Self fund - run out of money - then what?

[CareHome]

I'm a long time poster elsewhere on MN but have changed my username for this as details are outing.

Dad is 91 with advanced Parkinson's. Lives with mum (89) who is his main carer and my brother (65) still lives at home.

Mum is struggling to deal with care needs of dad. They have a care package in place with visits for getting dad up and washed and end of day getting him ready for bed. When carers are late/don't show, mum takes on the care. Dad is very frail, uses a frame to assist him but cannot consistently weight bear. Mum is struggling to look after him when he needs to go to the loo. He has toileting accidents frequently as he doesn't make it in time.

At my mum's request, I'm looking into a local care home for dad. I've found one that is lovely but will cost £1500 pw. Dad will have to self fund to begin with (he currently pays for the carers) and as the money falls to below the £23,500 I know we can apply for council to fund and he'll need to probably top up, if the council agree.

However, if he can't top up (after all mum needs money to live off too!) what could happen? Would council insist he moves care home to one they run?

Also mum is showing cognitive decline, and I worry if she needed a home in the future, how that would also be paid for. I wouldn't want either parent moving anywhere within the county as I wouldn't be able to travel easily to visit them.

Has anyone on here faced similar? Any advice to pass on?
Thank you!

If DF runs out of money then the council will take over his care. They will assess his needs at that stage and look at the level of funding they pay locally.

Ideally they will agree he needs the level of care offered by the care home, and will have an agreement with the care home to meet their costs. So no change.

Potentially they could agree he needs residential care but have to move him to a care home that does take council funded residents.

Worst (unlikely) case scenario they could decide he doesn't need residential care at all - but that is very unlikely especially if he's been in residential care for a while.

If there is no money for DM then the council will assess her and offer one or more options that they can fund.

Ask the lovely care home what their procedures are - some will accept social care funding, some won't, some will accept it if he's been self funding for a while. They will also do a needs assessment for him and advise on that basis too.

The council can move people however in practice they tend not to, not least because with elderly people the stay tends to be relatively short.

it’s worth talking to the home about it though.

Hopefully, when you started to pay for care for your father, your parents split their money into equal pits and spent from his for the care? And if not, do so now - you don’t want to spend all their joint funds on his care down to £23k leaving your mother penniless

Or is at coming from his income?

When dad had to go into care from hospital (D2A) his social worker found a home that would meet his needs, was convenient for mum to visit, and was typically fully funded by the council when the money runs out. Our LPA hadn't come through at the time. Does your dad have a SW? Has he had a care needs assessment?

Thanks @olderbutwiser, I know the home does accept Council funding so that shouldn't be a barrier. He definitely needs a care home - he's on medication for his Parkinson's and sleeps most of the day and can barely walk - residential wouldn't be enough. The home I've seen agrees that care is what is needed rather than rest and they would do their own needs assessment. He has had a needs assessment some time ago via the council, but trying to organise and contact them is painful to say the least as it seems responsibility is split between district council and county council.

It's his income - he gives mum housekeeping money for the shopping. They're very traditional and old school. Mum has her state pension and own savings.

Not a named SW, no. My sister has spoken to duty workers but not had much in writing from them. He had a needs assessment some time ago and care was agreed for 3 mornings a week. We've now increased that to 7 days a week, morning and evening, through the council, but self-funded as mum says she can't cope with dad. If the carer is late, mum will get dad up or put him to bed. The last I heard the council had proposed a stair lift, but trying to get stuff confirmed in writing is proving difficult despite emailing several times. Various people contact mum, but due to her cognitive decline she can't tell me who called and can only vaguely remember what it was about.

Op

i think you are close to or at the stage where you need to involve social services and your mum has to state clearly that she cannot safely care for your dad at home, even with the carers in place, and that residential care is needed. The toileting accidents are a clear indication of this. With my MIL, who the hospital wanted to send home after a long stay, we had to point out that if she soiled herself in the evening or overnight, FIL would be unable to change her and she’d have to wait for the morning carers. That’s not acceptable.

is your brother involved in their care ? Of he’d living there full time, can he handle phone calls on your mums behalf?

Thanks @rickyrickygrimes.
Social services are involved, they're just hard to get hold of. Emails take weeks to get a response. Phone calls hit and miss with calls not always returned. Paperwork not forthcoming - we have nothing in writing about the increased care package that has been in place for 1month.

No brother has very limited care duties other than being chauffeur to mum and basic handyman. He cannot handle phone calls about care as gets easily confused.