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Elderly parents

Father living in squalor mostly alone, abroad. Help!

24 replies

DaughterOfSqualor · 07/10/2024 10:30

This is my first post in this particular corner of MN (I've been on here since 2006 but name-changed in case my mother finds it, as I suspect she knows my regular username) and to my shame I had no idea there was even an 'Elderly Parents' board. Hello. Smile

Well, I suspect my post isn't going to be particularly unusual. To cut it short, both parents are hoarders. They live in gradually decaying houses and when something stops working that's it. No repairs. They tend not to let anyone in because 'of the state of the house' so it's a vicious circle.

Because of somewhat unusual circs, my mother lives half the year in the UK in their jointly owned house (which is a right state) and my father lives in an EU country about 2 hours' flight away. He holds dual nationality and his original nationality is of that country. Because of Brexit and my parents' joint dislike of engaging with complicated paperwork/stress/bureaucracy, they have never sorted out paperwork to allow my British mother to stay over there longer than 90 days in 180. (Despite being married - UK wedding cert - to my father for well over 50 years!) So, back and forth she goes. She is 78 now Sad and dad is 82. They are both extremely resistant to facing up to the state things are now in and accepting any sort of help. Either from my brother and me, or from any outside agency.

It's my father I'm most concerned about. He's getting very vague and mum and I suspect losing his marbles. (His parents both had some sort of dementia by the time they died.) For half the year, he's living on his own in a fairly large house in a residential area of the city. There are stairs. He absolutely does not look after himself. Sad Every time my mother returns there's a hell of a mess to clear up - kitchen in utter squalor, maggots in the rubbish bin in the kitchen, cat litter trays overflowing, fridge full of rotten food. He tends to buy ready meals (they're much nicer than in the UK!) and takeaway cooked food from supermarket and eat that, plus goes out to lunch a couple of times a week (it's very reasonable there). He has two friends left alive really, one is housebound, the other he sees once a week. I honestly think it's all that keeps him going - being able to talk to an old friend in his original language and get out and about in a very minor way.

But the house is an almighty state. A couple of weeks ago, my father had a fall outside. (He was feeding the feral cats that my parents have taken it upon themselves to feed and get neutered, and again while this creates its own problems, I think it keeps him going. They are nice friendly cats!) He lay outside on the concrete for maybe 3 hours and nobody could get hold of him. Could have killed him. Eventually he managed to crawl back inside. By the time I got hold of him, I'd decided we had to ring a cousin (my age) to check him over, as he was refusing to call for medical help. My cousins came over the next morning and took him to A&E where he was patched up, scanned etc. (Great service, far better than current A&E in the UK!) They obviously saw inside the house and what they saw horrified them. They said dad desperately needs a cleaner.

Initially I thought maybe they were being overly squeamish. I would LOVE someone to come over to him once a day, just drop in for an hour, chat, make sure he wasn't lying on the floor, and that he was ok, taking his pills, maybe do some washing up... But my mother has just now travelled over there and by her reports, things are far, far worse than they've ever been. I won't go into details but it's essentially a health hazard. Not just a bit of washing up.

Dad had been very compliant with my cousins and nodded and made the right noises when they told him he needed someone to come in, but deferred the decision and said he'd have to talk to my mother.

My mother safeguards this topic of conversation and I have to tread very carefully, to avoid upsetting her/triggering hysterics. Sad She was at first saying 'well maybe, but it'll be very expensive' (cleaner my cousin found for us charges Euro 10 an hour!! Bargain) but after she told me, at length, everything she found on this trip over (the maggots, the filth, the untouched food on the hob from her last visit...) and I said 'look, I know you don't want to hear this, but he needs someone coming in' she just flatly said 'we can't afford it'.

I have no idea of their finances. They're not great with money (nor am I) and there used to be plenty and now there isn't. Confused There is no way on earth they are going to sit down with my brother and me and have a grown-up conversation about this. They don't open envelopes (well my dad doesn't) and while a rental property is being 'managed' by a cousin of his, we suspect it's being mismanaged and something untoward may be going on there. (She's a lawyer, she does take a fee for property managing. We are not convinced it's all being done fairly though.)

I am at one remove from this and am 'not allowed' to just fly over and help. If he were living in this state in the UK I'd have some idea of where to start in terms of accessing a home help, and I could book a private cleaner. I know it's a horrible system in the UK, we'd probably have to sell their house and move him somewhere smaller with no stairs. But in the EU country he lives in - I don't even have enough language to be able to deal with the system! I am already in a debt of gratitude to my cousins who stepped in, and maybe we'll just have to ask them to help us again.

If you were in my position, what would you do? I have no idea where to turn, and I feel so useless as a daughter. My poor dad lives in squalor, he can't look after himself, he won't let anyone from the outside try, and my mother is driving herself crazy doing what she can, at 78. Sad

OP posts:
MereDintofPandiculation · 07/10/2024 10:41

It would help if we knew which country. That would make a big difference as to who you tackled.

sakura06 · 07/10/2024 10:48

Oh gosh. It sounds very difficult. DH's dad lives in an EU country and has Alzheimer's. DH has never lived in his home country so finds the system hard to navigate, but is at least fluent in the language which helps massively. We also rely a fair bit on his lovely cousin to keep us informed.

