Spiritual guidance for NHS workers with bollocks bedside manner?

[mowgeli]

Opinions please ... ??
Am I the only one who thinks they need to be paid more and work less hours so they can have more compassion and time for their clients (us as in, society) but no fucking spiritual guidance?? If you are shit you should be sacked and NHS workers are protected by too much beurocracy.
In my experience it's mostly the consultants and nurses and not the health assistants or whatever the hell we call them these days.

I think you're talking rubbish. Most doctors and nurses work incredibly hard in really difficult circumstances. Healthcare isn't about spirituality: its about treating disease.

Don't hospitals have Chaplains any more? They deal with the spiritual guidance stuff. (Even the Humanist ones.)

? I think you've omitted some info
Has some numpty said nurses should get training in spiritual guidance?

I'm unsure about what you mean!
Are you saying if an NHS worker has bad bedside manner or social tact they need to be sacked, rather than get taught to be more spiritual? Has that been proposed?

Exactly what LorLor said. Sorry I had two glasses of wine when I wrote that so it's not very clear.

I think there are many, many amazing NHS doctors and nurses, however some of them have a horrendous bedside manner.

Why should they be offered free spiritual guidance as I have just seen in the news? This is bonkers.

Would it be ok if someone was an amazing hairdresser but was nasty and arrogant when they treated a client? No, they would lose their job.
Same goes for pretty much anyone, an amazing personal assistant who is rude to people who phone?
An amazingly intelligent whatever else or talented whatever else but with horrible interpersonal skills.

So I am asking why is it ok for a doctor or nurse to have a bad bedside manner?

Crumbs have you spent much time in hospital? Do you not mind if doctors or nurses have a bad bedside manner and make you cry or leave you in pain? Or say things which are detrimental to your healing? Because I do. You need a holistic approach to treating patients and being kind and also explaining things properly is actually essential, so I totally disagree with you when you say it's about treating disease. It's about so much more then treating a disease. It's about comforting and reassuring people in the darkest moments of their lives....

I am not a numpty by the way, thanks though.

Would it be ok if someone was an amazing hairdresser but was nasty and arrogant when they treated a client? No, they would lose their job.

Thats not true. If people have skills that not many other people do, employers put up with loads of shit.

I do agree that better pay would be better than spiritual guidance. However consultants usually get paid well so if they are rude, money isnt going to make that better.

Totally agree Mowgeli.

Although it's not a bad thing for HCPs to have done - another string in heir bow - but if it's voluntary then it'll just be the already compassionate ones who do it or the ones who just want to do an easy training day. It won't make much difference to the ones who really need to improve their bedside manner.

It's not just better pay, but better working conditions, which includes their hours.

I've spent lots of time in hospitals since being diagnosed with cancer. I work in hospitals. I rarely meet people who are not kind or compassionate. Most keep a smile on their face and continue to be patient in the face of rude, demanding and difficult patients.
I've watched nursing staff treat elderly people with dementia with patience and tenderness despite being understaffed and dealing with violence from the patient.
Sack them? Who are you going to replace them with? Many hospitals find it impossible to recruit sufficient staff already.

Trunk,
This is exactly how I feel. No wonder a lot of them are miserable and unkind. Or stone hearted. It's because they work much too long hours, before 8 am to after 8pm or night shift the other way round. It's too long in such a high pressured job with a lot of responsibility. The conditions are so dark and old and they don't have access to the tools they need to help best so you are right about conditions.

And they aren't paid enough in my opinion.

Crumbs cancer and paediatric are exceptions but I've used midwives, obstetricians, urologists, interventional radiologists, physical therapists and I am telling you that they are all lacking in a bed side manner a lot of the time.
In special care the team were amazing and supported us very well but the rest of them and GPs as well are often really really unpleasant.
I don't know what employers you're referring to, because you can be as good as anyone and if you're horrible then we would not work with someone like that in my business or in any other company I have worked for.

Crumbs the only ones I can think of that are hard to sack are teachers and NHS people so unless you're thinking of them I disagree

I agree, I was a nurse for 25 years and some do have an appalling bedside manner, I would always pull my nurses up on that.
It should be part of their training to be professional at work at all times.
I once heard a member of staff tell a patient they were not paid enough to keep answering her bell every 5 minutes.
Staff pay is not the patients problem.
I left nursing when shifts went from 7 hours to 12, there is no way you can work effectively on a 12 hour shift. They should go back to 7, 12 hours in a pressure cooker environment means mistakes are going to be made and staff are tired and snappy.

There is an old saying "As you sow, shall you reap". If we're listing services we've used in past two years, I could say, oncology, surgery, GPs, rheumatology, respiratory medicine, gynaecology, cardiology, physiotherapist, radiography and imagining... and never once seen poor treatment of patients. I've always been impressed with the courtesy I've been shown and the tolerance to other more needy patients. I have my consultants and GPs email addresses, which they respond to as necessary (I rarely use them), I can contact them at any time. When I was in hospital last time I watched HCAs washing and drying the old ladies hair with such gentleness then putting their lipstick on, cleaning their glasses etc. I had a nurse go around other wards to find ice cream and yoghurts at midnight because I hadn't eaten that day and had a really bad throat. I've watched nurses being spat at and suffer racism with a calm and stoic manner, never once showing irritation.

It isn't hard to get rid of NHS staff but you can't sack someone for having a bad day and not having time to sit and listen to all your woes. It is very hard for trusts to recruit staff of all disciplines apart from admin/secretarial staff.

There are some who need a lot of training around their bedside manner and how they see the patient, many who don't.

I've been left without pain relief or food and drinks being put out of reach and my buzzer out of reach. I've been shouted at when I soiled myself while asleep and out of it on drugs and left to clean myself up, with the same nurse rolling her eyes when I asked for help to get clean pj's/a towel/my toiletries etc. One time I needed the commode and was told that they had patients to look after. I soiled the bed. I've been left on the commode unable to move through pain, with my buzzer out of reach, within view of the corridor and with the door open. I've been told off for moving while having a drip up because it made the alarm go off. The next shift told me it was a fault with the equipment.

There are also some absolute angels who have sat with me and held my hand while I cried, made me comfortable, made me feel like I'm not being a nuisance to press the nurse call button. They've cleaned me up, changed my bed, ensured I felt fresh again and reassured me that it was all just part of their job. They've listened to me about the amount of pain I'm in and ensured that that was dealt with. They've talked to me about my family and taken an interest it me as a person. They've laughed and joked with me.

They all need to be paid more and have better working conditions, including shift patterns. But given my experience, I'd say there are some that that would make no difference to and they are the ones that would benefit from some training in how they come across to the patient.

And I'm a cancer patient so it isn't the case that cancer is the exception.