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Brexit

Westministenders: Reality Bytes

985 replies

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2018 22:39

Tonight the Corbyn and McDonnell Labour Party supported the Tory Party in improving the tax allowance for higher rate tax payers.

Yes you read that right. Did you even blink?

You've been so conditioned into seeing non existant opposition which seems to go against everything the Labour Party stand for that you no longer are shocked.

That's what 2 and a half years of Brexit has done to you.

You no longer care that Boris Johnson got £14,000 from the Saudis a couple of days before the Khashoggi murder. You know longer care that the former Defence Secretary is employed for £75,000 a year to advise a major Saudi Investor.

You are just happy that Trump hasn't started a war with Iran or North Korea yet. And hasn't started a civil war. (Though he's trying hard and next week is his best opportunity to stir it all up). You aren't surprised to hear that predictions are that the Democrats will fail to make gains in the mid terms.

You've suffered the 4657 story about how Therea May is just about to be challenged for the leadership.

You've heard about the squad set up at the Home Office to clear up all the cases the media get their hands on as the latest burning injustice. You are hearing that EU nationals who have been promised they are 'safe' are being subjected to questions about their right to stay. And you just shrug and say, "Yeah well thats the Home Office for you. The Bastards". And you do mean it, but you are so jaded by it all. And you worry that another 12 months from now, you won't even be interested in another story like that, and the press will stop printing them as they no longer interest the reader. What happens to your friends, your family, or even you then? Who is going to care then?

And then you have today.

A day where you hear that Bannon is being investigated by the Senate Intel Committee, Farage has been upgraded to the FBI's Really Naughty List and Banks has (FINALLY) been refered to the NCA. (We were only speculating on the possibility, on the 26th March...)

And you go 'Ooooooooo maybe there is hope'.

Maybe we COULD remain in the EU and avoid Turnip Soup and wiping your arse with leaves because of the national bog roll shortage. Or at least get a decent deal which suits us as a nation. Maybe, just maybe!

And that lasts for about 2 minutes before you log into twitter and the very first thing you see this:

Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn
Excl: David Cameron tells friends he’d like a return to frontline politics, and fancies Foreign Secretary
www.thesun.co.uk/news/7639377/david-cameron-return-to-politics/

And you let out a high pitched screech as if you are were a dying cat as you remember this is 2018, and it just wants to beat the life out of you.

On the plus side, it shows you do still care enough to think 'Don't let that fucking bastard anywhere near power ever, ever again.'.

Ho hum.

Keep on, keeping on. Don't let the bastards win.
Keep caring. It matters.

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Thread gallery
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RedToothBrush · 05/11/2018 17:21

Robert Peston @Peston
Senior Tory MP on state of Brexit talks: it has the feeling of reaching crunch point. We are being called in to talk to Whips etc about our ‘current thoughts’. I have constituents starting to panic about access to medicines in event of no deal. Awful we’d put anyone through that

Keep writing those letters.

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BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:22

Robert Peston: Crunch Time

https://m.facebook.com/1498276767163730/posts/2202169240107809/

Because the British government – not Brussels, not the EU 27 leaders – has decided that unless there is a deal this month,
the default option of a no-deal Brexitt* becomes the probable outcome.

“We don’t want no-deal. But because of the parliamentary timetable it becomes very hard to avoid if talks continue past this month,”
said a senior member of the government.

“And that is why negotiation have massively shifted up a gear, with officials working through the night.”

RedToothBrush · 05/11/2018 17:24

Raab does not want a deal.

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BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:25

The UK government is to establish a new unit to counter "fake news", Downing Street has said.
🤯
I checked it wasn't 1 April
Will this new unit start countering No. 10 ?

www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-42791218

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:28

I don't think Raab actively wants No Deal,
but I think he is totally against breaking any UK red line, both for his own career plans and to avoid a Tory civil war.

So, if the decisions are left to him, it'll be No Deal - and blame the EU

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:32

Tony Connellyy@tconnellyRTE*

Here's my latest on Brexit, having spoken to various officials this morning:
There's growing pessimism about a breakthrough this week,
basically because London is still "negotiating with itself",
or "test balloons are being floated above the Thames", as one diplomat put it
12:02 PM · Nov 5, 2018 ·

Next Monday, 12 Nov is reportedly when the UK will have to switch to No Deal as mainstream,
because the govt thinks this is the latest date that allows enough time to prep.

They are wrong - that date is long past, as reported by e.g. the National Accounting Office

However, there may well be an announcement on Monday, plus "just a precaution and we shall continue negotiating, bla bla "

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:37

Tony Connelly@tconnellyRTE
London wants the UK-wide customs arrangement to be the one and only backstop, although it accepts there would have to be special add-ons for NI. In other words, a customs union will only deal with some of the controls, it won't deal with SPS and related checks...
...

