November Music Thread

[Wafflenose]

Welcome to all musicians/ parents of musicians, young and 'mature', beginners and advanced, plus everything in between. This is one of the nicest corners of Mumsnet and the music threads were started for my older daughter towards the beginning of her musical journey, 7 years ago. Everybody on the thread was a beginner once!

I have recently seen "we're not a musical family", "I'm not musical" on here quite a lot, and would like to gently challenge that... perhaps you may not have found the right instrument/ teacher yet, or have no desire to play, but I think that everyone is musical. It's not a special something that is limited to certain individuals, although of course everyone's aptitude and natural ceiling varies. I have had the pleasure of teaching almost 1000 people to read and play music now, ranging in age from 3 to 96 and incorporating a range of additional needs, and I think they all got something positive from their lessons! What our young musicians most need from us - whether we play ourselves or not - is lots of encouragement, time and space to practise, and of course the constant taxi service and financial support we give to their lessons and ensembles!

I have two DDs, Goo The Energy Conserver (flute and piano, lapsed recorder and picc player) who is pretty lazy and complacent at the moment and just wants to enjoy her life, and Rara The Awkward (clarinet, cello, recorder) who tries hard... when it suits her! We have nothing special lined up this term, but possibly piano and clarinet exams for next term. Goo claims she wants to dust off her recorders and theory books to get another couple of Grade 8s before she leaves school. I'll believe that when it happens.

Over to you.

My stepdaughter learns the piano. Her teacher told me she is really ready for her first exam now. She’s 5 years old now. He’s going to enter her in for G1. I did grade one and two musical theory as a child. I also took singing lessons. I can also play the piano although I never had any lessons.

That's amazing for 5! I hope she enjoys the exam.

Catkind: very familiar, DS will also try to play without the music in front of him, or go off on a tangent!

Floottoot: thank you, it was the metal rings I was looking at closely on the Gewa straps. I'm wondering if it may be worth an expensive strap to avoid an even more expensive bump!

TaggieOHara: my DS didn't play that piece but I totally understand about being well and truly over the pieces but exam time. I hum them at work and probably annoy my colleagues!

April: that's amazing that your stepdaughter is ready for the exam. My DD is 5 and has recently started bashing away, mainly to copy her brother. She asked for lessons and I think she's not ready formally but she's done some pages of Tunes for Ten Fingers and Poco Piano with me. She seems to enjoy it. Being ready for an exam at that age is impressive, good luck to her, hope it goes well.

Hello! This is the first time I've read this thread. I really hope it is one of the nicest corners of Mumsnet!!

This is us: DS1 is in Year 9. Plays trumpet, abandoned the piano, noodles endlessly on the electric guitar, sings (in the safety of choirs, as it's not a voice you'd ever want to listen to for long), has recently bought a flugelhorn with his pocket money and took up the viola earlier this year. DS2 in Year 7. Plays violin well but a bit reluctantly, fell out with the piano, has taught himself the bass guitar and wants to be a rocker, and also plays the trombone. My husband and I both have music degrees: I play the cello (in various amateur orchestras) and am harbouring a desire to join a choir . DH played the flute and says he always hated it. He prefers singing but hasn't really motivated himself to find a choir for years. Both boys play in various ensembles at school / town / county. I spend a lot of time schlepping around after them but don't begrudge it one bit (nor the money) as I see the fun they're having and I hope they will always love their music-making. We don't do many exams as it's a stress (mainly for me) but I do try to get them to practice regularly and properly. Mmmmm - that's quite a challenge. I've also been known to bash through various piano accompaniments for them. Currently saving up to have a music studio (and new piano) built in the garden.

While I'm here, I have a big question. DOES ANYONE HAVE EXPERIENCE OF MUSIC AT INTERNATIONAL BACCALAUREAT LEVEL? My son's taking his GCSE options this year and is unlikely to do music. His school does the IB instead of A levels at sixth form, so I'm wondering how difficult it would be to pick up IB music at higher level if he hasn't done GCSE. I know school will have that answer but I don't really want to ask them until I've done a bit of my own research!

Welcome nerdy and yes there is a lot of schlepping around!
Lovely to hear that you have a flugelhorn in the family, such a beautiful sound.

Lovely to see some new faces!

April - grade 1 is amazing for 5! Especially on the piano, which tends to have a steeper learning curve to grade 1 than other instruments.

Nerdy - can’t help with the IB, as my DCs are much younger. But can empathise with the taxi/cheque-writing service!

