Is anyone else getting quite tired of being called a racist?

[Peppatina]

I know it can't just be me.

It doesn't matter what carefully thought out reasons a brexiter has for wanting to leave (I've seen some very articulate and reasoned ones on mn itself) we are still all getting lumped into a stereotypical group of closet racist idiots.

And Lord forbid any of those reasons might just involve any concern over levels of eu migration!

I've been told that I'm essentially imagining the three week waiting list for my GP or that this is nothing to do with eu migration. If I say I know it is because of the names being called out I become the equivalent of Enoch Powell.

The same goes for a certain local estate very much being a no go area, especially for young girls. After braving this street once with my children and being spat on and shouted at by a group of very hostile Romanian men/boys I've been told I imagined it.

When I had my son a few week ago my I was the only English speaking person in my ward. A polish man was shouting and being very aggressive to staff as they were struggling to find an interpreter.

I absolutely know that not every migrant is aggressive and that they should build more schools and go surgeries but I believe I'm right to be concerned about a high number of migrants who are not intergrating with their local community and the unsustainable strain on services.

I'm sick of being told that my experiences don't matter. That to even mention that this is what life is like in our town means I am a racist or little englander.

jellied, as someone who grew up in the exact areas you described, I can tell you they have always been bloody horrible. It has sweet f all to do with immigration.

May - it was always horrible but now it's worse

mountain no-one has said any of those things are in themselves racist; no-one at all!

Is no-one allowed to suggest anything is racist then for fear of being branded hysterical? I really don't mind the leave perspective, wanted to protect public services, pride in our country or wanted to curb mass immigration. I honestly don't want to appear nasty either.

In your opinion what would constitute a racist perspective? If someone said to you they were concerned the white British population in their area had fallen - even if the non-white British population had increased so the overall population of British were the same**, would you tell them they might be being a bit racist?

**note, no-one here has actually said this.

I disagree jellied.

My Dad is an immigrant. A dark skinned one. When I was about ten we were walking down the road together. Someone called him a "fucking paki" and lobbed a can of drink at us from a moving car.

I've walked through the same area a million times in more recent years and have never felt as unsafe as I did then. Yes you get a fair amount of unwanted sexual comments. But when I was younger and the area was mainly white, I got them then too.

lavenderdoilly

Maybe he was promised a translator, you say? And that was a reason to kick off and act aggressively?

Translators are very expensive, why should the onus be on UK tax payers to find immigrants translators? I find that extraordinary. Can't they learn the language? Before or after they come? I did.

I gave birth in a foreign country, I learned the bloody language and did not expect the hospital to drum up a translator for me (at no cost to me) when giving birth.

The general sense of entitlement is extraordinary. There is a real culture of people banging on about their rights. Like the right to a translator. What about focussing on immigrants' duties, like learning about the culture and learning the language?!

Am speaking as a disgruntled immigrant (here since 98)

Is this the part where I tell you that British and Chips come from a dish served and sold by Jewish refugees? They created it when they weren't planning to assassinate Victoria or whatever evil refugees were all doing back then. Yes immigration is something we all need to have grown up discussions about. Leaving the EU won't stop people wanting or needing to come here.

Jellied not all in-voters think immigration is a bed of roses! There are other issues to consider when making a balanced decision.

By all means vote out, but go into it with your eyes open: there will be no extra money coming to your doctor's surgery. There will be no extra money for improving social services in your area. The poor people will continue to be present in deprived areas, but they will have British accents not Lithuanian ones perhaps. Would that make you happier?

There will no extra money because it is going to cost us a small fortune to set ourselves up to handle everything the EU currently does for us. this referendum is costing A FORTUNE. I'm sorry to say that immigration or not your area will continue to be just as it is now, and it will get worse sharply in the short term. Both sides of the debate can agree on that.

And no, he should have provided his own translator. Spent loads of time living and working abroad myself and had to rely on my own language abilities including in hospital. No they shouldn't provide translators but sometimes they offer them.

You can say nothing anymore without it being taken out of context

So lets recap the NHS can claim back costs for these people from their country and/or contributing more in tax than they claim.

