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Brexit

Westministenders: A week in politics is a long time....

975 replies

RedToothBrush · 05/11/2017 12:28

Lost track of politics in the last week or so?

Someone asked how do I keep on top of this? I’ve struggled this week there is so much going on.

Brexit seems to be on a bit of a back burner and we have become utterly swamped in mud and sleaze and corruption allegations

So here is a summary of the last week:

  1. Government defeated over the impact reports due to an ancient parliamentary protocol. They must release papers to the public though this is likely to be heavily redacted.
  2. Currently we are holding talks about talks with the EU. Instead of speeding up talks. They are annoyed at us for this.
  3. Baroness Anelay, the minister responsible for getting the Repel Bill through the Lords, quit citing an injury caused by jumping out of a helicopter several years ago. She was the second person to quit this role. Lord Bridges quit saying it was impossible task.
  4. Michael Gove has joined the Brexit Cabinet, which now has a majority of Leavers.
  5. There is currently no one employed at the Brexit department for strategic planning.
  6. Brexit Bill likely to face even more opposition in the face of Williamson’s self promotion. More Remainers who have been loyal to May talking of joining the Rebel Forces.
  7. The has been a threat to rig the Lords to pass the Repel Bill according to Lord Adonis
  8. Clegg, Adonis and Clarke went to see Barnier. Farage got jealous.
  9. Talks for Stormont broke down. No direct rule but not home rule. Who is ruling is a mystery, but the same can be said in England at present. DUP are not getting their dosh.
  10. FTA may not be possible on lines UK want as it would be better than Canada and South Korea and that’s not legally allowed. The real problem for the UK is services.
  11. EHCR related issues – prisoner voting rights and letter to Romanian which brings into question whether the EHCR is deliberately being flouted.
  12. Clause in the data protection bill which allows it to be ignored ‘cos immigration’.
  13. The Electoral Commission are being sued for allowing over spending by Vote Leave
  14. Arron Banks is being investigated by the Electoral Commission over how he donated to political causes
  15. UKIP whistleblowers reported donations they thought were odd and not declared but only just has come to light
  16. Arron Banks is winding up a charity under investigation by the Charities Commission
  17. Arron Banks paid for Kate Hoey to go to Washington DC.
  18. Lord Ashcroft apparently exposed by the Bermuda hack, like Robert Mercer
  19. Steve Baker reported for taking money from the mysterious donor to the DUP
  20. Priti Patel breaks ministerial code with an undisclosed trip to Israel with lobbyist. May says she has done nothing wrong, despite it being clear breech of the rules.
  21. Michael Fallon quit over multiple incidents
  22. Damien Green embroiled in accusation over Kate Maltby. Also having a fight with former counter terrorism copper who he has history with over ‘extreme porn’ found on his computer during a raid. Copper previously said he had been set up in the paper but dropped the accusation. Green is denying everything
  23. Charlie Elphicke has had the whip removed and case has been referred to police. Says he has done nothing wrong and isn’t even aware of what he has been accused of.
  24. Steven Crabb under investigation for sexting. Has apologised.
  25. Michael Garnier under investigation for dildo buying. Has apologised
  26. Daniel Kawcyznski allegedly tried to set up dates with aides and wealthy friends
  27. Dan Poulter reported by fellow tory MP Andrew Bridgen for allegedly putting hands up skirts. Whips told in 2010.
  28. Chris Pincher alleged pound shop Weinstein who attempted to untuck the shirt of former Olympic rower and tory activist Alex Story.
  29. Gavin Barwell former whip and May’s special adviser. Broke special advisor code by tweeting politically controversial things. Is accused of being complicit in hiding the bodies and not taking action.
  30. Gavin Williamson gave himself a promotion and pissed everyone off. As former whip knows all the dirt but is vulnerable as a result of that, as he didn’t report or discipline offenders.
  31. ‘The Lift Lunger’ – as yet unnamed Tory MP said to have ‘attacked’ Labour MP in taxi. Date rape drugs possibly involved.
  32. Boris Johnson, Alok Sharma and Tobias Ellwood all named as having contact with the mysterious Maltese professor named in the Papadopoulos indictment.
  33. Farage makes anti-Semitic remarks on LBC. That’s Farage, a person of interest to the FBI.
  34. Three indictments in USA for Trump Russia. Which implicate a whole load of people by association.
  35. Some stuff is going on in Saudi Arabia which should have half an eye kept on it.
  36. Jared O’Mara, Clive Lewis, Ivan Lewis and Kelvin Hopkins on the Labour Shit List. Also a rape allegation against a Labour activist which was shut down by a senior Labour figure

