What does the rest of the world make of Brexit?

[poshredrose]

As above really. What do you make of Brexit if you're not in the UK?
I don't want this to happen, no one i know (that will admit it anyway) wants this to happen.

Tabitha, my ballot paper was very clear.
It asked me if I wanted to leave the EU or remain in the EU.
Which word don't you understand?

The people I know who voted Leave all knew exactly what they were voting for.....to leave the EU.

Oh FFS. How come you lot still don't have a fucking plan 3 years later then?

Did you see the segment on British "expats" on Channel 4?

Talk about turkeys voting for Christmas. It will make my day if they lose their healthcare.

Bloody principles have cost people their jobs

Irish. Disbelief that you voted to leave. Think you are isolating yourselves from the rest of the world. Incredibly selfish not giving 2 fcuks about the rest of us in Europe. Though not surprised sure we always knew what you were like and ye can't be trusted (years of building up good relations destroyed overnight). But basically think ye are bat sh1t crazy (like who would ever listen to that mad lad Boris Johnson. ...!).

I also believe that some things are more important than money

Almost always said by people who aren't living hand to mouth.

I'm fucking terrified of brexit making us poorer, because I'm poor enough already thanks.

My concern about Brexit is the safety of people living in NI. I feel the UK are treating them appallingly. I can't believe the UK have left things get this far or that they allowed a vote with no plan of action. It's very irresponsible.

I also believe that some things are more important than money

No one said that you lose either money or other things, you can lose all of them, global influence, diplomatic power, research collaborations, cultural exchanges, peace in Europe...as well as various things that depend on money like the NHS, the educational system from nurseries to HE, social welfare provisions, etc.

Can't wait for this magnificent plan to emerge from the darkness and show those furriners how ace we are. It's gonna be so brilliant. The best plan. You won't believe how much winning there will be.
Bloody Hell. Tick fucking tick.

48 days to go.

I’m Irish, initially I was shocked about the vote and actually felt a lot of sympathy for the people who voted remain. I live close enough to the border and I would hate to see it back to where it was years ago.
As it stands I think everyone here has Brexit fatigue. Every single day we are hearing about it in some form or another. Watching British politics / parliament was mildly amusing at the beginning but now it’s just unbelievable. It’s honestly like some political soap opera. It seems like the energy around Brexit is chaotic and no one is making any sensible decisions.
As an aside, I often see people getting annoyed on MN about the Southern Ireland reference. This is what I say, I was born in the South of Ireland ( literally). I live in the East of Ireland now. I have visited Northern Ireland many times and I love to go on holidays to the West of Ireland 😊 When I meet someone who is not from Ireland I say I live in the Republic of Ireland. That’s just me though ! Others may have a different description of it. Hth

Seething1234
But basically think ye are bat sh1t crazy (like who would ever listen to that mad lad Boris Johnson. ...!).

The strangest thing, that outsiders can't get their heads around, is the way the British lionise people like Boris Johnson and JRM In most other countries they'd be considered a joke, certainly not people with legitimate aspirations to head parties or governments. What the British view as 'lovable eccentricity' we see as 'fucking idiots who are an embarrassment'. Neither of them are going to lose jobs or house or security as a result of Brexit, and no doubt JRM's fortune will increase significantly. But they keep on pushing for a hard Brexit that will leave the UK completely isolated, with a few miserable trade deals with small African countries. Anyone who believes Liam Fox about all those wonderful trade deals just awaiting a signature needs their head examined.

Changing tack...I'm still wondering if the Irish government has swiped Arklow Shipping. They (Arklow Shipping) should never have agreed to tie up all their ships supplying the UK, anyway, I'd consider it unpatriotic when we are a small island historically so dependent on the land-bridge, which will no longer work for us because of Brexit.

They (Arklow Shipping) should never have agreed to tie up all their ships supplying the UK,

Maybe I've misunderstood but I don't think that was ever the idea. Arklow were just Seaborne's 'backers', they specialise in bulk freight and they don't seem to operate any RoRo ships to start with.

Well, it's all very interesting, wheels within wheels. No explanation of why exactly Arklow pulled out of the arrangement.

I would guess that Arklow's insurers said "no fucking way are you having this much financial exposure".
I love JRM's idea of the Irish Deep State . Laugh my fucking arse off at that one. Let's hope this fantasy Irish Deep State pulls the plug on his hedge fund.

