April Music Thread

[Wafflenose]

We've managed to fill up the March thread, so I give you April's, around 10 hours early. Don't use it all up at once!

The music threads are for learners of ALL ages and stages, including beginners and adult learners.

My kids Goo (11) and Rara (8) break up from school today, thank goodness. Rara is off sick at the moment, in any case, but they both need a break. They did their music exams this week. Goo got a distinction for her Grade 7 Flute, and we are awaiting the results of Rara's Grade 1 Clarinet, plus a couple of my pupils. They will probably come on my birthday - the ABRSM ones often do.

Next term, we have a big community concert at the local high school - all the feeder schools take part. Goo could do Grade 7 Recorder and/ or Grade 4 Piano, but I don't think she wants to. Rara is doing Grade 3 Cello. My Year 6 Recorders have been asked to play in the local Festival gala concert, and I'm sure there will be primary school leavers' performances too.

or like that 12408pics.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/music.jpg

Fleur, no, it's usually 4-6 terms to bridge the gap from Grade 5 to 6. Like I said, though, they don't practise.

Waffle sorry, I thought you meant 4-6 terms since they start music till grade 6. lol 4-6 terms to grade 6 from 5 sounds right as I understand there is a big jump.

violinandpiano dd's teacher adapts the pieces to her stretch, now for example she's playing a grade 5 piece where there are lots of stretches she can't reach, the teacher either transfers the notes unable to reach in the other hand or takes one out. As long as it doesn't affect the overall performance it should be fine.

Question, please! (Sorry, it may be stupid question for many on this thread.)

When they have done the exam, how soon do they get the results? Do they get some sort of written certificate or just a email/text?
Sorry for such a silly question, but I really don't have a clue...

only we are past that stage luckily, dd had an obsession with death for a while and she kept talking about it and be really sad then suddenly she accepted it as a fact of life and moved on.

Irvine you get the results online if you made the entry online, an email telling you the results are available and also certificates through post.

Fleurdelise, thank you.

I am panicking it's few days till the exam, and ds making so many mistakes and not caring!!!!! Hopefully he will pass...Otherwise we will try again....

Fleur is right about adapting the pieces to suit small hands has no effect on marking as long as it sounds fine. When DS did G5 piano last year, one of his pieces had a massive leap. The teacher said the composer must have had a giant hand to have written such a piece! DS played the adapted version and managed to get 28 out of 30. Since so many little ones learn piano, I am sure this approach is very common. Any decent teacher should be able to help, I guess.

Only

Yes, Jazz sax player, also clari and flute to a lesser degree.
He went to music college on a jazz course.
I suppose some fields may be limited, but I think as long as you are the required standard for whatever it is you want to do then it doesn't matter when you start.
I do know what you mean about violin though. I suppose if you wanted to be a leader or soloist rather than rank and file you would need to start early.
You are right though, it's mainly about natural ability more so than schools attended and grades passed.
I've asked dh if he wishes he'd started younger as his sax sat under the bed for a few years as he had no interest. Then he heard someone on the radio and decided it was what he wanted to do.

Salty
Most sax players begin when they are older, my dd is one of the youngest in her school, there are few less than Y9, all the others are Y10 - Y13. It's a specialist music school.

only, you shared your view on the importance to start early with piano and violin a few times. It must be true as you are not the first person to say so (to me). I have never really challenged anyone this way but as you appear to be very knowledgeable (and also a great researcher), can you actually explain to me the possible difference between those who started at 3 or 4 and 6 or 7? Obviously if those who started early are talented and dedicated, it's quite impossible for those who started a few years later to catch up with them during in their younger years. But when they are all over 18, do you think the difference will still be noticeable? I just like to know why those first few years are so important.

Sorry, just to clarify... I understand the importance to start early with those particular instruments. My question is more like what's so different between 3-4 or so starters and 6-7 or so starters, as, if my memory is right, only was saying 6 or 7 would still be considered to be a bit too late. I purely wonder how those first few years make a noticeable difference in future.

I remember before 8 yo should be fine. Not too late. DD started 1 to 1 lessons from year 2 (about 6.5 y o), it is good age for our non musical family. She did not need our help to learn music. Our Friend's DS started from 4. Her son is very advanced but she had to learn piano with her son together, then help to learn at home because he is too young to read music.

Kutik you didn't ask me but I'll state my opinion anyway.

I think if you want a dc to start at 4 you need a teacher that knows how to teach by rote (Suzuki style for example) the dc doesn't learn how to read notes but can end up playing quite advanced stuff early on. However if you put a piece of music in front of them they won't be able to read it. It's more about learning by ear and advancing that way without being held back by music notation and technique.

However if you send a 4 yo to a traditional teacher (like ours for example) who will not progress to grade 1 till you can read grade 1 music and count the rhythm properly I don't think the 4 yo will progress much as they'll coast for a while until they are mature enough to understand notation, counting rhythm etc. Around 6?

That is the result of my research when dd was 4 and I was considering piano (as FIL is a musician and kept bugging me to start lessons). I decided to wait till she was 6 as she would have been quite frustrated to play twinkle twinkle for a couple of years without much progress and I wasn't willing to find a Suzuki teacher.

I know a professional pianist (she is well known) that started at 8. That did not stop her in any way to become who she is.