Nerdy hi
I spend my whole life sitting in the car ( currently mostly in the dark) so I understand where you are coming from
I love a flugelhorn , really hoping ds falls in love with the sound as much as me at some point and asks for one ( he’s more of a lead trumpet - let’s see how high I can play today - kind of player though )

Welcome April, Kitty and Nerdy. I’d be interested to know about IB music too. DD1 is currently thinking about subjects she might do if she does IB. It would be a toss-up between music and art as they are both the same block.

Mending, your schlepping is slightly amplified with the geography of where you live!

Talking of schlepping, it’s the South Easterlies concert today which will be a long drive. In some ways nice to bring this year’s NCO adventure to a close.

Morning everyone. It's taken me a while to catch up with what everyone is up to. This is us;

I have 2 ds's-12 and 10 and a half. Ds2 is sporty. Ds1 plays violin and plays in a couple of local orchestras plus county orchestra. Music is his life,it's all he wants to do. Last month he auditioned for Junior Guildhall but wasn't successful,however he has been invited back for an assessment in February with the head of strings with a view to a further audition in the summer. He needs to work on very specific technical things and up his practice.

To be honest,I'm starting to wonder whether he has what it takes. He is so passionate and it does shine through his playing but clearly it's not enough as he does struggle with his posture and other fundamentals of technique. I was watching him playing in a concert last night- he was leading the 2nds but a lot of the time his violin was too low. Sorry for the pity post but feeling a bit low about it all today 😔.

Disorganised . I can empathise with the sitting in a concert and wanting to make technical corrections. My DS2, although musical, also finds the physical learning of the violin very difficult. This is linked to severe hyper mobility (diagnosed) and likely dyspraxia (not yet diagnosed). It takes a long time for him to embed good habits sufficiently well that he remembers all the time.

What has helped in the last year is approaching things from a more fundamental perspective. We have worked a lot on Alexander technique and start every practice session off with Alexander exes, followed by basic technical exes. He spends half his practice on this (15 minutes). I would very strongly recommend this type of approach for your DS. It may seem like a lot of time, but you will see the results quite quickly, especially in less demanding pieces.

Another thing that has helped is incorporating a simple posture routine into his performances. In orchestra, every time he has more than a bar of rest, he checks his posture (feet, hips, head, armpits (!), shoulders, bow hold). And every time he has a long note, he checks his bow hold and straight bow. We introduced this before NCO and it made a huge difference to his playing compared to Pro Corda (where he went back to bad habits).

A few thoughts anyhow. Feel free to pm me if you like xx

Disorganised I don’t know from a string point of view but he’s still so young and I think posture and technical issues can arise as they grow and have to adjust what they are doing every time they have a growth spurt . This happens to ds anyway . If there are specific issues and he really wants to go to the guildhall then I’d talk to his teacher about it - even if he still doesn’t get in his technique will be better . but I think everything that they said sounded positive at your recent audition . Ds’s previous teacher was obsessed with technique ( in a good way) but ds will still struggle at times - need to see how the new teacher will deal with this .

Also whilst guildhall is great your ds is enjoying playing in all his different ensembles and there’s more than one path to becoming a musician going to a jd is just one

I also had the pleasure of watching ds play alongside lots of really talented older trumpet players yesterday and I think they were all doing things slightly differently!! Disorganised I think technique issues are always there as something to be improved. Currently ds needs to work on lazy fingers !! I’m pleased his new teacher is working on this now I have a reason to nag when I walk past and spot it , though he seems to have sorted out playing with too much pressure - for now !! Which is lucky as he’s played almost constantly for the past week . But I know that these technique pluses and minuses will change as he works on different things . Also different teachers will have different things that they think are important

Thank you both Taggie and Trumpet for your lovely words. I'm feeling a bit dispairing today mainly because his peers seem to be racing through grades and going for scholarships and auditions and getting in where as ds isn't. He is autistic which is a major factor. Dh has always been very grounded about it and said that maybe he just doesn't have the talent 🤷‍♀️. It's possible. His teacher is amazing and is working v v hard on his technique but ds struggles to put it all into practice. The trouble is that whilst he plays in 2 ensembles and 3 orchestras,only 1 really focuses on technique so he is playing the whole time with his bloody violin pointing almost at the floor 😩🔫.

technique issues are always there as something to be improved. Absolutely trumpet. And sometimes things you have been working on and thought were fixed slip back in when a new focus comes in to play. They are all just at the beginning of their learning really and no one on here is the finished package just yet.

