WWYD? Worried my elderly grandad may no longer be safe to drive

[HollieTalbut1997]

Hi, really grateful for any advice on this.
My Grandad is mid-80s and still driving. He is very forgetful, tired and slow. Probably early dementia but nothing diagnosed yet. He struggles to make decisions and react to things in general life so I am worried about him driving still - I haven’t seen him driving recently but based on how he is in general I can’t imagine he is safe in the car. I spoke to my auntie about this and she also feels the same as me - she has brought it up with my grandparents but my grandma shut the conversation down and said he is fine.

My Grandma is very much the ‘boss’ in the marriage and my grandad will do whatever she says, especially due to him struggling to make decisions himself now and has a huge reliance on her.

I have also spoken to my dad about my concerns (he is very much the golden child in my grandmas eyes, so I do think if he raised concerns she might listen). However my dad basically said he gets my points but doesn’t think it’s up to him to say anything and doesn’t want to remove their independence.

I think this is ridiculous as if my grandad hurt someone else I wouldn’t be able to forgive myself for not acting. My dad is very selfish and I think is ultimately worried about having to help them more. They do live in a town with access to buses etc so it’s not as if they would be isolated.

I’m now totally stuck as to what I should do next. My auntie is reluctant to raise it again after being shot down, and there is history there with my grandma of her making my aunt out to be the bad person so I understand her reluctance. What would you do?

My grandad also got caught speeding recently and is going on a speed awareness course this week. Is any of this likely to be picked up as part of that? I’ve never had to go on the course so not sure what it consists of.

I think you have to accept that they are adults.
You can talk to them and suggest how they would manage when that time comes and help them see the potential avenues open to them to get around and avoid being isolated, but it is not your call to tell them to quit driving.

Nobody, regardless of age, responds well to being told what to do.

This was in the news just two days ago: Driver, 95, spared jail after Stourbridge crash kills grandmother - BBC News

You can report anonymously to the DVLA here: https://contact.dvla.gov.uk/driver/capture-third-party-personal-information?locale=en

If there's no problem, he will pass and continue driving. But you will never fully forgive yourself if you did nothing and he injured/killed himself and/or others. Perhaps he may even wish to give up himself, but is being bullied into continuing by his wife? It needn't involve your dad in any additional hassle - an account can be set up with a local taxi firm that can be paid monthly as required, if that would help.

You sound like a lovely granddaughter who is trying to do the right thing in a difficult situation. He might not view it this way at the time, but he is lucky to have you. If it was me, I would have no hesitation in reporting it.

Best wishes to you. x

I just filled in the form on the website . You can state you want to be anonymous. Say you don’t think the person concerned is fit to drive. I think they just have sent a letter to my mother asking her to retake her test or
something like that as she voluntarily gave up very soon afterwards. Her car was covered in dents and damage from multiple prangs.

Report it anonymously.

I really wish there was a reflex test that drivers were made to do along with getting their eyes tested. It could be screen based so done at the opticians at the same time.
I was in a similar situation with DF about 6 months ago. I hadn’t actually seen him driving badly but the gardener told me he had reversed into his stationary van more than a few times. Why on earth he couldn’t report him himself I do not know- well actually I do - when it comes to elderly people every single thing seems to be the responsibility of their adult DC. In my case I did knowing that it would indeed cause even more work for me because somehow a £14 return journey taxi was more expensive than us driving an hour each way. Anyway events overtook us and I got the doctor to tell him not to drive when he was admitted with extreme confusion.

It’s easy to report and you don’t have to have the agreement of anybody- your DF, your DAunt, your DGPs to do it. In fact I would do it without telling anyone so they don’t need to know it was you.

It's my grandad's biggest fear, the day he realises he needs to stop driving. He's mid 80s and currently fit and alert and still driving "old people" to the hospital as a volunteer! However, he recognises he finds driving in the dark difficult so hasn't done that in over 3 years and long journeys are no longer possible so those are avoided and if they are needed planned with an overnight stay. In recent years he has been using the bus a lot more to get used to being independent without a car. I think if I ever noticed a problem I'd be able to speak to him about it thankfully, but I'm semi confident he'd recognise it before I did, however hard it felt.

We have the exact same problem except it’s my 90 year father and my overbearing mother. She’s insistent he’s fine and that they would lose their independent if they couldn’t drive despite the fact taxis have been mentioned and they can more than afford it. He has been diagnosed with mild cognitive decline which I reported to the DVLA last year and they did nothing. He had to renew his licence this year and I had to fill the form in but it just asked for diagnoses which I reiterated. That was February and we’ve heard nothing or so my parents say. I have genuine concerns he’s got a letter back saying his driving licence has been withdrawn and we’ve not been told but DVLA won’t speak to us (me and my sister) only to him.

I haven’t driven with him but people who have say he’s a safe driver but my issue is he struggles to make decisions, forgets where he is and I don’t think is capable of acting quickly in an emergency situation. He’s got 3 parking tickets in the past 6 months. When we saw one of the photos he’d actually just abandoned it in a car park in what he thought was a parking space but wasn’t. He also had to do a speed awareness course (23 in a 20) and it won’t get picked up unless they’re asked questions and clearly don’t understand what’s going on. They also insist he only does short journeys but in the past few weeks since the weather has improved he’s taken some long drives into the countryside.