This week the Repel Bill and the Budget. Plus no doubt, lots more scandal.

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37
TheElementsSong · 10/11/2017 15:24

Thing is, the People (our esteemed forum Brexiteers notwithstanding) don't seem to have the foggiest clue what it is They have Willed (apart from the Thing that must not be named). Hence all the special pleading for allowances, concessions and exemptions for their special area/sector/personal interest: "Oh, we didn't mean That when we said we wanted Brexit for all that nourishing Sovereignty and Control!"

Cailleach1 · 10/11/2017 15:27

I wonder if it will get as far as a withdrawal agreement. i posted before a link discussing how no agreement was better than a bad agreement for ireland. no irish gov't will vote for a hard border on the island of ireland. it will happen anyway if brexit. so why do uk/well gb any rewards for it. certainly with the way they contemptuously and arrogantly ignored it's effects for whole island; ni as well.

if there is no withdrawal agreement, ireland will have leverage in future deal through veto.

Did G. Adams say that about gfa in withdrawal agreement? mark durkan and colum eastwood of SDLP both mentioned it. If GFA preserved post brexit, north-south bodies could come into their own and ni not be cut off from eu. Three strands of cooperation in gfa. Two of them, East-West (British and irish govt's) and the north-south bodies (irl-ni) un or underdeveloped.

How ironic for die hard brexiteer unionists if brexit gave rise to greater cooperation with ireland. that is why i think they and their wrecking ball fellow travellers will try to bring the gfa down.

www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/brexit-north-will-not-be-treated-differently-to-rest-of-uk-says-dup-1.3286945

i saw a mark durkan tweet before but can't find it.

Cailleach1 · 10/11/2017 15:32

twitter.com/markdurkan/status/927594351571685381

this is a bit of it. nov 6th.

nauticant · 10/11/2017 15:44

The more we learn, the more a clean break and default to WTO rules makes sense. It would cause utter chaos and terrible damage to the economy but there you go. A having cake and eating it Brexit looks to be just a fairy story.

The problem the government have is that if they were honest and said that this is what the goal is, for the first time in years there could be an open and realistic discussion of what the future looks like. Chances are, this would cause support for Brexit to collapse, it wouldn't be clear at all what the will of the people really was.

The government are maintaining a fiction while not having a clue what to do except to hang on until something turns up.

missmoon · 10/11/2017 16:08

^George Osborne‏Verified account
@George_Osborne
21m21 minutes ago
More
Second edition @EveningStandard: senior sources in Government have told our @JoeMurphyLondon today that Boris’s job is now “on the line”^

I wrote to my Tory MP (one of the "rising stars", apparently) about Boris and the Iranian case three days ago, and she replied unusually quickly. I think it's worth putting pressure on Tory MPs on this. I suspect many of them want Boris out, and are looking for an excuse. Also, I've been following this case for a while, and maybe this is a window of opportunity to resolve it (hoping so anyway).