That doesn't mean I disagree totally with Only, I just think that if you have it in you (talent, passion, desire) and start by the age of 10 (I'm talking about piano and violin) it won't matter.

i don't really know the answer to all this, but i do wonder if it is all a bit self-fulfilling prophecy - if you start young, you have more time and less inhibition; if you start in the mid-teens you have to put yourself out there to be in the most 'junior' orchestras while a 7yo is leading the symphony orchestra:) And the mid-teen starter has a lot less time to practice than the younger child probably. Which doesn't mean that it can't be done, just various environmental factors have to be overcome? also - as an afterthought - i suspect far less parents (and some teachers) are heavily engaged with a 13yo learner than a 'young' learner? so the parents invest less time

I personally think 3 is for ballet, 4 is for swimming(there is water baby however we dont have luxury of time), 5 is for chess then 6 could be music(faster progress, waste less money and time and its not too late). Anyway, it will never be too late. I am still setting a goal to learn piano before my 3 yrs old start. Loose, you are my star!
Regarding to grade! We really dont have any one to compete, none of my friends have musical children, only academic success is counted. I just have a simple wish that she could be self sufficient in secondary and less expensive in term of activities as I plan to pay for her academic education. If she takes 2 yrs for a grade then I will challenge her if she should continue.

Only, Kutik: sorry about the violin vibrato question again, how much practice did you need to be able to do it comfortably. Is there a tip to share please. (Will watch your link tomorrow with her Only, thank you).

Oh, ladies, it is a bit too late now and my brains are not working and I am not sure when I have a chance to get to MN tomorrow therefore I will only say that it is not quite what I said, I think few of my comments were taken as one opinion though they had to be considered in context. I probably quoted some of the books but it does not necessarily means I agree with them. Dd's violin teacher started at 7. Dd started piano soon after 4. And I said for quite a few times that I don't think it was worth it. Even though we never had a single problem because of her age during first two grades at least.
Anyway thank you for your kind words about my research skills kutik, I don't think I really deserved it :) I will try to answer properly tomorrow (well...today actually :))

PS dd's last piano teacher started lessons at 14

Green, when we discovered we had a problem with vibrato -I think it was month or two before the exam. So if you need it before summer exam you have plenty of time. If you watch video and feel that it suits you it will probably take you (grrr, of course I mean mini green when I say you ;)) not more than a week to make it sound almost good ;)). I investigated this very subject myself just when we discovered we have this problem and the key is practicing- just try to do it every day and you (mini green!)) will be fine.
I don't remember what is requirement about vibrato at grade 5 but at grade 4 it was only introduction to vibrato. So should not be 'full vibrato' for grade 5, but 'vibrato in making' rather :)

Thanks all for sharing the views. only, my apologies for misunderstanding what you really meant. My memory is not so reliable. I have quite a few people telling me this 'golden rule' which you MUST start at a very tender age. So I may have mixed up the sources.

My DS is not going to be a soloist, so it's not a serious concern to us. But I was just wondering why it's so important to start THAT early, as, I saw quite a few cases that children who started late caught up with those early starters. Personally I couldn't think missing those first few years is so crucial. So I wanted to hear the explanation.

Green, sorry I haven't answered to you about vibrato.

DS started vibrato when the teacher suggested to add some. I remember it sounded odd to begin with, but he picked it up quite quickly so it doesn't sound that odd any more. It's still nowhere near perfect though (DS says Perlmen's vibrato is the best).

DS varies his vibrato to suit the music. As long as I know he uses four types - arm vibrato, wrist vibrato, finger vibrato and the last one is what DS calls 'shock vibrato' (like accent).

I don't think any specific exercise was taught. The teacher said that vibrato was something YOU know where to add, where you want to add, so it's not something you get the detailed instructions. Only tip DS got was to relax! He is very clumsy, and does some unnatural movements and very tense.... So relaxing his fingers seem to be his life-long target...

If minigreen is about to learn vibrato, I'm sure her teacher can give her some useful tips that suits to her? For my DS, 'relax' is the key word!

Kutik I have no idea why it is so important to start that early not that it's a bad thing if they want to take up an instrument when they are young -my 2 have always done things out of school like cubs, swimming gym etc just not music. ds just discovered that he liked the trumpet when he was offered school lessons ( it was just one of the many things he was enjoying trying out). Maybe it is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy, and sometimes it all ( as a non music parent) seems a bit like the magic circle !! and hard to break into- you have to start early, maybe as a parent be a muscician yourself and know the right people, so I've just decided ( with the help of things like this mumsnet page) to make sure that I'm well informed and can support ds as best I can ( not that he aspires to be a soloist either he wants to play in orchestras and open a jazz cafe ) Oh if only life were that simple !!

you have to start early, maybe as a parent be a musician yourself and know the right people

I can 'un-tick' all of them!

You must tell us when your DS opens a jazz cafe. That sounds so cool!

Thank you. We have been struggling with violin teacher since June last year so there hasnt been anyone showing us. We have to pick it up now. Will speak to our teacher about it next lesson.

Thanks all who answered my post.

DS loves the sax and is 100% self motivated which I think is the most important thing.

If he retains that who knows where he'll go.....

Green, I just remember one thing about wrist vibrato! The teacher was saying you do it as if you are knocking a door. Hope it helps.