Getting a cleaner sounds like a good plan! Making sure your mum and dad can live together might also help with their costs. Your mum must surely have a right to live in the other EU country??

So sorry OP. It's very challenging.

sakura06 · 07/10/2024 10:50

Would strongly advise them getting to agree to the equivalent of Power of Attorney too before things worsen.

DaughterOfSqualor · 07/10/2024 11:24

MereDintofPandiculation · 07/10/2024 10:41

It would help if we knew which country. That would make a big difference as to who you tackled.

It's Portugal. Sorry, I have this paranoid fear than if my mother suspected I'd been using a forum she knows I spend a lot of time on, to air this issue, she'd be furious and it would make things much worse!

OP posts:
Bluefields96 · 07/10/2024 11:37

Have you tried contacting the Portuguese Embassy in London or the British Embassy in London to see if they can advise on obtaining the correct paperwork?

The deadline for the original settlement scheme has probably passed in Portugal as it has in UK. But the UK has a special scheme in place for vulnerable people who did not manage to complete the process in time - so I wonder if Portugal has something similar.

I absolutely feel for you. My elderly parents (one UK one EU) were horribly impacted by the Brexit decision which they voted against. They felt they were abandoned by the UK government despite having paid tax and NI all their working lives and I fear it hastened their demise.
.

Bluefields96 · 07/10/2024 11:46

British Embassy Lisbon

username7891 · 07/10/2024 12:01

Portugal has help for Elderly people in the form of home help:
https://www2.gov.pt/pt/servicos/obter-informacoes-sobre-o-apoio-social-para-pessoas-idosas-servico-de-apoio-domiciliario

They also have an NGO called AMI who support elderly people but they're in Lisbon. It might be an idea to contact them and ask about local services in his area.

I would arrange for cleaners to do a clean out of some rooms in the house for example kitchen, hallway, living room bedroom and then arrange for a regular cleaner.

If they don't have money, your dad is entitled to cash for the over 65s. I would also look at paying half with your brother.

Portugal also have residential homes. I would try to organise POA for welfare and finances and take it from there.

beetr00 · 07/10/2024 12:01

This may be a starting point @DaughterOfSqualor

https://www.seg-social.pt/complemento-por-dependencia

BlueLegume · 07/10/2024 12:07

@DaughterOfSqualor so sorry to hear of your situation. Not much to add other than sympathy about them simply not being prepared to engage with help.

wwjalme · 07/10/2024 12:22

I am at one remove from this and am 'not allowed' to just fly over and help

Why can't you fly over? Is it your dad saying that or is there some kind of legal reason.
I would book a hotel near his home and go over to see for yourself and start making a start on the house.
I would ask your cousins for information on what help is available in Portugal. I live in another EU country and even though I have never used the services I know what is available and who to contact so your cousins should be able to do that.
You can also message the embassy as others have suggested to see if they can provide you with a list of contacts/services/charities who deal with things like this.

It sounds like your dad is no longer capable of living in his own home on his own so difficult decisions will have to be made. Would he come back to the UK or is that not something he'd consider? Could he move into some kind of sheltered accommodation where your mother could also visit from time to time?

MereDintofPandiculation · 07/10/2024 21:56

This company works in conjunction with Social Services to clean homes and make them habitable again

Síndrome de Diógenes | Acumuladores – Junk Service – E o lixo desaparece!

https://junkservice.pt/service/sindrome-de-diogenes-acumuladores/

MereDintofPandiculation · 07/10/2024 22:01

Also This one

MereDintofPandiculation · 07/10/2024 22:03

I appreciate your mother’s pride will make it very difficult for her to allow either of these companies in. Would your father tolerate it when she’s not there?

unsync · 07/10/2024 22:12

Your mother's status should be a priority to sort out. If she had residency, presumably she would stay there with your father? Would it be their intention to remain in Portugal and not return to the UK? If so, can the house in the UK be sold to provide funds?

BruFord · 07/10/2024 22:16

As your cousin is helpful and able to help language-wise, could you arrange to go over to find out what's happening and meet up with them for lunch/dinner to discuss what can be done? If you and your brother can finance a cleaner, it sounds as if your cousin would help you find one. Although tbh, it sounds as if your Dad needs more extensive assistance in order to continue living at home., something equivalent to a care needs assessment. Again, if your cousin could help you contact the correct departments, you can probably get this arranged.

That's what I did when my Dad started to need support, I just said that I was coming over to help him out (I live abroad)! Once you have the support in place, your Dad will realize how much easier his life is.

I do understand how difficult it is to insist that you're going to help when they're telling you not to. Unfortunately, many people do need support in their 80's and you find that your previous roles are reversing, with the child being the caregiver rather than the parent. Flowers

FiveShelties · 07/10/2024 22:19

Why are you 'not allowed' to fly over?