I've been reading up on 'Deep State' claims. Mostly, it's a way of saying "IT'S NOT FAIR!!" when the status quo seems to prevail, or when someone who works for govt produces evidence which seems to support sticking with status quo. Self-certifying prophecy. Like planning to drown a woman to prove she wasn't a witch (since only witches can survive drowning).

Small proportion (

It's great conspiracy theory stuff, coz you get elevated social status by being Someone In The Know

I have a friend who's all over every conspiracy theory on FB like a rash :( She's a sweet person, and very clever in that 'great at exams but doesn't have a titter of wit' way. Far from 'elevated social status', the only people who post on her FB page are other conspiracy nuts she's befriended online (half of them Russian bots, I'd swear), all her real life friends just throw an occasional Like at photos of flowers or of her children.

Within conspiracy theory circles, being an adherent & spreader (is perceived to) elevates your status. Eg., The main spreaders & embracers of false rumours on twitter are relatively new online & have few social connections (study that excluded bots to figure that out). Like the Brexit & Trump voters that swung it in 2016, people who typically are least likely to engage with conventional political processes.

Conspiracy theories are easy to spot, if you simply break them into chains. Eventually you'll get to a point where the chains logic breaks ...

Case in hand, Apollo landing nutjobs. You don't need to be a scientist or scientifically minded to appreciate the counter argument that if the landings were faked then the USSR - who had the capability to know - would have immediately called it out as a hoax. It's a killer punch.

But no. "you have to understand" goes the conspiraloon response "that they are in on it too ..." etc etc.

I am trying to understand conspiracy theorists. I feel optimistic that they can be countered. Even Trump's projection & name-calling, good strategies will be found to counter those.

Circular logic is a common feature of CTs. Sometimes more than one explanation IS offered for something observed, but facts keep getting twisted to rule out the non-CT explanations until only the CT remains.

I just love how Ireland is being identified as another target to dump blame on, as Leavers realise how toxic Brexit is becoming.

Heard a great phrase on the radio this morning and can't remember who was speaking.....
it was to the effect that the only thing that Leavers are stockpiling is scapegoats.

Feels right.

the only thing that Leavers are stockpiling is scapegoats.

Conspiraloons - like Brexiteers - also seem to have this terrible "if not X then Y" view of the world, which is tiresome at best. In terms of Brexit, it's the assumption that anyone who voted Remain must think the EU is heaven on Earth, etc, etc. When in reality (which is where conspiraloons tend not to live) no Remainer has ever said that.

Taking the most famous conspiracy theories of the 20th century - the Kennedy assassination - most of them appear to be predicated upon some inconsistency in reporting, or something which was corrected as more facts and investigations were uncovered and carried out. Not helped by the fact that the Secret Service made a complete start-to-finish ballsup of the entire situation. Starting with forcing a non-medical photographer to take the autopsy pictures (so they're out of focus and useless) through to stealing the Presidents body at gunpoint and pissing all over Texan state law.

We're back to irregular verbs again ... I make a small mistake, you are part of the conspiracy and they were covering up the scale of the deception ...

What politicians seem to forget is that the retreat from reality is the refuge of people who are scared or who feel powerless.

At the heart of Leavers vehemence (I think....and I may be arrogantly presumptuous, but am interested to debate this), is a sense of a "lost place in the world".

There has always been a strain of English British person who relied on faded Imperial power for their own sense of authority or power.

I have worked in several parts of the UK, and there would always be one person who'd come out with a variation of "oooh, you're Irish, Paddy backwards, drunken, ooh you all curse so much, don't you still belong to us anyway ".

If that sense of power is threatened, then what is left?
At the moment, not a lot.

Re-orientating your national mindset away from the Imperial Lord and Master, to, being yet another nation making it's way in the world, forging alliances and friendships on the basis of mutual respect- that's a jump that hasn't seemed to happen.

JRM's looney notions of the Irish "deep state" is reflective of failing to treat your neighbours as equals.

After all, if we're "only" Irish, then how could we possibly have caused the breakdown of the ferries contract, without darker forces at work?

After all, if we're "only" Irish, then how could we possibly have caused the breakdown of the ferries contract, without darker forces at work

That split thinking - (like Schroedinger's immigrant) again.