Why people voted leave if anybody wants to knoe

[RBeer]

So I asked the smartest friend whom I have known for many a year why the majority of people voted leave. He told me to watch the big short movie. So I did. And on the 5th watch I found it. So , not that it matters, but I thought it good to share in case others could learn.
"People want an authority to tell them how to value things but they choose this authority not based on facts or results,” “They choose it because it seems authoritative or familiar.”

Just imagine if all the teachers, doctors, engineers from this country all sought employment in other countries. The effect would be felt very close to home.

We may be at the start of finding out what this is like. Partly it's because EU scientists have been made to feel unwelcome. Partly because of domestic issues e.g. Jeremy Hunt's behaviour towards the NHS and the crisis in teacher recruitment which the Government doesn't seem interested in addressing. Or the housing crisis - if you were a young professional, and were able to practice your profession overseas, and buy/rent accommodation cheaply, wouldn't you be tempted? I am just watching to see how soon some of the younger members of my family up and leave.

In all nations joining the euro was a stated aim of the political parties who were seeking election. There were political parties that opposed this and could have won the vote in the years leading up to it.

The economies of Italy, Greece etc all benefited in the years running up to 2008.

What nations have benefited from the Euro?

Depends what period you want to look at. Among the fastest growing european economies at the moment are the Baltic States, Slovakia and Ireland, all in the EZ, and Slovenia whose currency is pegged to the euro.

I have my doubts about the wisdom of the euro project, personally, but the idea that no one has benefited from it is just silly.

If there was no freedom of movement there would be no brain drain.

The negative impact on the likes of Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, etc, far outweighs the positive impact on the Baltic nations. It has completely wrecked the economies of the former nations with huge unemployment in the young population.

"If there was no freedom of movement there would be no brain drain."

So why do we have a brain drain going on of Doctors etc to Australia and Canada? That's just an untrue statement. Skilled workers will always be granted visas.

"It has completely wrecked the economies of the former nations."

Most of my Italian and Greek friends say its pretty much the same as was going on in the 1980s and 90s.

Interestingly one of the reasons why Italy has had a negative impact on its economy is that it has been negatively effected by China's growth into industries that it would typically have had fairly large numbers of people working in.

I know you'd love to blame the euro for "wrecking" the economies but its far more complex than that. The Italian referendum btw, wasn't about Europe, most Italian's would vote to remain in, as far as I understand it anyway.

The Euro is living on borrowed time. There are not many more times Germany can bailout the rest. Italy is literally tinkering on the edge of bankruptcy with huge debt/GDP disparities. If the worst case scenario happens then it may prove too big save.

That's exactly correct OP. And they also prey on people's fears because it's the easy way. It's so unbelievably fucking depressing

Hypothetical Celeste, just think about this though, if the euro collapses it takes all economies that are intertwined with it, its the biggest market in the world and all economies in the world would be effected.

Be careful what you wish for.

I ain't wishing for it to happen, it will be a disaster of huge proportions should it happen I agree but the situation is unsustainable I suspect.

Darth,

Wishing is not a solution to anything. The Euro will (almost?) inevitably collapse. Having said that, it will, like many economic events, be fully recoverable from and, hopefully, a better model will emerge.

I always find it ironic the way the ardent remainers accuse the leavers of sticking their fingers in their ears and saying 'la la la' whilst the remainers themselves are behaving just like the three wise monkeys concerning the Euro.

be fully recoverable from and, hopefully, a better model will emerge.

Only with the passage of time. As with any crash a number of people are ruined financially, with attendant social consequences, and there is usually talk of lost productivity for a period of say a decade. So it's wishful thinking to say - it will collapse and something better will emerge, as though the process will be easy.

Peregrina,

And therein lies a tale...

In 2008 the governments had a choice, let the banks (and bond holders) go, whilst honouring the government guarantee for depositors, or bail out the banks, S they did.

This was really a choice between bailing out asset holders (and, in the uk, London and the south east) at the expense of all tax payers or letting assets substantially cheapen (collapse,if you will) and allow ordinary employees to buy houses and invest in cheap equities.

If you believe in capitalism, you have to allowcreative destruction to happen, or you just serve an asset holding elite, regardless of the cost to everyone else.

The Euro is v similar. You can keep taxing everyone to support an asset holding elite or you can allow it to collapse and thereby create conditions where Southern Europe can rebuild competitive economies.

And after the bank collapse, has a 'better model' emerged? Not yet, as far as I can see, and we are nearly 10 years on.

Peregrina,

The banks did not collapse; that is the point!

I'm not sure that letting the banks collapse would have been a good thing.

Creative destructionism is all well and good, but there usually is something t replace the established methods before the old ways are destroyed.

Crashing the entire financial system (which would have happened) would have had some catastrophic effects across the globe. As would the collapse of the euro.