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Brexit

Labour supporting remainers

13 replies

otterturk · 14/03/2019 18:26

How do you feel now that Labour has just abstained on an amendment to support a People's Vote? It's just nuts surely? Apparently a second ref is near enough Labour policy.

The margin of this being defeated was huge, especially compared to the v slim margin by which no deal was taken off the table last night.

All just advisory of course but...

OP posts:
Caticorn · 14/03/2019 19:17

I've only come on here to ask about this. To be honest, I don't fully understand it. But from where I'm sitting, Corbyn is refusing to nail his colours to the mast here....they don't want a referendum but they daren't vote against it because they promised it in their manifesto.
So basically they're just thinking about votes....politics more important than our country.
I'll be honest, I've been watching all this unfold with just a sort of morbid curiosity...I voted remain but it was a tough choice at the time.

Right now though, I am furious. A bunch of overpaid idiots responsible for my children's future do not even have the guts to place a vote on a key issue?

I hope someone can explain it to me because right now I intend to never vote labour again.

noblegiraffe · 14/03/2019 19:22

The People’s Vote campaign asked MPs not to vote for a second referendum tonight because it was too early. They want to vote for it next week.

Caticorn · 14/03/2019 19:45

Why is it too early? Brexit is a fortnight away. If anything it's far too late.

Caticorn · 14/03/2019 19:48

And also....if they don't want a referendum now, fine. Vote against it.
They're paid a lot of money. They are doing fuck all except vote. And they're not even doing that properly.

I don't claim to have a deep knowledge of Brexit (who does?) but I think our current leaders - on both sides- are failing us all right now.

Yaralie · 14/03/2019 19:51

If I was a Labour party supporter, I would be thoroughly ashamed of the LP appearing to facilitate a Tory brexit.

Caticorn · 14/03/2019 19:56

I am horrified, Yaralie. I've honestly not felt this angry before now.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 14/03/2019 20:26

Ask the people’s vote. Was there even the numbers to get a second ref through?

Yaralie · 14/03/2019 20:41

This amendment by the TIgs was not supported by the PV campaign and the Labour Party abstained. I would not be surprised if it is raised again when enough Mps think the time is right.

StarryGazeyEyes · 14/03/2019 21:14

It wouldn't have passed tonight, so they are waiting till there is a better chance, probably through the Kyle amendment. It really wasn't about JC or anyone else in Labour not supporting a PV but about ensuring the extension got through tonight and wasn't jeopardised by anything else. Even the PV campaign didn't want it voted on tonight as the numbers aren't currently there.

otterturk · 14/03/2019 23:46

Too early??! Sorry what?!

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BeersTonight2000 · 15/03/2019 02:54

Maybe labour is hoping that EU will agree to a much longer delay to Article 50 in the hope that a GE takes place before Brexit?

bellinisurge · 15/03/2019 07:00

Corbyn Labour has been dead to me ever since he became leader.

twofingerstoEverything · 15/03/2019 07:16

OK. Here's a message from Labour Say (if you support Labour and remain, why not join their support group/ sign up for their newsletters?):
This came by email almost immediately after the vote:

Quote:
I know that what's just happened in parliament seems weird, so I wanted to let you know what went down. Tonight parliament voted on three main things. The first of those was an amendment for a second referendum, the second was an amendment to provide something called 'indicative votes', and the third was the main motion, put forward by the Government, to support extending article 50. Here's what each of them meant.

Firstly – the second referendum amendment. This was not put forward by the people running the campaign for a public vote, but by a group of backbench MPs who became impatient. This is why the campaign recommended that MPs not vote for it, and it's part of why Labour decided to abstain on the vote. It's not necessarily because they don't want a People's Vote to happen, but because they believe that now is not the right time to push for a vote in parliament. That means that, while this motion may have fallen, the idea of a public vote is very much still alive.

Secondly – indicative votes. Put simply, this amendment would have provided an opportunity for MPs to show how they think Brexit should happen. What was crucial about this was that it could have been the start of the process for a People's Vote. The role that MPs can play here is to whittle down the options – no one wants a ballot paper with 40 different versions of Brexit – so MPs can make clear which of these choices they're willing to pass through parliament, be it Norway+, May's deal, Labour's deal, no-deal or whatever, and that could then be put back to the people. This amendment fell narrowly, by just 2 votes, which means that MPs have made the bizarre decision to decline to say what it is they are actually in favour of.

Thirdly – the main motion. This was a chance for MPs to prove that they are in favour of extending Article 50, having shown last night that they are against leaving the EU with no-deal. This passed easily. While this isn't legally binding, meaning it isn't now the default position of the government, it does show that parliament would rather extend the deadline than leave without a deal.

So, what does this all mean?

This means that, as we've known all along, there is only one way out of this – It's to put this back to the people for a final vote.

Unquote

What's happening is SO complicated that I think it's difficult to follow the nuances, so I'm finding these campaigners' explanations really helpful!

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