DF refuses to help himself - it's wearing me down

[PartyintheKitchen]

My DF, 81, has various health issues but still mobile, still with it, drives, lives 1km from me so I see him very frequently. He suffers pain mostly from stress, rumination, v likely depressed, inactivity (short walk daily but mostly in his chair) and being on his phone for hours every day playing solitaire. He won't take anything for pain relief as worried it will make him dopey (even paracetamol) and will absolutely not engage with physiotherapy. When I ask how he is I generally get the quip back "I am how I always am", "bad morning", "bad day", "the usual blue day". He comes to visit and will sit or stand staring at me until I give him attention to allow him to vent about his woes, it's mostly always the same, it can take an hour each time. He literally won't help himself and has openly said he doesn't want to take any of the medical advice he has recently been given (physio, pain medication, anti-depressants). Terrible to say but he looks like crap, worn out and that gaunt look elderly people get. His life could be so much more pleasant if he took some painkillers, or some anti-depressants and went to physio or tried some small activities in his day - 180 difference. My mom passed away 3 yrs ago, he misses her terribly, he is lonely for her, he is really struggling to move on and has indicated many times he is just waiting to die.

I am so fed up of this, I have been heavily involved in caring for my parents for 5 years now, and there is no end in sight. I have 3 kids and work an insanely busy job. My DH works FT and is often on the road for work. I started a tag-rugby last winter as I recognised that I needed something for my mind and body - it helps a lot.

I don't know what I am looking for here, not aibu, but I just need to share. Nobody in real life gets it. I have 2 DBs who don't get all the venting or moaning and they often say "poor DF, so sad for him" or "oh I just ignore him and he has stopped telling me". My DF also says "oh your DB1 is under a lot of pressure with his 3 kids and him and his wife working full-time" - gah, hello, I am in literally the same boat! "But you are so much more able to cope". I know I need to do the same as DBs, it's hard though as he literally will stare me out of it to engage. We went away for a weekend recently, just myself DH and kids. DF made a comment "oh maybe next time you can visit my homestead" - which is not a break for me at all.

I hate this part of my life. I hate being the rock of the family, I have always been the rock of the family - being the rock is shit! I find some days that I am full of anger for having to deal with this, really resentful.

Stop.
Stop asking how he is, stop expecting him to change, stop being the rock.
It's not easy and I'm not saying walk away and ignore him, but accepting this is how he is and you cannot change him will help.

I think it’s interesting how some people react to aging and health issues. It seems to me that some people are more likely to engage in things like exercise, physiotherapy etc. Whilst other people just refuse to do anything at all. I guess it’s their choice.

Interesting that your brother says he just “doesn’t listen“ so that your father has stopped moaning to him! Could you try that? Allow a 30 second moan, then pointedly change the subject, however many times you need to, or leave the room to do chores, say you are going to have a nap (as you are so tired from the stress of your busy, hectic, working and family life: hint, hint) or say you have to go out, even if you don’t.

Nobody has to listen to someone else moaning constantly, particularly when that same person minimises or ignores one’s own struggles, which is what your father is doing.

I suppose it’s harder if your father visits regularly or if you are enclose contact regularly, but even then there must be ways of minimising this, eg. saying you’re busy that evening, or you need to have a nap, just end the conversation because (whatever, make a list of ready excuses) or whatever.

It does take time to build boundaries, but it can be done. Fact is you have to be ruthless, and ignore the guilt. People do get used to a “new normal“ eventually.

Another thing I have noticed is that those who refuse to do anything to help themselves seem to moan the most! Even when, sometimes, they don’t actually have a lot to moan about compared to others health struggles. (I’m not saying this about your father by the way).

Just reading through the responses now, thank you all.

