Very unsettled newborn getting me down.............................................. help

[katierocket]

DS2 is nearly 4 weeks old and is a very unsettled baby. DS1 had horrendous colic and we had an awful first 3 months with him. I'm terrified that same is happening with DS2.

he is irritable, always seems uncomfortable, is very 'frantic' when awake - flailing arms and legs, cries most of the time he's awake and has frequent periods in day and evening of full on screaming. He also often wakes up in the pram crying.

I just feel as though it's something I've done/am doing. He's breastfed, is putting on weight well but just seems to be an unhappy little man.

Could it be colic again? reflux? (he's quite sicky, always hiccuping, burping etc)He's desperate to suck but won't take a dummy (will suck my finger for a while).

It's just really really getting me down, I feel like I can't go anywhere with him and my whole day and night is just feeding and trying to get him to sleep/stop crying.

Am going to cranial osteopath next week but any other thoughts about how I can make him less unsettled?

thanks

thanks LTH - appreciate it

Mousie - that is interesting. Maybe I will try dairy first and see what happens

try putting him on his tummy to sleep

works very well with colicky babies

someone else suggested that. Am very paranoid about doingthat though because of cot death advice etc

Katierocket - I sympathise as dd2 was also like this the first 4 weeks of her life. I really thought having a 'screamer' for a seccond baby was some kind of revenge for having such a calm and settled first baby.

Anyway, I didn't cut dairy out of my diet, but did make a conscious effort to take dd2 off the breast for a rest/burp before carrying on whch went some way to helping the build up of wind, etc. I also took her to see a cranial oesteopath and asked him if she had digestive system issues. He said no but instead, she had nervous system and liver function problems. Not sure how they can tell that...but I suppose that's whay he was the oesteopath and not me!

Had two sessions and saw some great results. We also perservered with the dummy to give her some comfort and in order to get her to go to sleep. Had to start by holding it in her mouth for a while as otherwise it would get spat out, but in time she got the hang of it. She now only has a dummy for daytime sleep and initially to get to sleep at night so this hasn't turned into full blown dependance in case you're worried about that.

Otherwise what Enid has said is also true -it won't last!

Hi again kr - yes, we were prescribed infant gaviscon for the reflux, but she was about 22 weeks by the time we got that. Have you seen this symptom list for silent reflux?

The fact that you say he's quite sicky makes me think that the dairy is more likely to be the issue (unless he's sicky enough for it to be reflux rather than silent reflux?). I didn't really know what was a 'normal' amount of sickness for a baby, but once I gave up dairy, she virtually completely stopped being sick at all!

The other poster who mentioned avoiding soy is also right when testing for milk intolerance. Around 30-40% of babies who are milk intolerant are apparently also soy intolerant, so you need to make sure that you don't substitute soya products for milk ones until you have clearly established whether giving up dairy makes a difference. I just avoided soy for a couple of weeks, and then re-introduced it without problem. To save you time label checking, you'll need Pure Sunflower spread, as this is the only one (except one Sainsbury's spread that most of their branches don't stock) which is free of both milk and soy products. No need to live on just roast chicken though - I eat a full and varied diet and still manage to avoid dairy no problem (dd now 12 months and still intolerant).

One more question - what is his poo like, in terms of frequency? Dd seemed to be pooing the whole time, and this is another common symptom of milk intolerance.

It is very common, btw, for milk intolerant babies to also suffer from reflux, so it may be a bit of both that your ds is experiencing.

I really feel for you, and the only things I can say is buy a few different dummies, shapes, sizes and brands and like someone else said, hold the dummy in place until he learns to latch on. It took my little girl about a week to finally find one she liked and get the hang of using it, but it sure beat having her comforting herself on my boobs and screaming the house down when I made her get off me! It has really made a massive difference, and she will sit in her bouncer now happy. I know lots of people are anti dummies but needs must, and with dd1 we got rid of hers when she was 3 and I can't see that it's done her any damage! The white noise thing is worth a try to, the hoover and hairdryer are quite effective here to at soothing.

Really hope things improve for you soon. Also, if breast feeding is getting you down don't feel guilty. With dd1 I only managed 3 weeks and cried my head off when I decided to quit. But a couple of days later I was 100% happier and so was dd1, it was quite amazing the difference it made! And dd1 is a perfectly healthy and happy 6 yr old now.x.

thank you all (again!) god mumsnet is a life saver.

CanSleepWontStarve - funnily enough he does poo a lot - it's very very runny and often green. Went to GP who has given us infant gaviscon (he didn't think green poo of any significance BTW). Obviously we'll have to get him to take a bottle though as it has to be mixed with water/milk. When giving up dairy do you have to make sure you have literally nothing with it in e.g. chocolate or is it just products with fresh milk in? As for the list - yes he has a lot of those symptoms.

jessddibs - really want to perservere with teh dummy as I'm sure it would help, he seems desperate to suck. We have tried holding it in on numerous occasions but he gets furious. I guess we'll try with some different shaped teats. I know a dummy really helped with DS1

all dairy in all things - and soy. that is what makes is such a faff and so hard. it creeps in everywhere. also probably if you keep this up for a while in your diet you should think about calcium supplements and see a dietician. but just try it for a bit - all sounds possible given the poo etc... that dairy and possibly soy are things he struggles with now. will most likely grow out of - not a life sentence by any means. mine was fine by two, and much better at one... good luck.

