DM said she sees no point in being alive anymore

[Jumpeduppantry]

Just putting this here as it’s playing on my mind. Very elderly (90s) DM is frail and always tired and short of breath, and balance not great. Lives in very supported accommodation which has worked well for her for last 10 years. She has no major diagnoses just old age / frailty.
Anyhow, yesterday for first time she said that there’s no point being alive anymore. She’s never expressed this before. She’s always been a very logical, unsentimental and pessimistic person with a strong tendency to assume the worst, get anxious about everything. Visiting her is very draining and depressing.
Im just struggling with how to process her statement as it’s obviously not a situation that i can solve. I’ve always been the positive one, cajoling her into taking a less negative view or doing things to distract herself otherwise she will sit in silence and dwell on things. Its just exhausting.
I don’t know what I want from this post but I just needed to put into words somehow. I just acknowledged that it’s how she feels and didn’t try to discuss it. To be honest I think in her situation I’d feel the same.

Both parents passed when they were early 90's. I think there needs to be a grown up conversation about this. The medical profession pat themselves on the back when they do the same procedure on a 95 year old even though they are just carted off back to the care home where they often lead a miserable existence. God forbid they should be accussed of being ageist.

My late Mum had DNR in her fridge and on her notes which actually couldnt be found during one hospital visit! She wouldnt have survived the procedure or been very very brain damaged. In the end after a few years of struggling she seemed to just give up, didnt want any food and just wasted away. She had EOL drugs prescribed a few months before to the care home. I was told bearing in mind her wishes and mine they would be used at the appropriate time. I refused all further hospital visits and stated she should be allowed to die with some compassion.

Quite honestly from a financial point of view this is a ticking time bomb. Mum was in receipt of her state pension for nearly 32 years plus her public sector pension, plus Attendance Allowance and the cost of her various stays in hospital where she went in for say a UTI and didnt come out for two weeks! Quite honestly any Dr who came near her was asked to make her better and any question regarding the pain she was in was answered with a 10. No one was brave enough to just state she was very very old.

but that truly is something to be grateful for.

I think she’s reminding you that if something does happen she doesn’t want to be resuscitated. If she hasn’t already talk about a DNR being in place and get powers of attorney completed so you have control not medical professionals if it occurs

My Nan was the same - sharp as a tack until the day she died never once losing her mental facilities but by the end (98) she could barely hear, barely see and struggled to get around.

over the years seeing her unable to do the hobbies that gave her joy (she was brilliant at cross stitch we still own quite a few) loved doing crosswords puzzles and enjoyed reading and watching crime dramas. She was able to do these plus visit my Aunt in Australia until she was 90 but the last few months when she couldn’t even enjoy an audio book through her hearing aid anymore was tough.

coupled with her daughter being in Australia and my Dad being diagnosed with Parkinson’s meant he couldn’t visit as much anymore either and the focus almost switched to him needing care and attention

IMO they’re absolutely entitled to feel like this, and should never be subject to officious ‘striving to keep alive’, whether by medics or relatives who ‘can’t bear to let Mum go.’

A GM’s (widowed) 2nd husband, early 90s and usually a very jolly old chap, had evidently had enough when he told DM ‘I’m tired now’, and died not long afterwards, not of anything in particular.

This is very common. I remember my husband’s grandmother, dozing off then waking up saying ‘I thought I had managed to go then’. It really does seem cruel to keep people alive who don’t want to be. As a pp said, I think patients have the right to stop their medication but that is all.

Can her remarks maybe lead to a wider conversation about her wishes around her health care and end of life care. Does she still want to take all her medications or take the flu vaccine for example.
I know it's hard but your Mum may be grateful to talk

This.

Happens to so many people who just want to move on, be at peace and out of pain. Even if in good health it can get boring, my nan was bored. She just wanted to go, as although in good health, it wasn’t good enough to do the things she wanted to do.

