Spring 23 music thread

[thirdfiddle]

I saw some sunshine today so it's officially spring! Here's a new thread for all things musical.

With a nod to those who started the series, well before my young folk picked up an instrument or I braved the vipers of MN. This little corner is for support only, and bragging about your young folk's musical achievements is positively encouraged.

How are things looking for new year? Anyone new want to join us for a chat? Any lurkers want to delurk? All welcome from pre beginners to music college and beyond.

Wow herbaceous what a star!

DD has had an invitation to NYO inspire orchestra in July, has anyone else? She's absolutely thrilled!

I've had a couple of wines, so am in full brag mode.

Here is his YouTube channel!

https://www.youtube.com/@sambrophymusic4546/videos

Instrument for a 4year old.

Hello! Hope it’s okay to capitalise on the collective knowledge of this group - I was wondering if anyone’s children started learning an instrument at circa 4yo and, if what instrument they learnt/are learning. My youngest daughter is 4
and is really enjoying playing the piano at the moment (so she’ll keep learning this) but she is also desperate to learn another instrument too (for background info — her - much older - sister plays multiple instruments but didn’t start this little so i’m not sure what do! ).

Any ideas on what would be good for a 4yo….?

is it possible to do a woodwind/brass instrument at that age….?

Thank you! 🎶

What a voice herbaceous! No wonder you're proud!!!

Lovely to have so many quality recordings too @herbaceous, will be so nice to look back on.

On a linked point - for those of you with younger children, I find it a lovely thing to be able to look back on the little clips I've recorded of both my kids playing when they were little as it allows them to really appreciate how much they've improved - we also do it with new pieces- record the first week and then record at points after which helps them to see progress if it's feeling like hard work! I have footage of DD age 4 hiding underneath the piano and refusing to get out- it's a miracle she made any progress at all really but definitely fun to look back at!

@northerngoldilocks I agree completely with the recordings! I’ve been teaching DS piano and some days isn’t too keen. If I suggest recording a performance he is suddenly desperate to play it perfectly and will persist until he does.

@Hockeyjockey no direct experience here (my DS has just turned 5 so similar age) but I’d suggest recorder if you want a wind instrument, or strings (because they come in small sizes). I’m a brass player and ideally the second teeth are in before starting; I think that’s the case with many woodwind too. Recorder doesn’t need much puff or a special embouchure- the only limiting factor is whether she can stretch to cover the holes yet.

@herbaceous thank you for sharing that - he’s a lovely boy as well as a fantastic singer - no wonder you are so proud!

Thank you so much @SweetforOrchestra !
I was trying to avoid strings but not entirely sure why! Maybe we will rethink! Other option is voice - but i’m not entirely sure what you’d do with a 4yo - no one in the family is a singer, as such so it’s completely new!

so sorry @herbaceous - I don’t post much on here and may have inadvertently posted on your post (I have no idea - so tech inept!!) apologies if so

@Hockeyjockey are there any general musicianship or Kodaly classes in your area? DS goes to these and gets lots out of them. Kodaly is based on singing. The programme he is on has them doing 2 years of Kodaly and Dalcroze (music through movement) and then they get an instrument in year 2 (so at about 6). It seems like a really sensible approach to me. 4/5 is still really young and though DS is bright, musical and keen he still loses concentration pretty quickly and is quite tired out by school.

It's not my thread HockeyJockey! Post away!

Re instrument, what about a ukulele? They're small, and simple, and could lead on to guitar. Or a recorder, if you can stand the screeching.

My 5yo has started with recorder and loves it. Loads of fun and easy to make her own tunes, start writing down music etc

I teach recorder, my pupil has never screeched! But she is 7 not 4! I think it might be abit of a stretch on the fingers for a four year old. ( You can get smaller sizes but the fingerings produce different notes, and it's quite high and piercing!) You do get nice small string instruments, I don't think brass is usually started that young although the pbone and ptrumpet are plastic and lightweight. I don't know about the teeth, brass experts would know better. At the risk of being a broken record, mini bassoon is fab, can start about 7, it's lightweight and not a big finger stretch. But expensive and needs carefully looked after.There are plastic clarinets and flutes called toot and dood I think, they might start with recorder fingering, can't remember. I don't know any teacher who uses them as schools generally just start them on the full size instrument aged 9/10.
I would probably suggest singing and general musicianship. My DD didn't start an instrument until 7 and is doing fine. Was doing plenty of singing at school and church though and did Jo jingles etc.

I think that the difficulty with wind instruments is the lack of smaller sizes (although there are the smaller plastic versions mentioned upthread) so really recorder is a more sensible starting point until they've grown enough to play the full size instruments. Teeth aren't as much of an issue for woodwind as brass I think but can throw some kids off - 2 of the children in my son's group flute lesson at school stopped being able to make a sound when they lost teeth! For 4 year old's ukulele, recorder or a string instrument are the obvious choices and if strings maybe hiring as they keep needing different sizes! Perhaps first look for a children's choir alongside their piano and add another instrument when they're a bit older if they're particularly interested in woodwind or brass. DS started flute in year 3 (so age 7) and even then he was a bit small not to have horrible posture on it. His new flute teacher in year 6 spent about a term teaching him not to put the flute on his shoulder before bringing it to his mouth so it definitely brought with it bad habits to correct later!