This slide from A50 Task Force in May spells out what other checks are required, even if the UK is in a customs union with the EU.
Slide on customs controls
ec.europa.eu
...
Dublin and the EU Task Force are still insisting on a Northern Ireland-specific backstop as a final safety net if the UK-wide customs arrangement doesn't work.
...
One Irish source says:
"There’s no question of subordinating or dissolving the NI backstop. It must be legally operable, and it must apply unless and until [something else comes along]. There’s absolutely no change in our position, there’s no change in the EU’s position."
...
So these are two major points of contention: will the NI-specific backstop be replaced, or "dissolved" by a UK-wide customs backstop with regulatory bolt-ons for NI? Or will the NI-specific backstop, the "all weather" backstop, still have to feature in the text?
...
The big question is whether or not the UK insists on a time-limit or a "termination clause" for the UK-wide customs backstop.
Essentially, the more London insists on a termination clause, the stronger the need for the NI-specific backstop to remain, according to one source.

< 🤦🏻‍♀️ obviously >

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 17:38

oops, the slide with the additional controls the EU requires, to stay within WTO / WCO rules and safeguard the SM:

Westministenders: Reality Bytes
1tisILeClerc · 05/11/2018 18:12

{"Edwin Starr, famously asked "War ! What is it good for ?"}
Frankie said it too! Relax was 'banned' by the BBC.
I went to a 'dinner party' the other evening and there were 14 people there. 9 European countries residents were represented plus USA and Canada, so there were only a couple actually from the same country. It was one of the most inspiring events showing what unity can achieve. It makes my decision to leave the small mindedness of too many in the UK feel like a good decision.

ElenadeClermont · 05/11/2018 18:12

He said every town he went through was rubble, and if a few silly rules were the price of avoiding that again, it was cheap.

My favourite photo from Budapest in 1965. 20 years after the war. Still covered in bulletholes.

Westministenders: Reality Bytes
DGRossetti · 05/11/2018 18:24

Oops

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-theresa-may-leo-varadkar-irish-border-backstop-negotiations-eu-a8618421.html

Theresa May forced to call Leo Varadkar to calm Irish anger over border

Theresa May called the Irish prime minister on Monday in order to calm anger in Dublin over comments made by her Brexit secretary, Dominic Raab.

Mr Raab reportedly tried to backslide on a commitment the UK had made to prevent a hard border with the Republic, suggesting the “backstop” policy should expire after just three months.

The taoiseach’s office said the prime minister has “sought” the call after the comments, said to have been made in a private meeting with officials, emerged.

Leo Varadkar told Ms May he was open to a “review” mechanism for the backstop, which is controversial with Eurosceptics, but that this could not amount to “a unilateral decision to end” it by the UK. Ms May told her counterpart she was still commited to a full backstop, despite Mr Raab’s comments.

Speaking earlier in Dublin Mr Varadkar had said a time-limited backstop as suggested by Mr Raab would not be worth the paper it was written on.

“As a government we’re working very hard to get an agreement, ideally by the end of the year, but you know one thing we can’t countenance is any idea that there’d be a three-month limit on the backstop,” he told the Irish media.

“You know a backstop with a three-month limit on it or an expiry date of that nature isn’t worth the paper it’s written on, and what the UK government has signed up to is a legally operative backstop that will apply unless and until we have a new agreement to supersede it – and I think it’s reasonable for us to expect a country like the United Kingdom and a government like the UK government to stand by its commitments.”

Many Tory Eurosceptics are adamant that any backstop must be limited in time, to avoid the UK being signed permanently to a customs union with the EU after it leaves. The EU has said a time-limited backstop would not be a backstop because it would not prevent a hard border in all circumstances.

Giving an account of the two leaders’ conversation, a spokesperson for the taoiseach said: “Both leaders emphasised their commitment to avoiding a hard border and the need for a legally operable backstop.

“The prime minister raised the possibility of a review mechanism for the backstop. The taoiseach indicated an openness to consider proposals for a review, provided that it was clear that the outcome of any such review could not involve a unilateral decision to end the backstop.

“He recalled the prior commitments made that the backstop must apply ‘unless and until’ alternative arrangements are agreed.”

European Council president Donald Tusk tells UK to stop ‘wasting time’ and find Irish border solution within two weeks

A Downing Street spokesperson also gave an account of the call, providing less detail. They said: “The prime minister spoke to the taoiseach this morning to take stock of the progress being made in the negotiations, including on the Northern Ireland backstop. In a constructive conversation, the prime minister and the taoiseach discussed the remaining issues.

“They agreed that the intention was that the backstop should only be a temporary arrangement and that the best solution to the Northern Ireland border would be found by agreeing a future relationship between the UK and the EU. In order to ensure that the backstop, if ever needed, would be temporary, the prime minister said that there would need to be a mechanism through which the backstop could be brought to an end.

“She affirmed the UK’s commitment to the Belfast Good Friday Agreement and to avoiding a hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland. The prime minister and the taoiseach agreed that discussions should continue.”