I don’t know why on earth you should feel guilty. IMO he was very lucky - it was an infinitely better way to go than after years of cancer or dementia.

I think I meant I feel guilty that I'm glad he went when he did, rather than lingering. It feels hugely counter intuitive to feel positive about a loved one's death.

Hi OP - my DM is younger than yours at 75, but she’s in a nursing home with incurable cancer. She’s had a rotten 5 years with DF suddenly dying traumatically at home, then Covid then her old cancer coming back at mets. She has very, very limited mobility due to surgeries and tumour and nothing else can really be done apart from taking medication that helps restrain the cancer. She can just about walk a little bit with a zimmer and will ultimately only get worse until she is bed bound. She had to move into the nursing home as she was constantly falling and failing to take medication - she’s on strong painkillers that make her increasingly confused as the day goes on.

Her cancer has been classed as stable for a couple of years and she might live for long time yet. But, she’s had enough. She’s lost her husband, her independence, her home. The meds confuse her and often she’s not like my DM anymore. It’s difficult as we’ve always been so close, the best of friends. The nursing home is good - she is well taken care of, the staff are kind and even loving, the food is good and there are activities she joins in with. But I know if she could push a button or take a pill to end things, she absolutely would. If she asked me to help her, I absolutely would.

I have POA and we’ve had lots of conversations re: her wishes, I know exactly what she would want. I love her very much and she’s been a great DM and DGM, it’s my job to make sure that if and when an opportunity arises for an easier, less prolonged exit - pneumonia, for instance - that she is allowed to take it and not be medically treated against her wishes. When DM talks about being ready “to go” I just tell her that I know and I understand and it’s okay because I know her wishes and will make sure they’re carried out. It’s better to talk about these things and face then head on, but emotionally it can put you through the wringer. I’ll be distraught when DM dies, but I’ll also be relieved that it’s over and I don’t think those conflicting feelings are anything to be ashamed of.

My Mum phoned me at work one day to announce similar. I was having a horribly stressful time at the time was a bit short with her on the phone (and started a thread on Mumsnet about how difficult I found it - some people replying had some sympathy for me, some had only sympathy for my mother).

She passed away fairly suddenly less than two months later. It was a good thing in the end.

I am sorry for the strain this is having on you, OP. I think it's a very understandable situation.

My GM is 90 and extremely lucky so far - she socialises, plays in a local orchestra group, goes on coach trips, no major health issues. I can remember one time when she went to Devon with some friends and had a small fall, where she broke a couple of fingers. When we suggested maybe not going so far next time... she said "No chance, I do what I enjoy. When I can't enjoy it anymore then I want out." To that end she sometimes takes 'risks' that you might usually not at that age - travelling, the odd red wine, she does most of her own house chores, very reluctant to use walking aids etc. She wants to maintain absolutely maximum quality of life and if that ever started to slip - I imagine it would not take long before she started to say the same things as your Mum.

My lovely Granny was 99 when she died and still very active and mentally sharp and living in her own home and interested in life and happy. She was ill and in hospital overnight and then home and seemingly better for two days. The next afternoon she said she'd had enough now and was asking God to take her. She died early in the morning on the following day in her own bed, her heart just stopped. It was as if she somehow willed it. I still miss her terribly but it was a good death.

My Mother became like this, she lived till she was 94 and she was totally correct. She was by then blind and couldn’t walk. She had other health issues of an intimate nature, I am a very practical tough type but to write what she went through would feel like a disservice to her. She should have died when she was around 89/90 but that cocktail of 14 drugs a day helped keep her alive. It made me resent the keep alive at all costs mentality of some health care professionals. My Father refused treatment and died at 84, I feel like him currently and hope my mind doesn’t decline so I remain like him.

MIL is starting to fail cognitively and has just been treated for cancer, it’s awful currently as she has just said she wants to live with us,

Well done for acknowledging her feelings, it is all you can do.