Westminstenders: The Imperial March

[RedToothBrush]

There are many ways to enforce power indirectly using privilege. Jacob Rees Mogg knows every trick in the book and dresses it up as respectability rather than a subtle form or intimidation and deliberate exclusion.

It's not the stuff 'of the people'.

Meanwhile the newly crowned PM, is making rather a bug deal of how he is the man 'of the people', here to serve them and to deliver their will.

There's a big theme here about presenting as 'of the people' whilst simultaneously serving the interests of the elite and reestablishing its power over the people.

It's a theme that is set to run for some time, and is entrenched in Trumpism too.

This shift in power is particularly harmful to women it must be noted.

'Strong and stable' was 'weak and wobbly' and we should be mindful that in the era of reversed spin, what 'of the people' signifies.

We've long known about the authoritarianism at the heart of leaving thinking. It's only now that it's finally going to start stomping it's feet all over our freedoms and power.

The road back will be a long and hard one because we failed to spot the threat and the dangers of it.

I think the fact that the US won't do a trade deal with the UK if the NI situation isn't resolved is the thing that will save us from no deal.

A lot of Brexiteers want us to be like the US with low regulation, no workers' rights etc - and they need that trade deal. It could tip the balance in favour of a fudge on the backstop.

If we stayed in the CU and SM we wouldn't need it anyway but of course then we couldn't have our own trade deal with the US.

So accept the backstop and/or a special status for NI and move on?

Or don't accept it and find none of the trade deals, especially the hallowed one with the US, materialise.

Dilemma!

Does Johnson even need the DUP to vote the WA through? If it's "no deal or this deal" MPs will cave and vote for it.

I think one of the problems with Corbyn is that he’s behaving like a grassroots activist. This would be fine and dandy (even laudable) if he was a grassroots activist. But he’s not. He’s the Leader of the Opposition of the House of Commons and as such should be displaying and following an entirely different set of behaviours. If he cannot do that then he should have the sense to step aside for someone who can.

@Cailleach1

I would have thought England’s regions were places like “the south east” etc
Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland are not England’s region.

Y’know

I think the fact that the US won't do a trade deal with the UK if the NI situation isn't resolved is the thing that will save us from no deal.

Alternatively it will merely contaminate US politics (further) with more bickering between POTUS and congress. Is it really so hard to imagine Fox News running a news bulletin with "ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE" below a selection of Representatives and Senators ? Probably with a really nasty byline about their ethnic origins and loyalty to the US, just in case there are any "patriots" out there who feel like the second amendment needs protecting ?

Does Johnson even need the DUP to vote the WA through? If it's "no deal or this deal" MPs will cave and vote for it.

I think you need to answer the question before, which is: does Johnson want to vote the WA through ? I don't think he does. He really is serious about no deal.

@howabout

"The 70% are hardly about to start voting Boris Tory though"

Yes... but the 70% (like me) may vote Lib Dem.....

I agree with @QueenMabby. Corbyn was 66 when he became leader. Most of that time he's been a grassroots activist. Pretty hard to change the habit of a lifetime. Part of the reason he was voted in was because he appealed to other grassroots activists.

Sigh.

I've voted labour in every election since 1992.

I am a white, wc woman, aged 46 so they are not remotely intetested in me.

I will never vote labour again - they are run by momentum and pander to TRAs and the TWAW bollocks. I will not soon forget the past 3 years.

Labour can't win an election relying on the woke student vote, which they are so pathetically courting.

Ditto lib dems.

Ditto greens.

I'm so fucking tired of them all.

I'm tired of people (usually men) saying I need to ignore what's being done to womens rights in this country and globally. Brexit is "more important"....If you're a man, maybe!

People need to start paying attention to what's going on other than Brexit...I know it's hard...it's so all consuming...but we have to keep our eyes open to what else is happening (or not happening...)

We are being goverened by venal, self serving, competitive woke motherfuckers...and the opposition are the same.

I despair at what my country has become.

I agree we may never see another majority govt in my lifetime.

I may never be able to vote again.

"They cannot afford to ignore almost 1/3 of their base"

Labour are doomed if they ignore over ⅔ of their base !

There was analysis posted here of those Leavers who have gone to Remain over the last 3 years or who want a "soft" Brexit
They are almost all Labour, hardly any Tories

The Tory Brexiters vote is fanatical; the Lexiters vote much less so

I'm white and come from a working class background. I am gender critical.
I am very sure that a hard Brexit is the biggest threat to face working communities in the UK and women may well face the greatest challenges. They certainly do in the US which is where Brexiteers want to take us.
So I am happy to vote based on Brexit for now.

From the horse’s mouth (or arse, depending on your views).

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/30/dominic-cummings-tories-do-not-care-about-poor-people-or-the-nhs

If we are no longer allowed to be called women any more I'd argue that's more important.
For now.

