Woman attacked by man for swimming "too fast".

[acatcalledjohn]

Another woman attacked by a man for simply existing. I'm glad she's spoken out about it but it's depressing she has to. Previously she was punched in the stomach because apparently swimming faster than a man is "bullying behaviour".

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/swimming-pool-west-london-attack-b1875453.html

Not at all surprised.

I recently passed someone going uphill on my bike. He then went full pelt to pass me. Thing is I was on an bike, so of course I could pass him easily on the hill.

(Some) men and their egos 🤦‍♀️

I agree with previous poster that the genuinely fast male swimmers are fine. It is the REALLY slow guys who identify as being fast, get in the fast lane (but only if no males are in there) and hold up the women and get angry at being overtaken who are a problem. I don't think I've ever encountered a slow woman holding up the fast lane (apart from once with a tourist who couldn't read english and the lifeguard got her to move as she was literally just floating in one spot).

Men swimming splashily isn't necessarily malicious but it is thoughtless and inconsiderate. I don't suppose these blokes have ever observed women swimming more neatly and thought, hey, that's good, maybe I should learn how to be more like that.

Women could never use the mixed-sex sauna though because of the harassment. Complaining did nothing.

I no longer get harassment now I'm in my 50s, but the sauna often has young men in there with their misogynistic "bantz". It's not very relaxing. The way some of them talk about their partners is very unpleasant.

I know a female swimmer who was recently pushed under the water by another female swimmer who then swam over the top of her! Because she was going faster and couldn't be arsed to swim round even though they were in big lake with plenty of space! I agree that it's more likely to be men doing it to women rather than doing it to another man but sometimes women are twats too.

The thing about this story that shocked me is that he grabbed her foot/leg and wouldn't let go. I mean, his reasons were ridiculous, obviously, but whether he thought he was justified in being annoyed or not, he physically assaulted her and yet the gym staff did not ban him but rather suggested that she swim at another time. The way men get away with this sort of behaviour is just mind blowing.

At our gym, there's a large cafe area, including an adults only section. There's a man in there who is always bellowing into his phone, sprawling across the furniture etc. I know that people have complained, the gym is fully aware that is behaviour is disruptive and that the women in particular find it difficult as if they ever ask him to please keep it down he gets aggressive.... but they refuse to ban him. It's incredibly frustrating. And worse for the female staff as his tone with them is unbearable. I almost never go to that gym any more but use the other one that's a bit further away, and it's almost entirely because of this man.

@CovidCorvid

I know a female swimmer who was recently pushed under the water by another female swimmer who then swam over the top of her! Because she was going faster and couldn't be arsed to swim round even though they were in big lake with plenty of space! I agree that it's more likely to be men doing it to women rather than doing it to another man but sometimes women are twats too.

the issue here is that this man attacked this woman and the staff did nothing and did not insist he leave. This would be equally bad if a woman attacked another woman. But a) woman very seldom attack other women in swimming pools and b) if a woman DID attack another woman, it is less likely that she would be allowed to remain in the pool while the victim was encouraged to leave.

Swimming in the fast lane at a Virgin Active club a middle aged man decided to swim headlong into a fast 30 something female swimmer. He did it on purpose trying to make a point and somehow get her in trouble. The young life guards tried to stay calm and as neutral as possible. The man quit the club and was released from his contract. Still the woman was really shaken, and I never saw her again.

Haven't RTFT but any women triathletes here to comment? I've heard the swim section is brutal with punches and kicks.

agree with previous poster that the genuinely fast male swimmers are fine. It is the REALLY slow guys who identify as being fast, get in the fast lane (but only if no males are in there) and hold up the women and get angry at being overtaken who are a problem

Ex club swimmers, ie the really fast ones, are used to training in a mixed sex environment and are used to swimming with women faster than they are. They will also have good pool etiquette, waiting at the end to be overtaken, or shortening a length to overtake. Basically swimming so they minimally interfere with others.

The men who get upset at women beating them are nearly always the gym bunnies who think their pure strength means they should always be superior, and don’t realise technique is a massive part of swimming.

