Churchill and other retirement type complexes- any experience

[Ed1n]

My fiercely independent mother has hit 80, was widowed a couple of years ago and suddenly seems much more frail. She will only ever do things her way and on her terms but she’s starting to find the house too much and the Scottish winters too cold. There are retirement complexes near me that might allow independent living but take away the strain of dealing with maintenance, which she finds very stressful.

However, they’re expensive and I only ever see them for sale , not rent. Of course service charges on top.

Has anyone any advice on Churchill and the like- are they comfortable , independent but supportive? Do they sell on ? Thanks for any thoughts. I don’t think she’ll move until a crisis of some sort but I’d like to plan ahead a bit .

£870 is about the same as a state pension!

You won’t be able to afford these sorts of places if you are just on a state pension. You will probably need to sell your current house and have a private pension too.

I think communal living for the elderly is a great idea! Why they are marketed at over 55s is a mystery to me as I am 61 and still working full-time (as is my dh) and financially supporting a ds at University.

No 55, 60, 70 or even 75 year old that I know would want to live in a retirement complex. My Grandma moved into one aged 88, dh's great aunt moved into one aged 95, my step-grandma in about her mid-80s.

I think they are places to go before you die or need a care home. And therefore should be state-subsidised.

But that's a whole other thread.

We rented Dad a flat in a complex for over 55's. It was great as he had his own front door, the building was secure and there was a manager on site. The downside was other noise, and lack of car parking at times but when Covid hit, thankfully Dad was able to spend time with other residents etc and we weren't panicking too much about him.

It did get difficult when he fell ill unfortunately - he had cancer and the lack of bathroom adaption was a nightmare. And we had to fit a keysafe outside his flat but the manager wouldn't let carers have a keysafe outside the main doors or let them have the access code saying Dad had to buzz them in - his buzzer was in the hall and Dad wasn't safe standing ffs. I had a few arguments with that nasty little man as I called him! And the lift didn't fit an ambulance stretcher either, which when Dad collapsed was an issue.

They're great when someone is well, less so when the unexpected happens.

They aren’t care homes and I think sometimes people misunderstand what they offer. Care homes are the final option and honestly if at all possible would avoid them if at all possible.

The only way to avoid a care home is if you die before you can safely take care of yourself. This is unavoidable for 1 in 5 of the population at the moment and will rise as we age. All three of the elderly relatives I mentioned above had to move to a care home after years in a retirement complex.

I’d be inclined to a suitable flat, buy tin care, cleaner, buy ready meals, far cheaper resale too

Bit unfair to say avoid care home at all costs - thry can be good IMHO especially if you go in before you are forced in and get known and know what’s what with activities etc. my dad thrived in his home for 9 months after mum died ( he had dementia ). He was better fed (she wasn't hungry so shared meals for 1. He forgot he’d only had half a dinner …) walked more , engaged with people and went on outings. I saw him loads as he was local too. He then deteriorated and died “ it’s his home we won’t be sending him anywhere “ with people who knew him looking after him.
father in law in a care home now. We looked at flats but he wouldn’t have got on and engaged with other people , he’d have shut the door and not bothered apart from eating biscuits all the time …. In retrospect he’s also deteriorated re mobility and memory quickly despite lots of visits / outings / scrabble contests etc.

anyway re the flats. Yes. Probably before you really “ need “ to as well. ( FIL also wouldn’t have had the capacity to learn the layout of the large complexes near us etc). Buy a resale flat - they cost buttons. Be prepared to view it as rented and expect nowt back.
the big kicker is the standing charge type costs that are charged in full after death till safe complete. Also factor in care costs / how care is accessed. The experience via work is that the complex staff are over stretched now the complexes have been going a while round here. You as a relative would likely acquire a care load - shopping / washing / cleaning etc or just administrating these as bought in services if needed.

care choices are really hard.

oh and g
get relative to do LPOA for both finance and health asap if they are near this level if need and haven’t done. It makes life a lot easier !

( close eyes if easily offended but I’m not sure how a retirement complex with a lift that won’t take a stretcher works , how do they get the deceased out - standing up ???)

My elderly parents sold the family home last year and moved into a gorgeous apartment in a Churchill home. They love it and are very happy and comfortable there. Also, I and my sibling now have peace of mind as we know they are safe and secure.

Poor financial investment but by and large offer the opportunity for independence for longer and given care home fees are £1200 weekly may not be as expensive as you think. Depending on where you buy, service charges vary from £4k to 10k a year. However this may include some cleaning, basic activities, water rates and call bell. Avoid new if possible. My mother's was bought in 2003 for £125k, she bought it in 2014 for £70k and its on the market now for £40k. No live in manager or restaurant but service charge only about £3k. Sold on open market but 1% of sale and purchase has to be paid into a slush fund on completion. She loved it and made friends after she was widowed. I would recommend it to anyone bit just go in with your eyes wide open.

My granny moved into one (can’t remember if it was a chain now) - best thing she ever did. She was very happy.

