What’s reasonable to expect from siblings?

[alladvicegratefullyappreciated]

I (youngest D of 3) live close to ailing DM (Alzheimer’s) and DF (cancer currently well controlled). Both 80. Carers x twice a day for DM. DM is early late stage so things are getting hard to manage. I cover a lot of appointments for DF as he can’t take DM with him. Plus see them at least for an afternoon each weekend. Work FT, 2 teenage DDs one Y11 both dance so lots of driving around in eves. DH getting very angry re input from DBs who live 2.5 hours away and come for a night about every 2 months. Both work FT and no kids. DH and I having arguments on repeat. What’s reasonable to expect of sibling contributions living further away?

You can expect and you can ask OP (and you should - since they're as responsible for your DPs as you are), but if they're not willing to do more, and you can't force them to, then at least agree that the three of you will discuss how to lessen the load on you. It may be that more carer visits are needed, that the three of you (plus your DF) need to start looking at care homes for your DM, that SS need to do a new assessment if her needs have increased, or something else. Perhaps there are logistical things they can do from home - organising the weekly shop, liasing with the care agency, sorting out bills so they're all on DD, sorting out issues with your DPs home - that kind of thing.

In terms of your DF's appointments and you being responsible for ferrying him to and fro, as a PP said, look into volunteers for this. The GP receptionists may be able to help or Age Concern.

Re: your DH, he needs to stop being a dick and actually help - help you more around the house, help ferrying your DDs around, help you to find ways to reduce your mental and practical load both at home and regarding your DPs. You're supposed to be a team and he's supposed to support you as your partner in life - atm it sounds like he's actually making things harder for you, rather than easier.

These are all really helpful opinions! Thank you everyone. My DH pulls his weight with household and ferrying DD about. Also helps out DF with practical stuff (DF car, driving DF to appointments etc). I genuinely think this isn’t about impact on DH - it’s about him thinking I’m doing too much, he thinks DF needs more support (true) and our time together. DF good with life admin, caring load is what is hardest. DM maybe a year or so at home, realistically. PoA in place. I think I will open conversation and ask DBs. I’ve never directly asked as feel guilty about even asking 😫

Expect nothing. You can ask, maybe they will do more, maybe they won’t, it depends on their circumstances. What they do or don’t do has no bearing on what you do or don’t do. You need to set your own boundaries and do what you think you can/what you want to do to help - if you are taking on too much, stop doing it. Yes, you can, it’s in your gift, no one else’s. You are not responsible and are martyring yourself which won’t be good for your own health.

Don't feel guilty to ask.
They may have genuinely never thought about it.
Tell them clearly that current situation us unsustainable. Ask for help.

“I have reached my limit, DBros - I can do this, this and this. Can you either do that, that and that or support parents in putting it in place?”

You can’t expect anything from siblings.

I live 2.5 hours drive away from my late Mum. In the last 2 years of her life I visited monthly but wasn't doing any care for her or taking her to appointments. My brother lived an hour away and was retired, no kids, so did a fair bit more.

If I'd been closer to my Mum and found more pleasure in her company I guess I would have visited more often.

OP

Many people are saying that you can’t expect anything from siblings. The corollary of that is that they can’t expect anything from you

My sister and I have never got on very well and that made things very complex when our dad fell ill. The honest truth is that she was as much help as a wet paper bag because of her denial that he was dying.

It sounds like your DB's aren't on board with any of it, and I wouldn't even attempt to get them to do more if it's wasting your mental energy. You need to set your own boundaries, take on what you can physically and mentally cope with, and then get professionals to take on the rest. My personal take is that someone with dementia can't be safely cared for at home once the disease progresses to a certain level (I worked in care for many years) so you need to be able to recognise that point. A good nursing home may be the option for them both - and at that point, you can go back to being their daughter instead of their care manager.

I completely burned out when my Dad was ill, just over a 10 month period and truthfully, the last few weeks when he was in a hospice were so much easier because I was able to sleep at night knowing he was safe and that my sister couldn't try and take over. You can't set yourself on fire to keep them warm, never forget that It has taken me nearly a year to feel myself again.

My DBs were absolutely fecking useless when DM was terminally ill and DF had dementia. I’d just advise outsourcing as much as possible and have conversations now with your DP about carers, care homes etc so your mum can contribute. Age uk were very helpful with my DP. I understand why your DH is protective and cross, mine was horrified by how little DBs did but we’ve agreed a) they were shit b) that will be their burden to bear during the long dark teatime of the soul…

I've been in a similar position OP. But it was my MIL who was ill and DBIL lived in another country.

It was miserable for all of us.

What helped was when we (DH and I) asked DBIL for specific things. Eg setting up and paying for personal alarm. Doing weekly online food shop. Paying for a cleaner. Buying MIL an iPad so they could FaceTime Sunday afternoons.

It needed spelling out to him how much we were doing. How much time it took away from our DC. How much £ we spent each week in hospital car parking. How many times we had to leave work in the middle of the day because there was an emergency.

None of which we begrudged, but all things he didn't see or think about. He immediately stepped up to the practical and financial stuff he could do from a distance.

I'm certain he felt guilty that we bore the brunt, but once we gave him a list of tasks, he got straight onto it.