Labour can't win an election relying on the woke student vote, which they are so pathetically courting. Ditto lib dems. Ditto greens. I'm so fucking tired of them all. I'm tired of people (usually men) saying I need to ignore what's being done to womens rights in this country and globally. Brexit is "more important"....If you're a man, maybe

buffy I get where you are coming from but surely it’s best to hold your nose and vote for the best fit for your political stance.

I’m usually a Lib Dem voter. Have I always agreed with all of their policies. Of course not, but they are the best fit for me at the moment.

Right now I’ll vote for whichever party has the sanest stance on Brexit.

And me. I’m perfectly prepared to lend my vote to any party that won’t take us out of the EU for one election.

If we are no longer allowed to be called women any more I'd argue that's more important

So who are you going to vote for (when the time comes)?

I think the fact that the US won't do a trade deal with the UK if the NI situation isn't resolved is the thing that will save us from no deal.

It might serve as a wake up call for those who believe that our future economic prospects rely on a trade deal with the US to realise that Ireland also has a 'special relationship' with the US. In fact I would say this relationship is stronger due to historical immigration and the large number of Americans that identify as of Irish descent.

Corbyn has zero large-oganisation organisational acumen. He hasn't had to have it previously. I don't know what goes on in the higher party echelons but I imagine party officials who are Brexiters pull his strings.

I gave up on Labour earlier this year - brexit and the trans nonsense they entertain and support.

I've scanned the local Lib Dems. Not helpful re trans issues but avowedly anti-brexit. It's what you can stomach these days.

So I am happy to vote based on Brexit for now.

I agree. If we can stop brexit then we have the rest of our lives to deal with woke idiots. If we no deal brexit then what is coming will make the woke idiots attack on women's rights seem like a stroll through candyland. The amount of naval gazing going on on the left seems like a symptom of the privilege of living in a society where all our needs are met so people have time to declare themselves non-binary and act like its important (with the caveat that plenty of people in the country do not have this privilege thanks to austerity ... but they aren't the people pushing the woke agenda). Come no deal brexit that privilege will be washed away. people worrying about getting medication and their money being worthless don't have time to worry about their pronouns.
Either we end brexit and fight the woke insanity without this nightmare hanging over our heads. Or we brexit and the disaster that is our new lives will kill it off - but what follows will be far worse and more aggressive, and will come with far wider support from the authoritarian right. Brexit is definitely more important and more urgent.

I would have thought England’s regions were places like “the south east” etc
Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland are not England’s region.

I think Cailleach was referencing Dominic Raab's deleted tweet where he said brexit would benefit all regions of England, including Scotland.

Speaking of WMD, what do folks make of the news that Trump has discovered who was really behind 9/11. Although I think it's a testament to his mental acuity that he is (a) 18 years behind the curve and (b) wrong ...

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-911-iraq-world-trade-center-deep-state-abc-news-interview-a8962081.html

(The correct answer, of course is E: Saudi Arabia ...)

I hear you. I do.
But I just can't do it.
It's clearer to me now that BJ is in no.10.
We are leaving the EU on 31/10/19. Soft, hard, no deal...whatever...that's the date.
I realise that makes me persona non grata (oh, the irony!) on this thread but so be it.

news.sky.com/story/sky-views-boris-johnson-is-not-churchill-and-brexit-is-not-the-second-world-war-11773843

An EU citizen texted me at the weekend: "Who, exactly is your country supposed to be at war against? Me?"
.....
The rich, as always, could find ways around the shortages by using their contacts and means to live almost as they were before.
The poor had no such luxury.
Doubtless so it will be so with a no-deal Brexit.

If the Treasury's predictions are born out and a deep slump ensues, it will be the poor hit hardest: because they always are, because they have nowhere else to go.

Too often, in recent weeks and months, the embrace by many of no deal seems to have become almost a symbol of virility, of both masochism and masculinity, of an almost ascetic embrace of the hardship it might bring.

Often, its leading proponents in the public eye do so, safe in the knowledge that they will be immune from its exigencies.
But the voters won't be.

We are leaving the EU on 31/10/19. Soft, hard, no deal...whatever...that's the date.

That's my thinking too. We'll just have to deal with the fall out as and when it comes. The die is cast.

I just can't put the trans issue above Brexit as to what's more urgent / important at this point in time (for the reasons given above which I won't bother repeating).

I know that Red referred to trans issues when deciding where her vote went, but I'm not sure which way she decided to go.

Was it Elements whose analogy was about your hair being on fire? I'm going with that thought with my vote.

I realise that makes me persona non grata (oh, the irony!) on this thread but so be it

I’m just interested to know how you would vote if the Brex party was gender critical. Would you feel happy lending your vote to Brex if they reflected your stance regarding gender? (I’ve probably worded that really poorly, apologies).

buffy noone is persona non grata

Everyone has to weigh up the pros & cons of each party
and our different povs / life experiences / current worries etc will weight some items differently

However, we are all (except for the occasional plop-in) thinking about what we are doing and looking at facts