Holliewantstobehot · 10/11/2017 16:18

Yasmin Alibhai-Brown pointed out Penny Mordaunt's lie about Turkey and the EU on The Wright Stuff today.

woman11017 · 10/11/2017 16:22

she replied unusually quickly mine too. It's always worth writing to them. People liked Kirsty Allsopp on QT about it.
www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/boris-johnson-iran_uk_5a04e3a0e4b01d21c83d957a
She's be so useful as a remain campaigner.................

mrsreynolds · 10/11/2017 16:23

I've had a reply from my MP today too

mrsreynolds · 10/11/2017 16:32

Ive replied as he didn't answer my question on bojos behaviour

Hasenstein · 10/11/2017 16:36

Elements

"Oh, we didn't mean That when we said we wanted Brexit for all that nourishing Sovereignty and Control!"

This is precisely the mealy-mouthed rubbish people have been saying to my EU dw and me after her PR application was rejected (she's only been here 40 years, run a business, paid loads of tax/NI, worked for charity, raised dcs ...:) "Oh, when we voted Leave and to keep immigration down we didn't mean you, dear. You're lovely and it's terrible that you're having this trouble with the Home Office.

It makes my blood boil, this nicey-nicey front when the implications of their vote were clear from the outset.

Cailleach1 · 10/11/2017 16:40

How on earth was your wife refused pr application?

OlennasWimple · 10/11/2017 16:45

Hasenstein - that's a very familiar story. Even the most rabid anti-immigration MPs will lobby on behalf of their constituents and their families to allow them to enter the UK or stay in the UK (whether they meet the requirements or not, in some cases). They didn't mean that kind of forrin person when they were advocating tighter controls Hmm

woman11017 · 10/11/2017 16:53

@SethAbramson
(THREAD) BREAKING: According to an individual with firsthand knowledge of the judging of the 2002 Miss Universe pageant, Trump tried to rig the outcome of the international contest to award the prestigious “Miss Universe” title to Vladimir Putin’s then-mistress, Oxana Fedorova.

Lots rumbling on Russian influence.
www.byline.com/column/67/article/1934

@davidmacdougall
As a journalist (and a Scot) I'm pretty horrified a senior politician would lend any sort of legitimacy to fake news propagandists like Putin's RT.

@jimwaterson
Alex Salmond is hosting a chat show on Russia Today from November onwards. Play it how you want but that’s the man who almost led Scotland to independence paid by a Kremlin-backed broadcaster.

woman11017 · 10/11/2017 16:55

I regard the treatment of people like you and your wife Hasenstein as comparable to what the Nazis did. Flowers

LurkingHusband · 10/11/2017 16:58

weegingerdug.wordpress.com/2017/11/08/what-a-priti-fine-mess-voting-no-got-us-into/amp/

So, do you remember that bit in the Better Together pitch to the people of Scotland in 2014 when they told us that Scotland needed the heft and credibility of the UK to represent us on the world stage? See if you swallowed that. See the Brexit negotiations. See Boris Johnson. See Priti Patel. Are you not pure dead mortified now? Whit a riddy. The only notable thing about Britain striding the world stage is how many pratfalls it makes. British diplomacy is a laughing stock.

Britain notoriously doesn’t do a great deal to help those of its citizens who get into trouble while abroad. That’s one reason why the former BBC world affairs correspondent John Simpson used to travel to war torn regions using his Irish passport. Simpson said in an interview with the Guardian that the Irish government would be far more likely to help get him out if he was arrested or kidnapped.

The Irish actually give a toss about their citizens who get into difficulties abroad, but it’s also true that all too often Britain is one of the reasons a region is war torn in the first place. However you’d imagine if you were a British citizen who had been arrested by a foreign government on trumped up charges that the very least that the UK could do would be not to make things even worse for you. But Britain can’t even manage that.

The British-Iranian journalist Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe was arrested and jailed by the Iranian authorities when she was on a private visit to the country with her infant daughter, visiting her parents. She’s now serving a five year sentence in an Iranian prison for a supposed crime whose details have never been revealed to her. Her young daughter has been denied an exit visa, and her English husband denied an entry visa, separating the child from both her parents on top of everything else. Her husband has persistently pressed the British Government and the Foreign Office for help, without much success.