I agree, for a man of his age he is actually in really good shape but he just can't see it. I know I say he looks terrible, I think he has an aura of stress and depression about him (maybe just I see that?). Even my 85 year old uncle, his "big bro" said to me he was worried about me and DF's impact on me with his miserable approach to life and my aunt declaring that "your DF should take the drugs, he's so old now what has he got to lose?!" 😆. I remember when he was about 70 he bought a car and declared "this is the last car I will buy" implying near death. He has a new car since then!

I will try to stop @thedevilinablackdress and @PintoPinto I like the 30 second moan window then change subject or move on.

I also have ancient friends who come in on the bus from their village and hang out at mine droning on about all the things that are difficult in their lives because they refused to do any future planning.
Last week I decided after making them cups of tea and ignoring all hints to drive them home, to carry on with my gardening which is what I had planned. In the 15 minutes that I was out she had managed a poonami in the bathroom ( it was everywhere) and he had knocked his tea all over himself. I tidied them up and walked them back to the bus stop.
I am often out on bus days. Mean but necessary. They are looking for someone to step up while doing nothing themselves. I’ve dropped the rope.
You have my sympathy. Tell him staring is rude.

I’m sorry OP, it’s exhausting - I have the same with my mother who is early 80’s. Generally in good health, bar a few well managed niggles.

She was always a bit negative and jusgemental, but it has really ramped up in the last few years. It’s so draining to be around her.

Like a previous poster has suggested, try to set a time limit in your head, and then change the subject. It’s harsh but necessary.

It’s like they have forgotten that you don’t just exist to be their unpaid skivvy and receptable for all their ills.

Would you be able to change how you approach dealing with him? Maybe don’t allow the venting to continue. It is just a bad habit it is not actually helping him or obviously you. Just tell him you don’t have the capacity for listening to venting and see how you get on.

I have started vague mmming noises. And sort of try to let it wash over me.
I am really encouraging you to think of some boundaries.
My Dad also does the staring thing. It’s dreadful.
Boubdaries help as does not always being available. It’s tough but possible.

How often are you seeing him @PartyintheKitchen? I now see my “D”M only in her home. There are a few reasons for this but one of the main ones is I can leave when I want to.

I think not taking painkillers because they can make you feel drowsy is a common thought amongst some older people. If he mentions it again, how about suggesting that he tries two paracetamol on a day he’s not driving and see if they make his pain any more bearable.

My DM can moan and ramble, often for a long time if allowed. Another thing I do is to conduct the conversation. She likes to talk about her BFriend, her neighbour and what she’s been up to so i ask her questions about these, she tells me all about them and at the end i say goodbye and leave. Not much moaning, haven’t told her much about my life (I grey rock her but that’s for another thread).

Do you gently challenge him as well? So if he says he feels lonely, sad or depressed do you say “yes I think your GP said the same, have you tried the tablets that they gave you yet”?

Thanks for the responses everyone. Busy evening with kids and DF and DH on the road this week.

@Unpaidworkmakestheeconomytick holy moly that brings things to another level - you need to disappear when they threaten visits!

@nihongo Very similar situ I think, my DF is a good guy and has always been a gentle soul and a good Dad but the negativity has always been there (it's definitely a think for the area he is from - suspicious in general seems to be a theme of the locality, think very small town). He now leans on me so much for health input (I am not a Dr or anything close), financial input (we help out financially), and I feel sometimes he relies on me for his happiness. No pressure right.

To those who have suggested it - I will set a time limit, I did it yesterday - it worked! I also had no choice but to focus on the kids, my youngest was literally shouting at me for attention.

DF looked even worse yesterday, wobbly on his legs, unwashed, wild looking. I told him to go home and have a hot shower. I also gently told him that if he continues to not help himself I will contact the GP and march him in. He went totally silent, not happy. Loe and behold I just got a text "feeling much better this morning" just a short while ago. I am not sure how long it will last.

