Girlguiding and religion plus volunteering

[CrackIes]

I’ve been volunteering at my local Rainbows group for a couple of months and helped at Brownies a couple of times. I really enjoy it but each meeting ends with a religious prayer or song, is this normal? Neither unit I’ve supported are linked to a church so this has been unexpected

For anyone who is a current leader, would you recommend it? Can you be a leader but not go on overnights? Family commitments would make it difficult and there are other leaders so girls wouldn’t miss out but this is the only thing stopping me going from unit helper to leader in training

Overnights are not compulsory.
By religious what do you mean? Taps (a song) is a traditional way to end and mentions God but often gets sung by secular groups. If you're uncomfortable with it perhaps chat with your Leader?

Never known a religious element.
peach group seems to be very different, but with one brownies unit my dad never did anything beyond the weekly sessions so it can’t be compulsory.
my dad is now 17 and been with Girlguiding since rainbows, i am so full of admiration and respect for the leaders! She is now a young leader and still loves it.

They get the girls to stand in a circle, eyes closed and hands together to pray and do a singing prayer about being God’s children. It’s not that I’m uncomfortable but it just surprised me as it didn’t feel very inclusive.

I very much enjoy the other elements though

Guiding as a whole isn't a religious organisation, and the website even says "Don't focus on one faith Don't just refer to one faith during unit meetings and activities. For example, doing a reflection or song that refers to a god wouldn't be inclusive for all girls."

I take this to mean that realistically, we shouldn't have prayers or songs specifically related to religion which are sung every week, and my group, and may others I know, have changed some of the wording of songs to avoid the mention of a God.
Personally I'd be bringing this up with the main leader, and asking why (if you're a sponsored unit or a closed unit, for example, that may explain it)
I had a leader recently tell me that 'they didn't have anyone who got offended by praying, or mentioning God, so they still did it the traditional way' which I don't particularly like, as it's not only not inclusive, but can prevent someone voicing that they are uncomfortable, or may be preventing people from joining.

As others have said, it's open to all religions and none. However being volunteer run, each group is very different and reflects the dynamic of each group. Traditional songs which used to refer to God have been reworded in many cases but they are still around in some groups who have chosen to keep them.
No requirement to do overnight if you're not able to.

I remember being brownie and guide as a kid, about 15 years ago I volunteered with brownies in different county, they wanted me to say my 'promise' and be offical member of team and as I wouldn't 'promise to god' as I'm Atheist, they wouldn't let me join officially as they said i had no other option and I stopped going.
For that reason I have got my daughter involved

• havent

Yes I had to promise to God in the 80s!

They don't have to include God anymore in the promise . I went to a fairly religious brownies with a little prayer/thought each week and we took it in turns to do these - bit like assemblies.

However the ones my girls went to (before they went to scouts which was amillion times better in our area) wasnt at all religious.

Taps at the end is "our lord our god, thy children call, grant us they peace, and bless us all, good night" is a traditional way to end the meeting if that's what youre thinking?

@456pickupsticks thats what bothers me the most, it’s just not inclusive!

@Rainbowsandbutterflies1990 thats shocking, hopefully that no longer happens but I fully understand why you’d not get your daughter involved.

@OneMoreStepAlongTheRoadIGo its definitely not that song, I wish I could remember the words, but it talks about being Gods children and watching over them. Maybe it’s Unit specific as the leaders have been there a very long time

Oh Lord my god, thy children call…

is traditional brownie bells.

Taps is Day is done…. Etc…. And ends god is nigh.

for rainbows the going home song is:
Look, Learn, Laugh, Love.

We've had lots of fun.
Bye bye Rainbows.
Sleep well everyone.

so this sounds like a your unit issue rather than a Girlguiding one.

That would be a lovely going home song!

There can be quite big differences between different scouting and guiding groups, and I think this is probably specific to your group.

After reading this thread and my comment I actually looked into scouts for my daughter and they have now squirrels for 4 to 6 year olds and my daughter would love that! As she loves hey huggee! But closest one has 40 children on waiting list 😕 so need to wait till she is 6 to start beavers (I think girls can join)

@Rainbowsandbutterflies1990 You may like to look into local Guiding groups, as the promise has now changed, and doesn't include God.
It did used to be 'I promise that I will do my best, to love my God...', and there was (and still is) only one promise, so if you didn't want to make that one you couldn't do an alternative, but you didn't have to make the promise.
This is still the case, but the promise is more inclusive now, and uses 'develop my beliefs'(or think about my beliefs for Rainbows) in place of any reference to Gods.

If you're keen for your daughter to join Beavers once she's 6, I'd suggest putting her on a waiting list now, as all those squirrels will be moving up too, and there's probably a waiting list for Beavers too.

There’s a good chance the leaders will be thrown out of guiding if some find out about this.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1059869/girlguiding-Emma-Jeffery-sacked-god-promise-beliefs-County-Commissioner-Karen-McFarlane/amp

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/girl-guides-warned-drop-god-6406993.amp

It depends who gets wind of this and if they’re the bullying/ nasty type. There appears to be a lot of that about in Girlguiding and please be warned and be careful what you’re letting yourself in for if you volunteer with them.

Rainbow and Brownie leader here. All units were advised many many years ago to switch away from the old religious songs and prayers, and towards more inclusive versions. For example we sing (to the tune of the Big Ben chimes):

Its time for the end
Our meeting's passed
Rainbows was great
Time flies so fast
Goodnight!

There are some facebook rainbow leader groups for ideas and support on all things related to Girlguiding - let me know if you would like me to DM you the link. But they have lots of ideas for secular songs.

As a unit helper, you are a very important member of the leadership team, so you could maybe look at some different videos of the different songs and suggest some alternatives to your unit leader? Or if you didnt feel comfortable doing that, you could also chat to the District Commissioner at your next district meeting? I would hate to think of anyone (girl or leader!) being put off joining because of some old traditions, when the guidance has been very clear for a lot of years now.

Oh and absolutely no requirement to do overnights! Especially at rainbow age, we find a lot of our girls arent interested in overnights away so very little pressure to do them.