Then along comes Boris Johnson with his big mooth and his even bigger ego. Boris confidently asserted to a parliamentary committee that Nazanin was in Iran in order to teach journalists, contradicting everything Nazanin, her family, and her employers have been telling the Iranians. Shortly after he made the statement, Nazanin was hauled out of her jail cell and into an Iranian court where she now faces an additional five years on top of the sentence she’s already serving. Iran claims that the Foreign Secretary’s remarks provide evidence that she was agitating against the Iranian regime.

Not even a grudging apology could be dragged out of Boris Johnson, he actually tried to deny that he had claimed Nazanin was teaching journalists even though his words had been recorded by both the committee minute takers, and by the TV cameras which were present. The most he would concede was that he “could have been clearer”. But he was perfectly clear, and he perfectly clearly said something incorrect that risks keeping a British citizen years longer in an Iranian prison. Boris has a big mooth, he has a bigger ego, but he’s an irrelevant little man with big pretensions representing a irrelevant little country that imagines it’s still important.

Priti Patel, the international development secretary, went on holiday to Israel. I don’t know about you, but when I go on holiday to somewhere warmer and sunnier than the UK, which is most places, all you want to do is laze about in the sunshine, eat and drink too much, and take in the local sights. For Priti the local sights included the offices of senior Israeli politicians, including the Prime Minister Netanyahu, the former finance minister, and the public security minister.

She also met with officials from the foreign ministry and with representative from a number of other Israeli organisations. In a holiday lasting less than a fortnight, she managed to fit in 12 meetings with government representatives and politicians. That’s not just a degree of workaholism that really needs the intervention of a 12 step therapy programme, it was also both breathtakingly stupid and arrogant because Priti forgot to mention any of this to the British Foreign Office, the British embassy in Tel Aviv, or her boss Theresa May.

Worse, when the story first came to light she tried to claim that the Foreign Office knew all about it, when in fact she hadn’t notified them in advance at all. She hadn’t really meant to do anything wrong. If she had met with Benjamin Netanyahu is was just because she was the 3 millionth tourist in Israel this year and he wanted to surprise her.

Brexiteer Priti wanted Britain out of the EU in order to restore full sovereignty to the Westminster Parliament, but she changed her plans about an official trip to Africa and got an earlier flight so that she wouldn’t have to face questioning in the Commons. Which is just as well, at least for her, as it now transpires that she held another two undeclared and undisclosed meetings with senior Israeli officials since she got back from her holidays.

It turns out that Priti wanted to send British government aid money to the Israeli army for projects in the Golan, a Syrian territory which Britain and the international community regard as being illegally annexed by Israel. She came to an agreement with the Israelis without clearing it with the Foreign Office, the Prime Minister’s office, or the British embassy in Israel, all of whom would have told her that she was overstepping her authority by holding meetings without clearing them in advance, and that it’s a breach of international agreements entered into by the UK for the British government to send aid money to the Israeli army for spending in occupied territories.

Worse than that, it transpires that a lobbyist from the Conservative Friends of Israel group was present during some of these meetings and had a role in arranging them. Breaches of the ministerial code don’t come much clearer. Either Priti Patel didn’t know what she did was a breach of the ministerial code, in which case she’s too inept and incompetent to remain in office, or she did know and did it anyway, in which case she’s unfit for office.

In a normal world, Boris and Priti would both have been sacked immediately. But this isn’t a normal world. This is Brexit Britain which has a Prime Minister who is too weak to keep her idiot ministers in check, and they’re too weak to force her out of office because they fear that bringing her down risks another election in which they’d have to face the voters and be held to account for their rank incompetence.

