Beavers Blackmail?!

[cathbvr78]

Well, I just don't know what to think! My son has shown an interest in starting Beavers and turned 6 at the weekend. I emailed my local group and had a very odd email back.....they said they were full, but would be happy to put him on their waiting list (fair enough), then went on to say that if I became a volunteer however, they would look at his position in the list more favorably. I feel a bit offended really; it's not that i am adverse to helping - i help out at school when I can, but I really don't think it's appropriate to try and basically bribe people like this! Anyone else had any experience of this situation? Is this the norm? I haven't replied yet, as I'm still annoyed.

That happened to me CuntPuffin DS didn't enjoy it so DH takes him to a different activity instead. I made a commitment though and I enjoy it anyway.

They wouldn’t take in any more children til the volunteer concerned had finished their training and was committed to the group

I'm not sure that's true, as full leader training can take up to three years!
However, they probably would see how things were going for a term or so before committing to taking on more children.

What if a parent volunteers in order to get a place, so they take on another 6 kids from the waiting list, and then it turns out that the child hates the activity and stops going? Is the parent obligated to continue for the sake of the others, or do they get kicked out? What happens if the parents circumstances change so they are no longer able to help, do the kids get kicked out?

If the child, and then the parent left, then the colony size would probably just gradually decrease, as older beavers moved on to cubs, and no more started from the waiting list. As long as there are 2 adults, only one of which needs to be a leader, the colony can run. It's only when activities are outdoors/away from the usual meeting place that the ratios of 1 adults to 6 beavers, plus the leader in charge, comes into place. Usually you could get the extra help needed for this by asking for one off help from parents, or a parent rota

But you said you were annoyed and said it was bribery which did give the impression you didn’t understand how it works.

I am wondering though if you think the little one would really benefit whether you could offer occasional help rather than making a weekly commitment? If you work at a museum do you know about funding? Could you help them write grants? Could you offer casual help with badge work?

As someone said up thread it’s not really financial constraints that limit participation - it’s about all the parents putting in something to make it work

This is what happens in every beaver group. Our new admission next term will be totally from kids who’s parents lead beavers or cubs etc or who are on the exec committee or do a significant amount of fundraising. This isn’t the best thing as kids whose parents can’t help don’t get the same opportunity.

Ime scouts are very autism friendly so I hope a place comes up soon.

This isn’t the best thing as kids whose parents can’t help don’t get the same opportunity

It's true that it isn't ideal, but does tend to be the way it goes. If groups didn't offer places to the kids who's parents can help, there may not be any places to offer at all. At least this way, there will be some places for children who's parents can't help.

For instance, at our cub pack, there are 32 cubs, 5 of which are children of leaders - although none of the 4 cub leaders have children actually at cubs any more, they are all the children of scout or beaver leaders. However, we all originally volunteered when our children were at beavers/cubs, and have just carried on as our children got older.

But still, that means there are 27 cubs who's parents are not volunteers, so still plenty of opportunity for non-scouting families.

“This isn’t the best thing as kids whose parents can’t help don’t get the same opportunity”

Remember that every new leader means 6/7 more spaces as well as thenone their child gets.

And (puts on tin hat and hides behind barricade) while there are of course many parents who can’t help, there are also many who won’t.........

I don't mind the parents who don't help provided they don't provide a running commentary on how you should be doing things

In our case those 6 or 7 beavers are the children of cub and scout leaders or of the executive committee so kids whose parents don’t help can get in. It’s not always like this but if it wasn’t Beavers wouldn’t exist at all.

You maybe do a role like treasurer which would involve a few meetings and a bit of work from home? Totally get that some people can’t even do this.

"Blackmail" ??

I think you need a dictionary.

However, perfectly normal and reasonable to prioritise Leaders' dc over others on the waiting list. The fact they have a waiting list is testament to the fact they have more dc that want to be there, than can manage with the current number of Leaders they have. If they let all enquirers know they need more Leaders to meet the demand, then any one of those enquirers might think "Oh, okay, I'll give it a go", and, hey presto, waiting list either goes or is reduced. They have no way of knowing which enquirer it might be, so send the invitation to all.

Basic common sense really - they can’t take on more children because they don’t have enough adults. If they have more adults, they can take more children. If you’re helping it’s reasonable to expect that your child would one of them.

It can be a risk - I have known people volunteer to eat their kids in, then after 2-3 weeks announce that actually they can’t volunteer any more for spurious reasons, but lo and behold it would be u fair to ask their child to stop coming. Takes some shading out on the leaders part to get a feel for how genuine the offer is.

If you’re able to get there have you checked whether other local beaver groups have space as it can vary drastically from one group to another!

When my dds went to Brownies, ALL the parents helped out on a rota basis. It was usually about once a term. It wasn't optional, if the date you were given wasn't convenient you had to swap with someone.

It worked really well. Why don't Beavers do this? It shouldn't be up to a small group of parents to help out, it should be everyone's responsibility.

I think yes this is standard and I wouldn’t see it as blackmail

The people who run things are volunteers and require support to ensure things can carry on - simple as that

Also as PP said we have a parents Rota for beavers which requires all beavers parents to help - though probably a small minority’s do not and a small minority do far more than is needed but yes the assumption if you join beavers is you will as parents contribute

Also as PP said we have a parents Rota for beavers which requires all beavers parents to help

We also run a parent rota at cubs, which helps to cover us when we are out of the scout hut, which is when the ratios have to be adhered to.

The parents are great, and (almost) always show up when they are supposed to, but it's really not the same as having a permanent leader.
Leaders to training, help with planning, get to know the kids.

I'd be surprised if a colony/pack took on an extra 6 to 8 children without an extra permanent leader. I know I wouldn't! We are at 32 cubs, with 4 leaders, plus a parent rota. I wouldn't up the numbers to 40 unless I had more leaders, not just the parent rota (and I'm not sure I'd even do it then, due to the size of the hut)