It’s big worry and I think my next move is to report anonymously. At the very least I think they need to do some proper assessment of him.

My DM (82) insists she could still drive, if she needs to and that she would like to be able to. She has cognative decline (nothing yet diagnosed but you only have to have a conversation with her to notice), poor eyesight and needs to go to the opticians, but even then it is unlikely that she would wear her glasses as she often claims she can see perfectly well.
Fortunately her physical health means that she would struggle to walk to where the car is parked and for extra measures we have moved the car keys.
DF (81) seems absolutely fine, processing skills and sight not even questionable so this is why they still have a car.

And to add, we haven't reported her to the DVLA yet, as we are not sure it would make any difference, she would either not remember that she wasn't allowed to drive, or just do it anyway. Prevention is the better option.

I am so sorry for your loss. This is exactly what I’m afraid of, I couldn’t live with myself if he did something like this and I didn’t do everything I could to stop him. I will report it

I can't believe the number of posters essentially telling you to turn a blind eye! I think if you've noticed it, then it is your responsibility to report it.
I have done just that recently. Reported to DVLA following an accident, all anonymous, they're not quick to act but they are acting and the person isn't driving at the moment as the car was a write-off.

But the point is the op has not seen her grandfather drive.

I think there's enough in the OP to warrant telling the DVLA about her concerns.
Reporting someone will not necessarily result in his licence being revoked but in this circumstance may well do.

He has to give up driving, in his own and 'the public interest' as they call it. A little girl was killed in a town in Co Antrim a couple of years ago because an elderly driver pressed the accelerator instead of the brake. It's not worth the risk just so he can maintain 'independence'. If his general health isn't great, he might also be in stroke or TIA territory as a mid 80s man, you don't want to suffer one of those at the wheel ffs.
(Attendance Allowance at the lower rate is about £300 a month, it can help pay for taxi journeys to the shops, doctors, appts etc. )

If his adult children are determined to be completely wet about it and won’t report him themselves, then yes, you should.
Honestly I think people who know a relative shouldn’t drive, and just flap about wringing their hands while not reporting are completely awful. Yes, the reporting may not lead to anything. And if that happens, ultimately you cannot actually stop them driving. But a firm conversation before they get into a machine capable of killing someone is really a bare minimum.

My nan was a nightmare in her car .. she had a couple of TIAs and she had lumps out of her car .. I approached her doctor twice and asked if there was anything he could do and he said no and that he could only ask her, which he says he did and she refused. She would drive down to my house with one hand over her eye, that had a cataract following the middle line as a guide... Her son also aided and abetted her as he'd lost his licence due to glaucoma but still needed to get about. My nan also used to lie about the continual damage to the car and it was really a nightmare.. afterwards I found out my uncle with no licence had been driving it too... I did take the keys and my uncle produced the spare and had it copied..Sadly she was only stopped when she had a massive stroke and never left care again .. my uncle came and took her car up to his but I cancelled the insurance. I could not believe that the doctor didn't want to help and I know this sounds daft but I didn't know you could just report someone, I wish I had. She knew how I felt because I refused to let my girls go in the car with her but she just blanked all of it out and carried on. I want to be clear in her younger years she was none of these things, most certainly not dishonest but the damage from the TIAs changed her and she had vascular dementia.

Haven’t read all the replies but I reported someone anonymously it has taken them four months to send a form of which said person then just didn’t tell the truth in their answers.

The form has been sent back, no idea what happens next?

When my father obviously had dementia my sister and i removed the car from his house so he couldnt drive it, and sold it. He thought it was being repaired initially but then seemed to forget all about it.

i dont understand why family members dont just remove the car.

Well, to be fair, you were 'lucky' there @bilbodog
I mean, you did a good thing but the fact that he had dementia and quickly forgot about it was lucky for you. I don't doubt that the dementia made things tough in many other ways. But a lot of people who are past driving would not forget and would just get themselves another car. It's a terrible problem in society.

@Gingercatlover
Did you mention any medical issues? They can check with GP. Whether they will, I don't know. I agree the slow response and what seems like the DVLA not prioritising the issue is really frustrating.

I agree. We are so wedded to driving in our society, that we blind ourselves to just how dangerous it is, and the idea of not doing it is seen as extreme (see the approbation elsewhere on MN directed at non-drivers).
How do people who turn a blind eye to dangerous elderly drivers feel about drink driving? I know morally it feels different, but outcome is potentially the same.

But if she has concerns about him in day to day life, he’s hardly going to be on the ball when driving behind a vehicle that could have the potential to end someones life.

report him Op. someone losing their life doesn’t trump someone having their independence.

It’s different if someone doesn’t have capacity anymore but I can’t steal the car of someone who does have mental capacity (which my grandad does). I could be done for theft!

I’d make an excuse to get him to drive you somewhere and then take it from there. If you feel his driving is dangerous, report him.

Both my parents still drive very competently at 86 and 84.

It always seems like madness that on licence renewal there isn’t a medical assessment that is needed. It’s blatantly obvious that people will not be truthful on forms and will not declare medical issues if if stops them driving. It shouldn’t be the responsibility of family and friends, who are then at risk of abuse and relationship fracturing. It should be a blanket, fair medical assessment that everyone needs to have before a renewal takes place.

Shop him to the DVLA. My friend did this with her father, and I would have done it with mine. If people won’t take responsibility for their actions…

I agree