What is the custom for paying helpers for care when they are off sick or you cancel

[falstaff1980]

I've got someone coming (a non-agency independent carer I found) to see my mother once a week for an hour, last week this wasn't needed so I cancelled. This week the carer was sick, in both occasions I still paid the £20.

There's no contract with this carer regarding cancellation or sick pay, but she's very good and mum likes her.

What do others do in these cases?

If she cancelled I wouldn't pay.

But I cancelled short notice I would.

Ideally there should be a contract in place that sets all this out

You need a contract!

But in both cases I'd expect to pay still, as with paying a childminder or nursery, they can't suddenly fill the gap with someone else if you cancel one session or visit.

Sickness I'd expect to be set out in a contract and the advantage of using an agency is, in theory, they send someone else if the first carer is ill.

I am a care provider (not elderly) and the agreed upon rule is that if I cancel, I don’t get paid, but if they cancel, I do get paid. I also have guaranteed minimum hours.

You need a proper contract.

It's decent to pay full sick pay if you can. Carers are typically on low wages. If they're an employee, then they will be entitled to SSP at least. Different if they're self employed. Have you actually agreed which category they fall into? (E.g. do you pay tax and NI for them?)

Presumably, you wouldn't want to commit to paying long term sick leave because you'd probably have to pay twice then to get someone else in to help your mum. An agency would be much easier in that respect because they would just sort it for you.

If you cancel at short notice, I think you should definitely pay - not fair for the carer to be out of pocket, whether they're an employee or self employed.

You need to have some sort of agreement in place so that everyone knows where they stand and what they can expect.

"Different if they're self employed. Have you actually agreed which category they fall into? (E.g. do you pay tax and NI for them?)"

They are self-employed, I did find them through an agency, but she straight away bypassed the agency and gave me her personal number and email. I pay her to her bank account, by standing order.

I think what I'll do is email her to clarify expectations on this. Maybe say:

• if I cancel a slot with less than a months notice, then I'll still pay.
• If she cancels for whatever reason, then I'll still pay, but I'll ask her to make up the time the following week (which I think she'll have no trouble doing, she's said she's got time available to extend the hours with my mum if needed).

Does this sound reasonable?

I think this is pretty standard. I know my Aunt used to pay her carer for 2 weeks when my Aunt was on holiday too as she said the carer would have still been available to care for her those weeks.

Ridiculously late I know but I think you should pay even if you cancel with a lot of notice. What can she do with one slot, or even two weeks' worth of slots? Nothing.

It's essentially zero hours and that's unethical I think.

We did it formally. Contract, NI, tax NEST pension, etc like people do with a nanny. An important element was employer insurance. What happens if the carer hurts herself when caring for your mother. (Lifting etc.) The specialist insurer can provide proforma contracts, though we did ours through a lawyer and my accountant did the payroll. The specialist insurance proved useful when my mother died quite suddenly. The probate lawyers had no idea and were keen to treat it as an employment dispute/redundancy with endless NDAs etc. The legal helpline attached to the specialist insurer instead provided us with a short letter, confirmation of what was owned on a statutory basis (incredibly little as one of the signatories had died so the contract no longer existed) and the scope for a voluntary tax free sum. The latter was much better than a gift in the Will as it could be paid straight away.

Doesn't it change things if you pay sickness and holiday? Would that move them from self employed to employed, which might have pension and tax implications? (I may have this wrong).