DD getting into arguments at school

[BlabBlub]

DD is 10 and obviously I've bought her up as a feminist. She's so confident, mature and I'm very proud of her but the problem is that she's getting into arguments at school because she takes no shit and calls out any sexism.

For example she said sex and gender aren't the same thing (I'm pregnant and someone asked what the gender was) and she had the whole class, including the teacher, telling her she was wrong.

Her friends called her a Karen, can't remember why, but she told them Karen was a sexist term/stereotype and they shouldn't use it, they all disagreed with her and now her nickname is Karen. Some older boys overheard the conversation and she was arguing with them about it to.

I just feel so sorry for her. I don't really know what I'm asking. I don't want to have to tell her to keep her views to herself but at the same time, I don't want other kids being horrible to her.

I'd speak to the teacher about that particular incident.

I like the sound of your dd!

I’d be at the school too. They can’t someone a child being bullied for staring biological facts and standing up for what she feels is right.

Remind them that all this #bekind is always a one way street paved with bullies.

This makes my blood boil! Even TRAs know sex and gender aren't the same which is why the term cis exists in the first place. Teachers are utterly ill equipped to deal with this and shouldn't be wading in. Definitely raise with the school.
Also praise her for her strength of opinion. It was a very different circumstance but I remember when I was 11 in a PSHE class I took a different stance to everyone else on a moral issue and I got bulllied for it for a while, but I stood by it and I stand by the point I made today. Knowing her own mind and sharing her views with kindness and openness are important skills. Also make sure you're reminding her to listen to others and also be open to changing her mind where she feels appropriate

The thing with the teacher happened before Christmas so I don't know if it's worth bringing it up now. To be fair, her friend patted her on the back and said even though you're wrong, we still love you. Patronising, but nice I suppose.

Yup bullying. What does the actual science curriculum say here for their age group?

Are they meant to hold doublethink…

@YukoandHiro great post thank you, I will have a chat with her tonight about being Kind and listening to others opinions ect.

@BlabBlub

The thing with the teacher happened before Christmas so I don't know if it's worth bringing it up now. To be fair, her friend patted her on the back and said even though you're wrong, we still love you. Patronising, but nice I suppose.

No, go back to the school and complain - not to the teacher, but directly to the headteacher. Both with regard to the teacher stating incorrect assertions - that sex = gender - but also the bullying from others calling her ‘Karen’. I would be raging!

I agree with everything she has said and have taught my DC the same but the problems is that your DD is not as mature as you think she is.

If you're equipping her to be a staunch feminist that needs to include teaching her how to navigate situations like the ones you've described. And enabling her to walk away from situations or use humour to make her point. She shouldn't feel she has to be a mini-warrior for you or feminism all the time. She still has to be a child and navigate friendships.

You can contact the teacher about the sex/gender confusion and ask the teacher to clarify what happened. Sex and gender can be used interchangeably and not everyone believes gender is a social construct. Your DD was using the correct biological term and the teacher should have managed it better. Presumably they use sex in their sex education classes around puberty.

As for people calling her a Karen - that's bullying. Tell the teacher about it.

[quote BlabBlub]@YukoandHiro great post thank you, I will have a chat with her tonight about being Kind and listening to others opinions ect.[/quote]
The ‘BE KIND’ mantra has a lot to answer for. It’s used to shut people up. Ie, you shouldn’t question lies as that’s not being kind.

Saying sex and gender are the same means no-one could be transgender. It really is denying the existence of trans people.

I don't actually know what gender is, but by Christ we have been told it's not sex.

@ADisgruntledPelican

I agree with everything she has said and have taught my DC the same but the problems is that your DD is not as mature as you think she is.

If you're equipping her to be a staunch feminist that needs to include teaching her how to navigate situations like the ones you've described. And enabling her to walk away from situations or use humour to make her point. She shouldn't feel she has to be a mini-warrior for you or feminism all the time. She still has to be a child and navigate friendships.

You can contact the teacher about the sex/gender confusion and ask the teacher to clarify what happened. Sex and gender can be used interchangeably and not everyone believes gender is a social construct. Your DD was using the correct biological term and the teacher should have managed it better. Presumably they use sex in their sex education classes around puberty.

