with the others he might like to ask them what they'd so if it was their partner max had attacked and if they'd appreciate him ignoring it.

AtrociousCircumstance · 04/04/2022 14:04

Max is obviously behaving horrendously and your DH’s friends are being weak.

However I am interested in the political differences, for eg if your political stance could be interpreted as homophobic? That’s the only thing that springs to mind.

Blueelephantsw · 04/04/2022 14:28

I wouldn't have thought so. Long before Max came out as gay I had attended a party/dinner he had hosted for the friends and their wives. The date coincided with me having a friend to stay so with permission, I brought my friend - who is gay. I don't have a huge group of friends as I have moved around a lot but three of my small circle of closest friends are gay, now I think about it and 5 if I include two of them having long term partners who I like just as much, so I would be astounded if anyone would consider me homophobic. Max came to a large dinner party DH and I hosted a while ago and these friends all attended. Whether they spoke, I have no idea. Like everyone iv made a few stupid comments in my time without thinking and without meaning anything bad but I really don't think iv ever made any kind of homophobic remark.

OP posts:
AtrociousCircumstance · 04/04/2022 20:01

Am just curious what your politics actually are? For eg if you were v right wing and supported a politician who is known to say things against gay marriage?

AtrociousCircumstance · 04/04/2022 20:01

I do acknowledge that you say you aren’t homophobic and have gay friends etc - just wondering about the political aspect.

Earlydancing · 04/04/2022 21:13

It doesn't matter what the op's politics are. If Max doesn't agree, he has a right to say so and it might be he doesn't care to stay friends. But he doesn't have the right to be abusive and wish the op dead. And then expect they'll all just be friends like nothing's been said.
To ask what her politics are is to start down a road of saying that it's OK to be abusive of members of certain parties.

AtrociousCircumstance · 05/04/2022 10:53

@Earlydancing Oh no I completely agree with you, I’m just curious as to what might have triggered his awful behaviour.

Theunamedcat · 09/04/2022 14:43

You dont need to be triggered to act like a dick sounds like he is just a dick

sleepymum50 · 09/04/2022 16:19

My only suggestion might be to wait until a time comes when they do come to your house.

And then you can personally talk to them direct about their behaviour in not calling max out.

If their wives come even better.

This would be your chance to have it out face to face, and they might find it harder to justify to your face their apathy.

If it all goes to ratshit, you can tell them to fuck off and never come back.

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