Mandarinaduck · 07/10/2024 22:29

i think I might start by looking for a Facebook group linked to the city your DF lives in (group for expats if you need it to be in English) that you could join and ask for help directly there. Then you should be able to get some local info or recommendations.

funnelfan · 07/10/2024 23:26

OP, it sounds like you need to have a difficult conversation with your parents about how sustainable their current living situations are, and where they see themselves living out their final years. I don’t think that’s ever easy.

Many of us on this board have been through the point where we realise that we are the responsible ones now, and our parents are dependent on us, whether that is consciously or unconsciously. And we have stepped into our respective situations and taken charge with the intent of trying to improve the lives of our elderly relatives.

It sounds like you are very close to that point where you will override the “not allowed” instructions and get involved because of your concerns about the safety and welfare of your dad. This is entirely understandable if you have a regular, loving and mutually respectful relationship with your parents.

You’ve had some good pointers on the practicalities, but I will also sound a note of caution. Do not underestimate the size of the task you are about to take on. As is regularly said here, it is a marathon, not a sprint. For me, I had to come to terms with my mums care being “good enough” and not perfect, because perfect would mean sacrificing my job/career and marriage to enable that to happen. Lot of guilt and anxiety to resolve there.

It’s hard to set boundaries if you are in crisis mode, so please do have a think about how much of your time/energy/money you can realistically give long term and maintain your sanity. Unfortunately it’s extremely common for us all as we age to deny we’re getting older and frailer and less capable, and to bury heads in the sand and wait for a crisis to force a resolution. There’s lots of support here though, even if you just want to vent in one of the longer running chat threads.

balzamico · 08/10/2024 05:16

Is your brother on board? Unfortunately they make take direction better from him what with him being male. Also if you work together to present a united front about what needs to happen for their safety.
I feel for you, it's a very difficult situation

StiffyByngsDogBartholomew · 08/10/2024 08:03

FiveShelties · 07/10/2024 22:19

Why are you 'not allowed' to fly over?

Probably because her Mum said she can't and will kick up an almighty stink if she does. Probably the poor Op really just can't deal with that. And who can blame her.

FiveShelties · 08/10/2024 08:53

StiffyByngsDogBartholomew · 08/10/2024 08:03

Probably because her Mum said she can't and will kick up an almighty stink if she does. Probably the poor Op really just can't deal with that. And who can blame her.

I wonder if OP visits when her Mum is there, or does she never see her Dad?

BruFord · 08/10/2024 21:11

StiffyByngsDogBartholomew · 08/10/2024 08:03

Probably because her Mum said she can't and will kick up an almighty stink if she does. Probably the poor Op really just can't deal with that. And who can blame her.

@StiffyByngsDogBartholomew Yes, that’s one of the difficult bridges that we sometimes have to cross with elderly parents-the OP needs to say that she’s coming regardless as things need sorting out.

I’ve had to do this with my Dad.

DaughterOfSqualor · 11/10/2024 10:20

Hi everyone. I'm afraid I committed the MN sin of not coming back to this thread the day after I started it, for which I'm really sorry - so many of you have been really helpful and supportive. There are lots of links and so on that I and my brother need to follow up - thank you so much.

My brother (who is resident in the US!!) is going over there on a planned trip this weekend and he's going to see what can be done, with the help of our cousins, I hope. To those querying why I'm 'not allowed' to hop on a plane - yes, it is indeed because it would 'upset' my parents. My mother made it very clear the other week that he was 'upset', then 'angry' at the possible prospect of me going over in a crisis (ie when he had a fall!!) to help. I am myself very angry and upset that they try this emotional blackmail on me. And no, my brother doesn't get this, or not to this extent. But then he's always been much better than I at negotiating things and has a greater willingness to tread on eggshells. I am really grateful that he's going to be taking the lead this weekend and will try to get something set up.

I don't think he'll succeed.

I can't imagine my dad thriving if he came back to the UK permanently, as the only things that keep him more or less going and interested in life away from his sofa are going out to lunch and occasionally meeting with his friend. There's the whole thing of the familiar setting, language (he is multilingual but obviously now much more comfortable with his cradle language), food etc. But perhaps, eventually, he will have to.

(The other reason I'm finding this so hard is that my younger son is severely autistic and very challenging - more so as he hits his mid teens. My husband can (and has) coped on his own with him for a few days but it's a two person job sometimes and very hard on just one person. (and yes, he's at school!) So yes, I could and will hop on a plane if I have to, but it's not a small ask. Sad )

OP posts:
BruFord · 11/10/2024 14:10

Well done on getting as far as you have, your brother visiting sounds like the best plan given your caring responsibilities. He should be able to get some support sorted out, it’s much easier when you’re actually there and can connect with the right services.

Re. Emotional blackmail. Your parents are clearly struggling to accept that they can no longer manage without support, it probably feels humiliating. I’ve learnt to let it wash over me when my Dad says nasty things and blames me. He’s venting his frustration at being elderly and needing help. Once he calms down, he realizes that having some support makes his life easier. So keep battling on OP. It’s great that you and your brother are working together. 💐

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