Non EU need to work here ten years and cant claim anything at all and have to have money in bank etc.

So why are immigrants the problem exactly?

Why is government banking all this tax and not building new services is the ONLY question, not coded talk.

Breaking - www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10022601/NHS-counts-900-million-cost-of-treating-EU-visitors.html

How much do we get?

There is a really nice Polish teaching assistant at our local primary school. I was treated by a lovely polite Lithuanian nurse the other day when I gave a blood sample.

Point made.

By describing people from other countries as 'lovely' all the time, you are, without realizing it, being slightly racist ....and patronizing.
It's not intended.
but it's there.

Some Polish people are lovely. Some are not.
Same with the British.

To stick a 'lovely' label on every Polish person you happen to mention, makes you not much better than the people who are openly hostile. imo.

It reminds me of a teacher at my son's school.

She often talks about the 'lovely little black boy I have in my class'
When she describes the other 29 children in the class, they don't get the lovely label.

A bit of a ramble, but it's a pet peeve of mine.

She often talks about the 'lovely little black boy I have in my class'

The suspect word in this sentence isn't the "lovely" it's the black. The boy may well be lovely, and that is probably relevant. It probably isn't relevant that he's black.

Similarly you could say "some shit walked past my house and threw litter in my garden". People only get a bit when you say "some Polish shit", because it implies that their being Polish is relevant information. The fact that they are a shit is relevant! As is the "lovely".

As a foreign born naturalised British citizen who only had the chance to come here due to the right to free movement (back in the day when I moved here neither work nor spousal visa would have been an option) all this hatred for migrants really has started getting to me. As if I should have never come here, working my way up in British jobs, send my (born to a foreign born mother, but still British born) children to school, use the NHS, etc.

I've started off in low pay, now much better, obtained qualifications, have become part of the community. For the record my friends accept and none of them voices anti-migration views, but every day I see headlines about how migrants should stay where they come from, and are to blame for everything that's wrong. It really makes me feel unwelcome and frankly quite depressed. I wasn't born here but it's my home.

jelliedeels

The NHS fails to keep proper records of overseas visitors who come here from the EU, meaning it is impossible to know how many people come here and receive treatment.

WTAF- this annoys me almost as much as how little money HMRC has recovered over the last decades. Again nothing to do with the EU and everything to do with the UK.

Agirl- unfortunately all you get on here is rose tinted glasses!!!!

God help you if you have an issue with immigration because you will be told you are racist or xenophobic.

And every link, post or article to back your feelings up are dismissed.

Every opinion you say is picked over with tweezers and only the bits that posters think will get a rise are used and usually out of context

Welcome to mumsnet

Widowwadam, in case no one has said it recently, thank you for your contribution to our country. Also child of immigrants so I mean it sincerely.

Oh give me a break

Well jellied you have told us how alienated you feel. Sorry for that too.

Can I have a thank you? My family and I have all worked outside out birth country for over four decades.

We entered legally, for jobs that could not be filled locally, paid taxes and contributed to the economy, cultural and sporting events of our host nations.

Now I employ several non-UK employees.

Along the way, though, I grew a thick skin, learned several languages and the importance of integrating and making local friends and didn't expect any special treatment.

There was some racism, a bit of prejudice, plenty of bigotry and lots of laughs.

I certainly didn't have a bunch of neoliberals anyone telling me what I thought, demanding I live in certain places and pissing people off by insisting my language was spoken.

Someone said up thread that many Remain types need to go and live abroad for a hot so they can learn first hand what real racism, inequality, corruption and 'otherness' feels like.

I agree.

Lived and worked abroad myself. No one thanked me either. Widowwadam painted a pretty horrible picture about how shit all this divisive bollocks made her feel. Forgive me for thanking her rather than adding to the divisive bollocks.

People only get a bit hmm when you say "some Polish shit", because it implies that their being Polish is relevant information.

When you are talking about the EU and immigration, the fact that they are Polish is relevant.

Disclaimer: I'm quite happy with immigration. I just don't think that stifling debate is helpful.