Haven't RTFT but any women triathletes here to comment? I've heard the swim section is brutal with punches and kicks

That tends to be because you have a big bunch of mixed ability swimmers and there’s inevitably a jostle for position. I’ve never been punched or kicked maliciously, but it isn’t unusual to catch a leg or an arm as you or someone else moves position. It can be intimidating for newbies- best to hang back or swim to the side where it’s clear, but everyone wants the same quickest line and there will be a push for it, especially at the start.

Some of it is organisation- similar to pp I once did a pool tri where they set everyone off 30s apart, slowest to fastest. Of course the fastest caught up in seconds and it was chaos.

I’m struggling to read the link but generally this is the sort of thing I have seen time and time again in public lane swimming.
I’m lucky in that I am feisty enough to usually sort these egotistical idiots (almost always men) out and usually come away with a funny story but that’s not possible for everyone. Maybe now most people have to pre-book for swimming sessions a list of rules/etiquette should be sent to all who book?
Our best tale was going swimming with my child (a very good swimmer) my mum (older lady breaststroke swimmer but still pretty quick) and myself (faster than most recreational swimmers) and we each managed to annoy someone in our respective lanes! My child was apparently too young to swim in the fast lane, I was too fat and female for the medium lane and my mum too old and female for the slow lane I guess. The lifeguard gave us our own lane and despite the huge gulf in speeds between the three of us we shared a lane absolutely fine for an hour…..speed in a lane doesn’t matter when you have good lane etiquette.

I used to be part of a club for early morning swimming, which worked well and there was always plenty of space (when it got a bit busy so sharing lanes was needed, people followed good etiquette generally with only 1 twat who everyone knew to leave him to himself).

Nowadays, I can't do that club anymore, but have been trying to get back swimming as a fat, late 40s, with bad back problems, and sedentary office job and my commuting walk for exercise gone due to Covid....woman. Luckily there are adult only sessions with lanes which are generally quiet in the local LA pool, but there are usually a number of much older ladies pootling along in the casual lane (making good steady progress but slow) and very fast guys in fast crawl lane - so I go for the middle lane at a reasonable paced, steady breaststroke with some crawl thrown in. There's 1 guy who tries to hog the middle rather than the anti-clockwise system, and I have had a whack on my head a couple of times - despite letting him past in the middle or giving him space ahead of me at the ends when he does catch up on me (I tend to get 3 lanes in to his 4 - whereas I would pass all 4 in the casual lane each length...). The open area has people not lane swimming but doing physio type exercises, disabled people going in but needing to stay near the edge, older people in for a float and gentle swim but not looking for full lengths etc. So I think I am in the right spot, and there are only 2 of us there mostly.

Either that, or I need to get up at stupid o'clock and do the very early morning sessions again....

Swimmers bump all the time,

He grabbed her foot and held her underwater. If you're not going to read the details, why comment?

Yep, behaviour like this is why I no longer go swimming

I've had various encounters but not as serious as this over the years. It's never a problem with 'proper' experienced male swimmers, it's always as a pp above said gym people who think their strength automatically translates to speed when it doesn't. Water is a great leveller and it comes as a big surprise to a lot of men.

That said I went swimming last night, I was in the middle lane with an older gentleman and had to overtake him a few times. As I kicked off I could see him trying to say something to me and decided to swim a few underwater strokes anticipating a telling off. When he finally caught up with me he asked if we could just take half the lane each 'as you're so much faster than me and if anyone else comes we'll sort something else out'. It was so pleasant and surprising.

This has also happened to my at a physiotherapy warm water pool where you had book specific times. It was only a 17 metre pool and you were meant do your physio programme at one of 6 adult separate training stations. It was the only exercise I could do following a life changing accident which left me in risk of losing my leg if I suffered further injury. Out of the water I was encased in a thigh to ankle cast and used a wheelchair or rollator.