As for people calling her a Karen - that's bullying. Tell the teacher about it.

Sex and gender are not the same and should not be used in the same way.

I just checked - nope I didn't say sex and gender are the same. I said and I'll quote it because you seem to have missed it -
'Sex and gender can be used interchangeably' By many people who are unaware of the current debate. By older people who were taught 'gender' was a more polite word for 'sex'. By people who look up the terms in the Oxford dictionary. I didn't once say they were the same but if you are trying to have conversations then you need to be able to engage and explain your terms. You need to be able to articulate that you are using the terms to mean gender is a social construct and sex is a biological reality.

If you're equipping her to be a staunch feminist that needs to include teaching her how to navigate situations like the ones you've described. And enabling her to walk away from situations or use humour to make her point. She shouldn't feel she has to be a mini-warrior for you or feminism all the time. She still has to be a child and navigate friendships.

Very very very much that.

There are things I feel extremely strongly about, advocate for and volunteer for. And they're not exactly popular things with the general public. But I avoid getting into arguments about them because it simply does not work. Outside of politics, you don't change minds by being bold and angry. And it certainly doesn't work with teenagers because they tend to become entrenched.

I'm proud to say that over time, some of my friends have changed their minds about some things, but it's been because I've shared my experiences within calm and friendly conversations. I've listened to them empathetically and tried to understand their own concerns.

Your DD is right to feel the way she does, but she doesn't have the maturity to express her opinions in the right place and in the right way, I'm guessing. And at this age, growing relationships and learning empathy is important. More important than trying to change someone's mind in the space of two minutes in a lesson.

I honestly stop listening when someone becomes strident. It's too much and if anything I tend to double down, because if someone is loud and opinionated, I tend to assume that they're not someone I'm going to agree with.

I hear 'staunch' and think that this is not someone who's going to listen to me.

I hear 'staunch' and think that this is not someone who's going to listen to me.

Likewise "takes no shit" sounds admirable, but in real life, it needs a massive amount of maturity for it to work positively.

Your daughter is a , OP. So are you for bringing her up so well. Hers may be the only rational voice the other girls hear.

She has the right to slack off and not bother to argue, when she gets tired of listening to the nonsense people regurgitate. But it’s good to know there are girls like her growing up in these backward times.

“ADisgruntledPelican

I just checked - nope I didn't say sex and gender are the same. I said and I'll quote it because you seem to have missed it -
'Sex and gender can be used interchangeably' By many people who are unaware of the current debate. By older people who were taught 'gender' was a more polite word for 'sex'. By people who look up the terms in the Oxford dictionary. I didn't once say they were the same but if you are trying to have conversations then you need to be able to engage and explain your terms. You need to be able to articulate that you are using the terms to mean gender is a social construct and sex is a biological reality.“

What you say is true here. Many people truly don’t know that ‘gender’ is not the same as ‘sex’. Mostly it is used as a euphemism for sex.

Where are the two words legally defined and distinguished from each other? Is it in the Equalities Act? I know I have seen this somewhere.

The OP needs tho go armed with this and anything like it to show the headteacher and class teacher and ask for a public apology to DD.

Like it or not gender has always been a social construct and a foetus doesn't understand that

Does she actually believe the things she’s saying though or is she just being your mouthpiece and repeating whatever you tell her to the detriment of her childhood and friendships?

Nobody should be called a Karen, it is totally unfair (especially to those who are actually called Karen), and it sounds as though kids have picked it up and jumped on the bandwagon.

Only recently have sex and gender been separated. People differ in their opinions on that but, frankly, most of us will not encounter situations where it is important. I never have.

Your daughter is entitled to her opinion but so are others, however they should not retort to taunts and insults.

Opinions do change or are modified over time, tell her that.

The sex and gender just sounds like I’ll informed people. Weirdly it’s actually old fashioned/anti-woke so unusual that that is the stance people are taking at the school.
The ‘Karen’ thing is shocking. It’s a misogynistic slur and should be clamped down on. Would the school be ok with your daughter being called ‘bitch’ repeatedly?