DD did her piano performance in assembly - as predicted she was allowed to play just over a page of a 3 page piece but then played it twice - so again, why she couldn't play it once in total is baffling. Her friend was telling me that the other kids playing played for longer time, just fewer notes so they do just look at the length of the piece rather than how long it takes to play! To add to the irritation she's left the book in school and its now closed until Wednesday and she has a piano lesson tomorrow. Thankfully have managed to source all three pieces either in other books we own or the copy she used for a previous school performance so will be ok!

@northerngoldilocks - that's frustrating (the forgotten book) and UTTERLY BIZARRE (the performance rules)! Sounds like some very non-musical people setting the perameters.

DD's choir leader is stepping down at the end of this half term which is really sad. She's a lovely lady but nearing retirement so i think is dialling down of her voluntary roles. The good news is that her own singing teacher is taking over so it should be an easy transition.

Dd is going to her first opera in a week or so. School have organised a trip and she's very excited.

Oh how odd about the assembly northern! Who organises it? Might you be able to have a word?

Hi Hockey, I was thinking similarly to the others, strings or maybe recorder most common at very young ages. Our local music service have some small ones playing flute (bendy flutes!), clarinet and cornet, but probably more 6 than 4 I'd say. Does she want to play just anything or do wind/brass particularly appeal? Maybe you could take a bit of time to listen together to different instruments and see if she falls in love with something, then you can find locally recommended teachers and see what age they like to start from. Even with string instruments it really depends on having a teacher available who is good with little ones. Many teachers still prefer to teach from around 7.

I've always firmly swerved getting involved, taking a view that it's nice to have opportunities and the fact they allowed piano at all is unusual. However, I might try asking if she could possibly play a whole piece but only once next time as it's just a better experience both for her and anyone listening. It's just background music whilst the classes come in rather than any kind of performance really.

She also told me that before they play they have to do a run through with a 'music mentor' (pupils from the year above who learn instruments in school) and the music mentors have to make 'helpful comments and suggestions as to how they could improve' - the one who watched her play suggested playing the semi quavers in the last bar 'faster'. Thankfully she just said 'no' (she was playing a Bach Sinfonia so the different threads of the music being even is sort of the point) - the other kid plays recorder so understandable not to have input but the whole process is bizarre.

I've just got an email from NCO saying auditions for 2024 are now open. Has anyone else got a child who is thinking of auditioning? My DD is 10 and plays tuba and fancies trying out for it.

I bet tuba will be in great demand, they can't get a junior tuba at my dds JD, they gave to draft in a senior.

My youngest is applying to NYO inspire this year, and middle one to the full orchestra. ( Just for experience as she's unlikely to get in this time but who knows! Her teacher thinks any audition is good practice). Also got a school concert, several JD ones, a competition and a grade 8. Oh and normal school exams, going to be a busy term!

I'm considering auditioning DD for NCO projects. She plays violin though at around grade 5 standard so I'm not overly hopeful but figure it's worth a go.

@Dynamix My DS is in NCO currently and loves it. He joined last year in the under 13s and is now in main. He didn't know a soul, but has found it a wonderful experience and it has improved his musicianship and motivation immensely. Also his general confidence in making friends from other parts of the country.

He's going to try for NYO next, but I suspect is much more likely to be offered Inspire than the actual orchestra. Who knows though. His teacher is keen that he goes for it for the experience, so we'll see!

It's hard to know whether auditioning before they are realistically going to get a place is good. I think it's good experience but only if they can cope with it. Middle DD is dead keen on giving everything a go, sees it as a learning opportunity, knows it makes her more likely to get in subsequent years ( got into NYOS on third attempt). Youngest less keen if she thinks she might ' fail', which probably makes it more important for her to try as it makes it ok to not get something first time and keep trying. It's a fine balance though. She got reserve for NYOS which is good and it didn't dent her confidence as she knew it was just for practice. She has plenty of time anyway and I'm sure she'll get some NYO inspire if not this time, then next. And hopefully NYOS too.

I agree@horseymum I'm torn on NCO for the same reason. I've discussed with DDs violin teacher and she cautioned that she has known excellent players not get in so be aware it's v competitive but also that it's definitely worth a go if suggested in that context.

Thank you for your replies. It's great to hear that some of your kids have really enjoyed NCO and NYO. My daughter did her Grade 5 tuba last year and passed with distinction- I know some children will be at much higher levels but it might be worth having a go.

She also wants to audition for the National Children's Brass Band so maybe we'll give both a whirl and see how far she gets. Good luck to all of your kids auditioning too 🤞