cripes - no chocolate

seriously I will give it a go if it might help.

karierocket - there is a chance that he could be overfeeding which makes the colic worse by over stimulating your supply? Do you feed from both breasts at each feed? If you have a strong let down it may be worth restricing him to one breast at each feed. By that I mean feed him, wind him then put him back on the same side. That way he will get less of a gush of fore milk and get more fatty milk at the end of the feed. He will then have less runny greenish stools. I am not sure restricting your diet will be very helpful just now, nor giving formula.
If he is choking when first feeding, have you tried feeding him 'uphill' by lying back a bit. Also try keeping him upright more as he feeds? If it is an oversupply problem, you can sort that by using the same breast over 6 hours, then using the other. What do you think?

hi mears (and thanks), I only ever feed from one breast at each feed. That seems to be enough for him. I haven't tried using the same breast for 6 hours though, do you think that might help - wouldn't it make the other one very engorged?

I feed him in the 'classic' position but try to have his head higher than his feet, I did try leaning back but couldn't really get the hang of it - is that what you mean by uphill?

You would have initial engorgement but that would ease as milk production slowed down. It is only useful though if it is an over supply issue. The engorgement has the effect of redcuing the milk produced. Not sure that this is an issue you have.
Sadly colic is not uncommon up to 12 weeks and it may be that you will have this problem again though no fault of your own I might add. Colicynth granules are great for easing colic - you keep poppinga few in every 5 minutes till the colic passes. If he is colicky on breastmilk he will probably be worse of formula. Perhaps worth expressing though so that you can get a break. He may well settle on his tummy which you could do during the day when you are around to watch him. I would say it is worth a try as long as you ensure he is not overheated.

kr - you can give the gaviscon by syringe, so no need to use a bottle.

Good quality dark chocolate often doesn't contain milk, so all is not lost! (May contain soy but hopefully you won't need to stay off that for long).

I know that mears appears to be against this idea, but I really wish that someone had suggested it to me much sooner - the medical profession have too much of a tendency to fob off most crying babies as 'just' having colic. There were articles published about this recently - one here and another here.

yes dark chocolate a life saver. do feel free to CAT me if you want a more indepth chat. i did get very clued up on this at one point, obviously.

Aww sweet. I remember this with DS

It's hard, the early stages, isnt it?

Lots of good advice on here. It will pass.

thanks. have got the gaviscon now so will t ry that. I think iwill CAT you if that's ok Mousie. I do want to try and cut out dairy, just need to think about all the things that it could be in.

of course. i can be more candid one to one and hopefully more helpful!

another dreadful day today (although thurs and fri were better).
I'm sure it's feeding related. Thismorning he was feeding, taking himself off the breast and but then screaming to go back on - very frustrating. I just wonder whether my fast let down is giving him really bad tummy ache/. He's pretty much screamed all day.

Is awful/

this is all great advice - the only thing I can add is that I went through this with both DS's and my emotions were exactly the same along the lines of surely we can't have 2!!!! Dentinox colic stuff worked for us, but so did going to a BF counsellor, where she showed me my latch on position was wrong and helped me to sort it. I feel for you - sometimes knowing it will end doesn't speed the journey........

GOd he's getting worse! I'm sure it's feeding related. Am cutting out dairy to see if that helps but I suspect it is to do wtih fast letdown and oversupply which is giving him chronic tummy ache. This week half term and poor DS1 is really getting rough end of the stick, I can't put DS2 down or he screams. Am also bloody knackered.
So tempted to try formula in desperation but not sure that it will help.

KR - following on from Jan thread, if you want to chat my email is wilkbert @ ntlworld . com (without spaces). Looking into cranial osteopathy too. xx

THANKS Wilkie, appreciate it

Your ds sounds exactly the same as my 6 week old dd (born 8th Jan). If she's not asleep she's generally screaming the house down. She's no. 3 (we have 2 ds's) and I'm still bf ds2, so you would have thought I'd be a pro by now, but it would appear not!!

Out of desperation I had the HV round today, and she confirmed that dd is simply not latching on properly and is swallowing TONS of air (which I'd already guessed but was having real trouble rectifying). She's recommended using gripe water during / after a feed, massaging her tummy twice a day, and she also showed me a better way to latch her on, which I hope will help.

I can fully empathise with your situation - it's a true nightmare and the guilt I feel to my older 2 (ds1 is 5, ds2 22 months), doesn't help

Keep telling myself this stage will be over soon and I will start to enjoy her, but it seems like forever away!!

Good luck with things....

thanks Kerry, crikey you do have your hands full. It's hard because I can't stop myself thinking it's something I'm doing.

Interesting abotu the latch I think he's latched on ok but I guess it might not be. HV thinks I shoudl be referred to a paed as his crying etc is getting worse.

My head is thumping and I'm so so tired. DS1 was up at 5,30 this morning and wet the bed (I'm sure that's just a reaction to everything that's going on).

Well we went to a cranial osteopath yesterday and I really thought it had helped but today he's as bad as ever. I've spent literally all day trying to get him to sleep/stop crying.

Have been in tears this evening myself and feel totally overwhelmed by it all.