@ExplodingSmittens I see him maybe 4-5 times a week, mostly he comes to my place as it is easy to get here from his (short drive, 2 sets of traffic lights, no roundabouts). Some days he turns up at midday and spends the day - mostly watching telly, other days he pops in for 1 hour (last night as he wasn't feeling great and I wasn't giving attention). I WFH 2-3 days a week from the kitchen - he sits in the same room. I really need to make a space in one of the kids rooms don't I. Good idea re paracetamol on days when he doesn't drive and to try to control the topics, I don't always have the bandwidth to do that but it's a good idea.

He sits in the same room while you work? Why on earth have you let this become a pattern??

Tell him work meetings are ramping up and you will be on calls for much of the day. You will be discussing confidential company matters and it is not allowed for anyone outside the company to be listening in.

Start setting some new bounderies and limit visits to 2 or 3 times a week. If you aren't available so often he may expand his horizons a little.

@Wishimaywishimight I know I know, it's bonkers. It's a big room tbf, I am plugged in and he is hard of hearing. But it's too much I know. There is capacity in the kids rooms to sit for the day.

He has never ever been a social animal, he meets older gents once a week for lunch (I forced him to sign up, he isn't keen but he goes). Getting him to do anything social has been really hard.

@PartyintheKitchenI do understand. My mum (84) goes to 1 class a week and refuses anything else. She is well enough to take a bus to nearby coffee shops though and does that once or twice a week too.

The work situation is something you may be able to change though, saying WFH rules are getting much stricter or something? That would drive me crazy - you are essentially babysitting your dad!

I know what you mean about bandwidth. I think conducting the conversation works for me because I’m at her home so it’s entirely up to me when the conversation is over and I leave.

It is a bit like a bingo machine though. I have set of questions I usually ask, and different ones pop up according to how much time I’ve got and what she’s been doing.

Well done on suggesting the GP, that seems to have done the trick even if it’s just temporarily

I totally get your situation and the misery and frustration it causes. I am entering my 7th year of extra care expectations from elderly parents/PIL who are unrealistic in many respects. Buying properties late in life that are too big to manage and at a distance from any friends or relatives. Not going anywhere new for social stuff despite reasonable suggestions but always complaining they are lonely. Not arranging sufficient cleaning/shopping/gardening help. Refusing to seek mental health care when they clearly need it for worsening depression. Not taking the minor painkillers recommended by docs but constantly complaining about aches. Multiple surgeries against GP advice but refusing to do the physio after. Saying they want to move but not accepting help to move quickly to somewhere closer smaller very low maintenance with lots of support on site that they said they really like.
I feel my work is affected (I work for myself and keep putting off doing new ventures) and I never get a proper break or holiday from care stuff. My house and garden is a tip. Even when not visiting I get constant phone calls.
I am setting some very firm boundaries this year as this can't go on. It's partly my own fault for not being tougher much sooner.

It’s really hard isn’t it and you may get criticism from people when you do start to put in boundaries but do please ignore. I don’t think anyone can comment on how much you do or don’t do for other people unless you are sharing the care with them.

Do they all have a falls bracelet? If not I’d start with that. Make sure you’re not the point of contact and then start putting your phone on silent when you need to.

@ExplodingSmittens I have already recently refused to be first responder when pull cord alarms were discussed. Didn't go down well at first but I think that's now been accepted as it just isn't practical.

I'm pushing for a modest private care package to be put into place if they won't move and maybe they are starting to consider that seriously.
I've not had any real criticism to date but then again the only family who bother to regularly visit apart from me are a couple in their 80s with serious health problems (and I do really appreciate what they do). I doubt anyone else would have the brass neck to tell me I'm not doing enough given they do absolutely zero.

You can change the boundaries on a relationship at any time you realise it is not working for you. Sometimes these things are like frogs in boiling water. You sound like you have been amazing. I think stepping back to avoid burning out is very sensible. Best of luck.

Tell him you’ve got to go back to the office so won’t be home so much. This is a terrible pattern that has formed that he thinks he can visit you even when you are literally at work.