At the time of writing, Priti Patel was on a plane, having been ordered to cut short her official trip to Africa and return to London for a meeting with the Prime Minister. It is quite likely that by tomorrow, Priti Patel’s formal title will be the Digraced Former Minister Priti Patel. But just like her colleague, the Disgraced Former Minister Liam Fox, who was very keen to defend Priti over the past few days and to downplay her actions, the chances are that she’ll serve a wee while on the backbenches, and then crawl back into government like nothing had happened. That’s how justice works for the powerful in the UK.

Look at Boris and Priti, look at a Theresa May who heads a government that’s as chaotic and stable as a paralytic drunk on roller skates, and considerably less clear headed. This is what the broad shoulders of the UK look like. This is the security and stability of the UK that Scotland was told it relies upon. There is no certainty in the UK except that the UK is an international embarrassment which is only fit for providing tax avoidance schemes in its overseas territories for the super-rich. The sooner Scotland escapes from its clutches the better.

We couldn’t possibly do any worse by being independent. At least we could hold our heads up high and if a Scottish goverment behaved even a quarter as bad as this mob in Westminster, we could boot them out of office. As part of the UK, all we can do is hold our heads in our hands and watch as the clowns destroy our futures. It’s a Priti fine mess that voting No has got us into.

LurkingHusband · 10/11/2017 16:59

This is precisely the mealy-mouthed rubbish people have been saying to my EU dw and me after her PR application was rejected (she's only been here 40 years, run a business, paid loads of tax/NI, worked for charity, raised dcs ...smile "Oh, when we voted Leave and to keep immigration down we didn't mean you, dear. You're lovely and it's terrible that you're having this trouble with the Home Office.

I'll see your 40 years, and raise you 54 for my DF Sad ....

Cailleach1 · 10/11/2017 17:33

Did anyone see Panorama about the football team supporters singing/chanting offensive stuff on the trains?

It was all horrible, but one image made me shudder. It was because it was directed at a person walking up the carriage. It was a Hasidic jewish man and he was distinctively dressed so drew their focus. The chant was something like "gas them all". At the man as he went up the aisle. Are these people raised by wolves? Do they have any grasp of history?

There is something wrong.

RedToothBrush · 10/11/2017 17:34

So I stay away from the internet for an afternoon and

Haaretz.com‏ @haaretzcom
BREAKING: Saudi Arabia has declared war on Lebanon and Hezbollah, says Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah

This is BAD.

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LurkingHusband · 10/11/2017 17:36

BREAKING: Saudi Arabia has declared war on Lebanon and Hezbollah, says Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah

This is BAD.

What is it with you pathetic remainers ? Really ? This is GOOD. It's a wonderful opportunity for the world to see how good old British weaponry performs in the increasingly complex and demanding theatre of modern military oppression.

I hope the sales lines are open as we speak.

(Goes away muttering ...)

thecatfromjapan · 10/11/2017 17:37

What? Shock

mrsreynolds · 10/11/2017 17:43

54 years for my mum too LH Sad

ElenaGreco123 · 10/11/2017 17:43

I have just finished the Middle East chapter in Prisoners of Geography. Scary stuff. If you are brave enough to read on www.independent.co.uk/voices/lebanon-prime-minister-saad-hariri-resignation-not-all-seems-quits-resigns-surprise-saudi-arabia-a8045636.html

Cailleach1 · 10/11/2017 17:44

poor old Lebanon.

LurkingHusband · 10/11/2017 17:47

I have just finished the Middle East chapter in Prisoners of Geography. Scary stuff. If you are brave enough to read on

There you go again ! Facts ! Learning ! Thank goodness we'll have no more of that nonsense after that glorious day of independence (whenever it is).

RedToothBrush · 10/11/2017 17:56

www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/veteran-tory-mp-blames-female-journalists-for-westminster-sex-scandal-and-describes-victims-of-a3687716.html
Tory MP blames female journalists for Westminster sex scandal and describes harassment victims as 'wilting flowers'

Nice.

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