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Brexit

Westministenders: The Return of Parliamentary Sleaze?

989 replies

RedToothBrush · 28/10/2017 14:35

Brexit is quietly going round and round in ever decreasing circles.

The story is that the European parliament will not agree to a transition period beyond 1st January 2020.

The third minister responsible for getting the Repel Bill through the Lords has quit. There are now nearly 400 amendments. It is scheduled for 6 days parliamentary time in the Commons from this coming week. With another 2 possible the following week. Rather bravely AFTER the budget. Bored with May, CVs are being submitted for the position of Chancellor.

Interest Rates are looking likely to rise next week too with the message being 'this is as good as it gets'.

Another team of MPs has gone to the EU to see if they can check up on May and her team. This is unlikely to work as Nicola Sturgeon came across a brick wall.

And then there are the many many distractions from it all.

Catalonia has declared independence, which will consume EU time and energy.

There are rumours that the first prosecution in Trump Russia will be Monday (Guess who is currently in the US. Yep, the gurning one). And there are increasing muttering about Russia over here, with Facebook's Mark Zuckerberg being called to respond to a Select Committee investigation into Fake News.

And then there's the sleaze. Jared O'Mara seems to be the first in the queue. There are rumours more will be outed in several parties. Suggestions include May's right hand man Damien Green who was previously named in 2008. And the Tory Whips have a 'sleaze list' which suggests they know whats going on, but have done nothing.

This morning we have Gove making ill advised jokes about Weinstein in this political climate. With Neil Kinnock laughing heartily in response.

Anything that happens will be political to discredit opponents not because there is a change of attitude towards the treatment of women. We know this, because of who is leading the charge on this. The skeletons are being dusted off out the cupboard rather than exposed for the first time in dramatic fashion.

Things, could take a very unexpected turn against this background.

Don't bet against it.

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Thread gallery
42
OlennasWimple · 01/11/2017 13:38

To be fair to Claire Perry, she might not have lied she might just be ignorant...

woman11017 · 01/11/2017 13:40

Yet us poor plebs are required by law to report suspicions of terrorism, or risk jail

I seem to be getting links about the new data law, and noticed this sanction for failure to report data breaches:

^What your organization needs to do in order to achieve compliance with GDPR breach notification requirements
And the consequences that non-complying organizations will be faced with^.

^Establishing internal breach notification procedures
Notifying the supervisory authority of a breach without undue delay, and if possible, within 72 hours
Communicating the personal data breach to the data subject without undue delay^

^Sanctions
Non-compliance resulting in administrative fines of up to €20,000,000
Other infringements resulting in fines of up to €10,000,000^.

www.dflabs.com/whitepaper-incident-response-new-general-data-protection-regulation

woman11017 · 01/11/2017 13:41

It's a good job computers never break down, otherwise lots of innocent people might find themselves in trouble over new data protection laws.Hmm

TheNumberfaker · 01/11/2017 13:57

Re the Electoral Commission looking into Arron Banks and BFTCL, what power, if any, do they have? So if he/ the company are found to have broken the rules, do they just get a fine? Could he be imprisoned? Would it mean the result of the referendum is invalid? What impact can this investigation have?

LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 14:03

It's a good job computers never break down, otherwise lots of innocent people might find themselves in trouble over new data protection laws.

That would be a worry if they were ever enforced.

In related news I see that Equifax is starting to contact UK citizens affected by it's staggering incompetence. I've not got mine yet, but I can predict what it will say something like "Whistle this ..."

LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 14:04

Re the Electoral Commission looking into Arron Banks and BFTCL, what power, if any, do they have? So if he/ the company are found to have broken the rules, do they just get a fine? Could he be imprisoned? Would it mean the result of the referendum is invalid? What impact can this investigation have?

Can you imagine the square root of fuck all ?

Good.

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 14:10

Today in the House of Lords they will be discussing the 2nd reading of the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill.
www.parliament.uk/business/news/2017/october/lords-debates-sanctions-and-anti-money-laundering-bill/

This Bill was started in the House of Lords rather than the House of Commons (on the 18th October, so a very new bill) by the government.

Why are they introducing this Bill?