Mr Varakdar this morning warned that the United Kingdom was “in many ways is a divided kingdom”, noting that “the cabinet seems divided, the government seems divided, parliament is divided and that has made it very difficult to come to an agreement”.

He added that he would prefer to negotiate with a country that was not divided, but that “we don’t, so we have to work through”.

The Independent has launched its #FinalSay campaign to demand that voters are given a voice on the final Brexit deal.

Sign our petition here

1tisILeClerc · 05/11/2018 18:25

Sadly there are too many that think the scene depicted in that picture by Elenade 'can't happen' in the UK.

Peregrina · 05/11/2018 19:08

Like Elenade's picture, I can remember bomb sites still in Sheffield in the early 1960s. They gradually cleared the rubble and rebuilt during that decade.

BlueEyeshadow · 05/11/2018 19:22

For those worried about the medicine situation, I got an email about this from More United today: www.moreunited.uk/no_deal_brexit_medicine_shortage

woman11017 · 05/11/2018 19:59

Send your MP a voicemail via finalsay.app

RedToothBrush · 05/11/2018 20:18

Jim Pickard @PickardJE
only 4000 haulage permits available in the case of no-deal Brexit for 38,000 British lorries that go abroad...but Grayling has a solution....

FT Westminster @ftwestminster
UK haulage sector braced for no-deal Brexit ‘lorry lottery’

OP posts:
woman11017 · 05/11/2018 20:18

64% of 20 000 surveyed for Channel 4 survey want to keep FOM.
Farridge a bit testerial.

woman11017 · 05/11/2018 20:26

63% Blush for FOM
Lots of cheers for final say. Farridge got 23% wanting him as a leader. Grin. Little froggy face going even weirder.

Lucas is great.
Gauke and Gardiner are like Stasi apparatchiks

On channel 4 now.

MyBrexitIsIll · 05/11/2018 20:32

www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-theresa-may-conservative-eu-negotiations-deal-a8618531.html

The way in which the European Research Group (ERG)- a right-wing, pro-Brexit support group for MPs which Rees-Mogg chairs - talk about their PM is unedifying and derogatory. One of them recently told me that, for all their threats to remove her, "we'll keep her in place for now" because "she's our puppet, we're pulling the strings". An up-and-coming minister confirmed this to me, complaining that the ERG "genuinely don't mind making people poorer because for them it's all about ideology" and conceding that "they are calling all the shots".

TM a puppet to the far right isn’t surprising. What ismore so is to see such a news appearing in the main press.
A PM, in charge of one the most important decision a country can take, just a puppet.... :(
It’s nit going to help our position with the EU is it?

BestIsWest · 05/11/2018 20:41

I think 23% for Farridge as leader is appallingly high.

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 20:43

The Conservative Party will break Theresa May at the worst possible moment

The country is still very split - looks now more of a Tory / Labour split among voters
Overall 47% would rather no deal than Remain !

Hence why I'm not keen on a 2nd ref - it could easily result in no deal, which we would be stuck with for many years and permanently destroy the economy

whereas - imo - if we crash out with no deal but without the public voting for that, we could very soon apply to join EFTA as an emergency

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/theresa-may-conservatives-brexit-no-deal-politics-westminster-leadership-a8618456.html

The Tories want a hardline version of Brexit that the country does not. If they try to force it on May, the consequences are not hard to foresee
...
53 per cent of voters to 47 would rather we stayed in the European Union than exited with no deal in place.*
*
But Conservative voters take the opposing view. 65 per cent prefer leaving without a deal to remaining in the EU.
< so Labour voters must be just as strongly for remain >

MyBrexitIsIll · 05/11/2018 20:43

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/05/pro-europe-mps-brexit-conmen

Brexit expresses a part of what it means to be British, albeit not the part anyone who campaigned for it had in mind. It is the national tendency to find satisfaction in being dissatisfied. It is the spirit of picnics in the rain and self-congratulation for having stuck with a plan long after it stopped making sense.

It looks increasingly plausible that Theresa May will complete a deal that pleases no one and is approved by parliament anyway. The outline is coming into focus. To keep the Irish border friction-free, the UK will be locked into maximal regulatory alignment with Brussels. There will be some dodgy escape clause, sold to Tory Eurosceptics as a future portal to the mythical global trade utopia of Canada-plus.

[…] That model would be too soft for the hard nuts and too hard for the softies.
[…] Downing Street would need votes from Labour MPs who like neither Brexit nor May. Why should they, or the pro-European Tories who agree with them, bail the prime minister out? The answer is fear – of no-deal chaos and of constituents who just want out

What that article doesn’t look at is whether it is a good idea to even try to stay in the EU. The country is sill bitterly divided....

BigChocFrenzy · 05/11/2018 20:46

The ERG don't care if other people become poorer.
However, Mogg, Redwood and many others in the ERG reportedly stand to make a lot of money from no deal,

or, to be exact, from a deal that allows a bonfire of current regulations on workers' rights, the environment etc
and that allows the NHS to be sold off