• There was one man who didn't like to work at his work station and would alternate jogging and swimming through everyone's work stations. He hit me (and others) many times doing full powered back stroke. I complained but it wasn't taken seriously
• I was also kicked by a man at the next station - he deliberately kicked into my station area yet we were the only 2 in the pool so he had many other places to choose.
• then I went to the disability session at another pool when they had 25% for swimming and 75% for physio training (they also had lane swimming twice a day) where there were some very aggressive men who insisted on training backstroke and butterfly in the physio area

This has happened to me in bouldering. Dickhead tried to kick me in the face to knock me to the ground from 8 ft up because I managed a route he couldn’t. I jumped off and he hit and broke his foot on a handhold. You can’t make this shit up.

@MondayYogurt

Haven't RTFT but any women triathletes here to comment? I've heard the swim section is brutal with punches and kicks.

Yes. I mentioned that earlier-my swim heat got plowed over, we were grabbed and pushed under. I stopped competing in open waters as a result (I was amateur heat but it was a wide competition), but still, I'm sure I'd have done it again had I not been treated like that).

Ozanj - sorry to side-chat, but I've only just come across bouldering - is it really basically jumping off rocks with a mini crashmat? Or am I missing something?

Reading all this I'm feeling lucky - my swimming pool is fairly civilised - I pootle along in the slow lane with the old ladies, the middle lanes generally have the blokes who don't want to be in the slow lanes with us oldies, and the fast lane has the really good ones of both sexes, with (from what I see) no drama.

Closest I notice is that women do tend to clump in the lanes and leave the blokes to it if we can..

The only time there's real trouble is there seems to be a swimming club one morning, and theres a lot of them, and they're all a bit splashy (but also all far to good for the slow lanes, so I'm still fine :D)

MzHz
There is a MASSIVE problem with life guards failing to manage Lane etiquette

It's not the lifeguards job to get grow adults to behave themselves they aren't bloody nannies, their job is to over see the safety of the swimmers in the pool and ensure no one gets into trouble in the water drowning. Not managing a bloody lane.

Where seeing someone dragged underwater by her foot and held there is supremely un concerning from a safety angle? That's a bit... Wet? (sorry)

In the UK whereas chucking people out for jumping in from the side (or bombing) is a whistle and "oi! Out !"?

@Kotatsu

Ozanj - sorry to side-chat, but I've only just come across bouldering - is it really basically jumping off rocks with a mini crashmat? Or am I missing something?

Reading all this I'm feeling lucky - my swimming pool is fairly civilised - I pootle along in the slow lane with the old ladies, the middle lanes generally have the blokes who don't want to be in the slow lanes with us oldies, and the fast lane has the really good ones of both sexes, with (from what I see) no drama.

Closest I notice is that women do tend to clump in the lanes and leave the blokes to it if we can..

The only time there's real trouble is there seems to be a swimming club one morning, and theres a lot of them, and they're all a bit splashy (but also all far to good for the slow lanes, so I'm still fine :D)

It’s climbing without rope, so using your strength and agility. Women are better at it naturally than men because we tend to be lighter, use our whole bodies when climbing and are more flexible. So we can often do even the spiderman type routes (where you climb upside down essentially) a bit more easily. Unfortunately many men don’t understand that and view it as a blot to their masculinity when we manage a route they can’t.

You are meant to fall safely onto the crashmat if you can’t climb as it’s safer than trying to climb down and slipping as the handholds can really hurt.

@Fullofglee

MzHz There is a MASSIVE problem with life guards failing to manage Lane etiquette

It's not the lifeguards job to get grow adults to behave themselves they aren't bloody nannies, their job is to over see the safety of the swimmers in the pool and ensure no one gets into trouble in the water drowning. Not managing a bloody lane.

Actually lifeguards are expected to suggest if people are in the wrong Lane for the speed of the others.

Blatant crap like walking in lanes or breast stroking in a fast Lane when your name does contain the name Peaty, even use of fins are safety issues

But I agree, 90% of these lifeguards are teens and v young adults and just don’t have the confidence to comment - and when you see what crap people in retail etc out up with, I do understand but it’s not right .

One of DS’s fellow club swimmers was often a lazy trainer and a right sod to pass - DS said if you tapped his foot then he’d just let fly with a stream of wee.