Well, this is a good explainer by a law firm who also gives details of who is speaking on the subject (I note Lord Pannick who you might remember from a particular infamous legal case representing the challengers to the government - I believe he does do work for Mischon de Reya unless I am mistaken) :

www.mishcon.com/news/briefings/sanctions-and-anti-money-laundering-bill

The UK Government's current power to implement sanctions flow from the European Communities Act 1972 which is due to be repealed as part of the Brexit process. Whilst the UK has some limited domestic powers to impose sanctions (e.g. the Terrorist Asset Freezing Act 2010), these are not sufficient to implement the full range of sanctions currently in force at the UN and EU level.

Without a domestic legal framework to implement sanctions after the European Communities Act 1972 is repealed, the UK would be in breach of its international legal obligations. The UK will therefore need new powers to meet its international obligations as a UN member state. The UK Government therefore wishes to pass the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill in order to give itself the necessary powers.

The Bill aims to allow the UK Government to impose sanctions in two circumstances. First, to comply with UN or other international obligations (for example, any resolution passed by the UN Security Council Resolution or any arms embargo suggested by the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe). Second, for one or more of the following purposes – the prevention of terrorism, the interest of national security, in the interests of international peace and security and to further the foreign policy of the UK Government.

The UK currently implements 6 UN only sanctions regimes (which are binding and all UN member states implement them). The UK Government does not envisage substantive changes to these regimes when the UK leaves the EU.

The UK currently implements 18 EU only regimes. The UK Government intends to operate with greater flexibility in this area. The current process is as follows:

(a) the EU proposes sanctions;

(b) the UK Representation to the EU consults with the relevant UK Government department (e.g. HM Treasury on financial sanctions);

(c) the UK Representation to the EU participates in EU negotiations until EU agreement;

(d) the EU produces a regulation;

(e) the UK implements the regulation through a statutory instrument.
The proposed post-Brexit process under the Bill is more streamlined:

(a) UK Government proposes sanctions;

^(b) the FCO coordinates with the relevant UK Government department
^
(c) the UK Government implements a statutory instrument.

In deciding whether to designate an individual or entity, the UK Government will use the evidential test of a Minister having "reasonable grounds to suspect" that the relevant individual or entity is involved in prohibited activities. This is currently the standard used when considering designations at the UN and the EU. The UK Government claims it is broadly equivalent to the "sufficiently solid factual basis" standard applied by the EU Courts.

Whilst the Bill is at the early stages of its passage through parliament and may be subject to amendment and further scrutiny, the above is an initial guide to the status of the Bill and the UK Government's intentions.

But this is the formal House of Lords briefing on the subject:
researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/LLN-2017-0074/LLN-2017-0074.pdf

Keep an eye on this, and who might speak in the Commons on the matter when it hits there. I think a few things might crop up with it.

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LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 14:18

In deciding whether to designate an individual or entity, the UK Government will use the evidential test of a Minister having "reasonable grounds to suspect" that the relevant individual or entity is involved in prohibited activities. This is currently the standard used when considering designations at the UN and the EU. The UK Government claims it is broadly equivalent to the "sufficiently solid factual basis" standard applied by the EU Courts.

Sounds like a lot of interaction with the ECHR there ?

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 14:22

Yes there does. There is also references to overlap with the Home Office and Immigration. And Henry VIII powers.

Which is why I am of the mindset that it is worth keeping a very close eye on. I think it will be revealing of government, it will reveal intentions, and it will potential reveal personal interests.

I must admit, that on first read, this is all way over my head, but hopefully I will get my head around it with a bit more information. I suspect it will attract a bit of attention before too long.

Though with everything else going on abroad, I'm surprised it hasn't already. Its somewhat topical.

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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 14:46

Faisal Islam‏*@faisalislam*

Child Sex Abuse inquiry re Westminster just finished accepting apps for core participant status, hearings January. Parties, whips, in scope

Westministenders: The Return of Parliamentary Sleaze?
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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 15:08

Kevin Schofield‏*@PolhomeEditor*
Labour source on chances of Tory MPs abstaining on Brexit impact vote at 7pm: "No one knows what they're doing because they don't either."

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Cailleach1 · 01/11/2017 15:47

Had a peeky boo wrt Cecil Parkinson and Sara Keays. Found this little interesting piece. What with money laundering and shelters being discussed. It is the mail. And Sara was indignant about their daughter Flora being left out of his will. From April of this year.