Nothing you can do about it, but her flat took a long time to sell, which is normal, snd you have to pay service charge till it does.

Sure, but that’s you thinking about what’s best for you - not your hypothetical elderly parent. Part of the point of sheltered housing is companionship - either scribe friendships if you want them, or just having people at the same lifestage around to chat.

In the poorest parts of the Uk men only have about 54 healthy years I think, so it’s applicable to some people, although it’s not average.

People do quite often want to move into sheltered accommodation in the second half of their 70s though, especially if you aren’t coupled up but like lots of company.

We looked into this for my dad but depending on your DM's needs, an adapted bungalow (or a bungalow you adapt) with support from carers might be a better option. My dad has that plus uses the Lifeline service and they're brilliant and on the two times he's called them out, they've been there in under 10 mins. There's no service charges and it's just worked out better for us. I guess it depends on each person's needs.

"think communal living for the elderly is a great idea! Why they are marketed at over 55s is a mystery to me as I am 61 and still working full-time (as is my dh) and financially supporting a ds at University.

No 55, 60, 70 or even 75 year old that I know would want to live in a retirement complex. My Grandma moved into one aged 88, dh's great aunt moved into one aged 95, my step-grandma in about her mid-80s.

I think they are places to go before you die or need a care home. And therefore should be state-subsidised.

But that's a whole other thread."

Some of the complex are beautiful , the one in Leamington, has a bar, a spa type area with a Swimming pool, a bistro. I would describe the apartments as Extremely tasteful and secure accommodation . You do however need to be well heeled to afford the service charges and I doubt you would get value for money if you were still working .

DM bought her lovely new Churchill sheltered housing flat in Wiltshire only to rapidly go downhill healthwise and be moved into a care home less than a year later.

The sale is finally going through now, after 3 years of no takers.

That whole Churchill episode has been the bane of DSis' life, as she helped DM buy the flat and has been responsible for finding a buyer and been paying maintenance charges all the while. On top of astronomical care home fees, all coming out of DM's rapidly dwindling budget.

theduchessofspork
well you have a distorted view, I already have Parkinson’s at 61, plenty of meet up stuff, as there is for elderly.
it’s already having an impact after 6 years, no way could I afford it

Why they are marketed at over 55s is a mystery to me

Same with exercise classes and holidays and coach trips.
People never like to admit to themselves they are getting old, whereas if they could have moved somewhere (or started doing something) in their mid 50s, and have not done so until they are 70, they feel that is okay - they've held out, and there will be "younger people" there - it is all psychological.

I know a couple of dozen people who have moved in to Retirement Villages and it has 100% been the right decision for all of them. One friend just moved in the last couple of months - he had to wait until there was a vacancy, so I don't think there is much of an issue with selling these. He showed me round, and it was lovely, the number of people who stopped and just passed the time of day. He said that quite a lot of people just go down to the communal area in the mornings and sit and have a coffee, or read the paper, or chat to other people. There is a 'bistro' you can get full meals at, or lighter sandwiches etc. There is a gym. There are classes like yoga, dance, art, computers, there is a choir, there is a Church group, there is a hairdressers and a small 'corner shop'. There is a bar and a snooker table. There is a hall where they have concerts or parties. There is a big greenhouse and space people can grow things if they want, as well as the maintained gardens. Other friends have been there 8, 9 years. You hear so much about loneliness, even more so amongst the elderly. I think - for those that can afford them - the retirement villages are ideal.
As others have said, you have to have a different mindset. Yes, it costs to live in them, but maybe it isn't a bad thing to use savings or equity in your house to make your life really enjoyable in your later years - it is your money after all.
You can rent in the ones near me as well.

Avoid, took me three years to sell a top end one at a cut down price.

Yes to all of this. But at 55? I see myself doing it at 80 if I'm still here.

I was told the average age of the people living there (with my friend) is apparently currently 82.
I can't imagine anyone moving there before about 75.
Everyone I know who moved has been in their 80s.

@Helenloveslee4eva
( close eyes if easily offended but I’m not sure how a retirement complex with a lift that won’t take a stretcher works , how do they get the deceased out - standing up ???)

Undertakers have a sort of upright chair/trolley type thing to wheel them out and carry down stairs in. That's what they have to do if someone dies at home upstairs. It's a lot easier than moving someone who is alive, after all, especially if they're frail and already in pain as it's so easy to cause more pain. One of those trolley things would easily fit in a smaller lift, as opposed to a lift in a hospital which is designed to take beds.

One of the issues in England for resale is that not only do you have to pay the service charge while waiting to sell, some councils increase council tax on empty properties so the costs mount up really quickly.
All the while not being allowed to rent it out in the interim because the builders have a bunch of new units to sell.

You should check out if there is an Abbeyfield home near you. They are a charity and some of their homes are rooms with kitchenettes where you make your own breakfast and supper and then there is a housekeeper who does lunch for everyone. Much more reasonable prices if you are considering renting and the one near us is a lovely house with a beautiful garden and conservatory.