Disorganised I really feel for you as I know how much DS wants this and how much you want it for him. He is incredibly resilient in going for his dream and whatever comes from this process, he will be a better violinist at the end of it and will have gained so much from the experience.

Taggie's advice is spot on. Nothing to add except hang in there- it can take a long time to embed new habits. Xx

NerdBethoven - I don’t have IB experience (except having taken it myself donkeys year ago!) but we are looking at music A level for ds2. He will not have music GCSE as he is home educated and it can’t be taken as a private candidate because of the coursework. This has not been an issue at anywhere we have looked at. We have been told that instrument grade 6 (which is equivilant to GCSE) and theory grade 5 are sufficient replacements.

Nerdy, I taught flute at an international college that only did the IB, and had lots of pupils that were doing higher music. The minority were British - the rest were from all over the world, so no GCSE music for them. As long as your DS plays at a decent level, I'd say he'd be fine. The rest of the syllabus can be learnt as a stand alone course, although he might find the composition part more challenging if he hasn't done any before.

disorganised, your DS sounds wonderful. He WILL get there, even if it takes a bit longer than you'd hoped. Technique is a marathon learning experience - baby steps. As you say, it's tricky when DCs are playing in so many ensembles, where just getting through the notes is challenging enough; DS has hypermobility, which affects his bow hold, and it gets worse and worse, the more notes he has to play!
Also, posture inevitably gets worse in ensembles, where space is limited - take a look at the flute section, next time you go to a concert. 😱😱😱

Disorganised don’t worry about grades . Where we were yesterday they really don’t care about grades and whilst I know that some of the players there had grade 8 whilst they were still very young - ds still hasn’t taken it but in terms of joining in and enjoying the music making it made no difference yesterday . It is hard though when you feel that it’s something that everyone else is doing . Ds struggled a bit with imposter syndrome I think when he joined NCO as he hadn’t been on the exam treadmill ( no need we were never going to go for music scholarships) . He definitely does care now but it took a while.

I think the asd diagnosis may have something to to do with him not putting the posture into practice when he plays in orchestras . A bit like not wanting to do school work at home - the two might not seem to be connected in his mind . Could you try some sort of visual or written cue/ checklist similar to that suggested by Taggie but written down? When I worked in ASD support it was the visual or written cues that were the key - saying it often wasn’t enough , and it was the making links between different situations that the students often found difficult.

So happy to be on this thread!
Floot: that's reassuring. Tbh I'm not massively impressed by the GCSE syllabus (compared to old-fashioned o level that DH and I both did.) and it'd be a shame to sacrifice a GCSE option for it, although he'd probably find it fun. It's so hard choosing GCSE options with a view to sixth form and university when it's unclear what he wants to do in life (same for most 14 year olds I'm sure).Given how much he enjoys music I think it's very possible he might want to do it at university. I can't see him at music college as I don't think he has the patience and attention to detail that is required to be a serious performer.

I guess I should get my act together and get him to do some theory exams. At least - from what I recall - it's actual quite useful stuff to learn.

I just hope school is flexible about the IB thing. Schools can be a bit jobsworth but at least they know him.

Trumpet: I love your name! Also chuckling about the 'see how high' comment! That's mostly how my son is so I was quite surprised about the flugel. I think maybe he's trying to create a niche for himself which is quite cunning. Taking up the viola - I joke - is to teach him humility!

Nerdy, I did the old music O level too - no composition, no performance if you had taken ABRSM or similar exams at a certain level, and history and analysis of Purcell's Dido and Aeneus (I still can't spell it!) and Mendelssohn's Hebrides Overture.

I think grade 5 would be a good start, although it's much more straightforward than it used to be, so maybe grade 6 theory as well. There are so many free online resources available, your DS could probably teach himself with a bit of help from you.

Ha Nerdy!! I think maybe he's trying to create a niche for himself which is quite cunning this is precisely why Noo started viola at Easter 😂 it's working so far....

Disorganised I don't know if this would work but if DS agreed to it could you do a short video of him in practice and show him what you mean about posture? Obviously not if he wouldn't be comfortable with the idea. I had to get DS2 to record himself on the piano once to prove to him he'd got the timing wrong - he didn't believe me until he'd heard the recording! But I don't think he agreed to record anything again - he doesn't like to be wrong!
DS1 is 17 today and apart from the usual cash and a rash promise of driving lessons I got him a couple of books about music. This means I can save the usual music-themed T shirts and socks for Christmas! If anyone has some good ideas for music-themed stocking-fillers, let me know!