This isn't answering your question.
But the very reason you are asking the question is because what is being asked of you is no longer sustainable.
The changes lie at your feet.
You need to change your own response to make yourself feel more in control.
Essentially, that's the answer...

What's reasonable to expect? Unconditional* support for you and usually the decisions you make, as the person on the spot. A listening ear when you discuss these things.

*That doesn't mean theyre not allowed to express an opinion, but the main carer nearby gets the casting vote.

I think you need to focus FAR more on what it's reasonable for you to do. Your parents have increased needs and with them you need to look at what other support you can organise. In particular, do you mean by cover that you are taking your df to appointments? Look for volunteer driving services. Does your DM need more care visits a day - I'm not sure what you mean by 'things are hard to manage'. Is your weekly visit a nice social thing, or are you running yourself ragged doing their cleaning and laundry and making meals?

If I'm honest it sounds as if it might be sensible for them to move into a nursing home together.

OP putting it bluntly, you'll never get the time back with your DH or your teenagers unless you cut back on what you're doing for your parents and put some boundaries in place. It's really easy to get sucked into more and more caring, and before you know it your children have left home.
And I've seen this happen a couple of times - relationship with partner gets put on hold because of caring for elderly people, then something happens (accident, serious illness) and they've lost that relationship and all that time they could have enjoyed together.

@alladvicegratefullyappreciated my DF had cancer and dementia, because one crap illness wasn’t enough! He and DM managed for a while but then things started to ramp up. Ended up in hospital after a fall. Hospital tried to get him discharged home but we knew DM really couldn’t cope anymore. We got a home sorted for him. DM and I felt the guilt but the nurse said to my DM you can go back to being his wife and not his carer. Unfortunately he died from the cancer before he actually got to the home 😔 But you need to frame it like this, are you and DF pretty much carers for your DM? Is this impacting yours and your DF’s health. Are you slowly becoming your DF’s carer?

You can ask but you can't demand or expect. Your brothers will have to make their own decision about how much or how little they are able to help, and you will have to figure out what you can do for yourself. If it isn't enough, then paid care is the only other alternative.

There is no point in your DH getting annoyed with you about what your brothers are or aren't doing. You can only control what you do yourself.

I'm the sibling that lives near my elderly parents. Dsis lives too far away to really contribute. It is what it is. If it gets to be too much for me, we will have to find an alternative way forward.

It is none of your husband’s business to police his in-laws’ behaviour. If helping to care for your mother is too much for you to manage then you need to look at an institutional solution.

Your DH has no business to intrude upon his in-laws’ relationships or sense of responsibility towards your parents.

And it’s making your life more difficult as well. He needs to calm down and butt out.

Can you get more paid care put in place for your parents?

I am the sibling in this situation. It wasn't realistic to travel up every weekend or even every few weeks for long. We couldn't stay over either so it was a day visit. We did every 4 to 6 weeks for years, but it didn't make any material difference.

It wasn't realistic for my sibling to do as much as they were and they were getting close to burnout. Both they and Mum were resistant to paid care.

Mum is now in a home which has made a massive difference to the sibling who is nearest. My mum is a lot happier too.

Having kids does make you busier. Weird thing to say. I was far busier in the week with 3 younger kids than I am now 2 are adults and 1 late teen.

I live a very long way away from my elderly parents (late 80s both needing outside care). I see them once a year after a 24 hour plane journey. When I’m there, I do what I can to relieve my siblings from daily visits.

Nut it is what it is. I am never going to live near enough to take on a large role in their care. That is non-negotiable

If one of my siblings-in-law started laying down the law about my involvement I would be furious. They would be interfering completely inappropriately in my relationships with my parents and my siblings.

My siblings and I have frank conversations about our parents’ care. I can do little except provide (quite a lot of) money and also a lot of moral support. I will support whatever decision my siblings make - they’re the ones bearing the burden of care. In fact, I am currently using them to move forward more quickly on plans for institutional care for our father.

It is becoming too much for one sibling and their life and choices are important as well. Institutional care will actually provide more of the specialist care our father is starting to need.

But that has nothing to do with my sibling’s spouse!

You can't expect anything. My Dsis would have done anything for our DF (she was his clear favourite) but I had a completely different relationship with him and was not prepared to offer support as I'd had nothing but criticism all my life.

And I agree that your brothers not having children is irrelevant. Childless people have lives too and those lives are just as valuable as those of parents. We can’t know that they are necessarily less busy than the OP.

Bottom line @alladvicegratefullyappreciated is that you probably need to work towards moving your mother to specialist institutional care. Dementia is cruel and usually needs more care than family can provide.

This, 100%

Even if they come for a visit, does that actually take any real burden off of you? Popping in for lunch doesn’t help you with the day to day logistics of managing their lives.

in terms of real support, you can expect nothing. Even if they lived next door, you can’t expect them to provide care. It is a highly personal choice and depends on their individual relationship with the parents. Not everyone has a healthy enough relationship with their parent to step into the role of caregiver.

I think you do need to ask each of them to come for a full weekend a month or for a day a fortnight.
What you can't control is their response, but it is not an unreasonable ask.

That is presuming they have a similarly close relationship with your parents.