‘Cecil spent much of his time setting up offshore funds in the Bahamas and elsewhere,’ she says. ‘He used to keep all relevant papers in the House of Commons as the Inland Revenue couldn’t raid it because it is considered a Royal Palace. I knew which solicitors he used and the names of the funds.

‘As well as his offshore funds, he had houses in London, Hertfordshire, Cornwall and the Bahamas. ‘Then there were various directorships, a Ministerial pension and income from the House of Lords.’
She was startled when his will was published and it revealed assets of little more than £1 million. Meanwhile, Flora and Sara were sinking into destitution.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4414944/Cecil-Parkinson-s-daughter-scorned-Tory-minister-father.html

Cailleach1 · 01/11/2017 15:48

Wonder how many more of the great and the good who will be discussing such things are also busy doing the same? And keeping their paperwork where it can't be raided.

LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 16:34

He used to keep all relevant papers in the House of Commons as the Inland Revenue couldn’t raid it because it is considered a Royal Palace

Sorry, but the word "bollocks" springs to mind ... that sounds like the sort of pathetic "data protection" excuse when someone in authority wants to avoid doing any real work. And if it is true, then it immediately invites the question: what else are they hiding in there ?

Was it Parky Cecil that caused Private Eye to be withdrawn from sale in the mid 80s ? For a long time after, W.H. Smug didn't stock it - certainly where I was at Uni. Even then, not going to W.H. Smiths wasn't really a hardship.

LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 16:34

And keeping their paperwork where it can't be raided.

Shame it there were to be a fire. Or an attack of the statement weevils.

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:45

Lib Dem Lords‏*@LibDemLords*
@SharonBowlesUK's speech on the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill highlights the effect Brexit is having on the legislative process
Unamendable regulations made under this Bill could impinge on the daily lives of anyone opening a bank account or transferring money

I guess Handsard needs to be checked on this. Anti-Money laundering or anti-civil liberties.

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LurkingHusband · 01/11/2017 16:50

Anti-Money laundering or anti-civil liberties

We've already pissed away our civil liberties in the name of terror/paedos/witches ...

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:53

Faisal Islam‏ @faisalislam
Dexeu minister Robin Walker says Government will not now oppose Labour Opposition Day motion demanding release of Brexit impact studies
..now Commons generally bewildered multiple points of order in trying to work out if this motion, which will pass, is binding on Government
Deputy Speaker won't say if the motion is binding or not

Neil Murphy‏*@Neilm74*

So the tories are assuming it's not binding?

called anon ha ha‏*@ianrobo1*

scared of a position which would lead to a rebellion

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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:54

Faisal Islam‏*@faisalislam*

Deputy Speaker: in past "a motion of this kind has been effective or binding"...re Brexit impact study vote which will be lost
Rees Mogg is referring to page 890 of Erskine May - a reference to Canadian Parliament saying it would be "contempt" not to supply reports
Jacob Rees Mogg appears to be backing Keir Starmer on his use of archaic procedure to get impact studies released

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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:55

There's a catch isn't there? Or shredders?

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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:55

RaphaelHogarth @RaphaelHogarth
Unbelievable scenes in the Commons. MPs debating whether the motion on Brexit impact studies is binding. Chair refuses to express a view.

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RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 16:57

James Chalmers‏*@ProfChalmers*

Game-changer as Remainers discover Rees Mogg can be weaponised by invoking 19th century procedure.

Too good to be true. Has to be.

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twofingerstoEverything · 01/11/2017 16:58

Alan Partridge v Malcolm Tucker

RedToothBrush · 01/11/2017 17:00

Simon the Stylite‏*@Sime0nStylites*

My guess is that at the most these include basic stats (employees + tx revs etc) + a rudimentary Opps /Threats analysis.
Speculation. The only reason they were mentioned in the first place because govt want to demonstrate lots of work done...
...but now they’ve become a political issue. Either: Don’t release - every1 assumes terrible result or Do - and people criticise the work.
Question. Which govt Brexit papers to date (excl Ireland) have demonstrated high quality, detailed analysis?
Fwiw the “answer” to this is for the govt to produce magnanimously a summary of the reports which says...very little...or unicorns.

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