Dad lying about medical issues.

[Silverdogblue]

He’s got Parkinson’s and sciatica but is otherwise well - no dementia and he’s regularly assessed by the geriatrician who runs the Parkinson’s clinic.

He has carers throughout the day but every 3-4 months he gets chest pains and is CONVINCED he must go to hospital and alway calls an ambulance. Has a normal ECG and makes a fuss about not wanting to go to hospital but he actually does want to go. I can tell this from speaking to him. The diagnosis is anxiety and as a fellow sufferer, I know this is awful.

Whilst he’s in hospital he will phone various people (which he will never do from home) and tell them various things. This time he phoned the woman who helps with his dog and told her he was having urgent surgery, he phoned his carer and told her he’d had a heart attack, but when I spoke to the hospital, they said all
of his tests were normal and he’d declined a referral to social services (he’s already on their books so I’m not too concerned about that).

These lies cause no end of dramas as these people all make various plans and tell other people and then call me to tell me and I end up having to unpick it all.

When I asked him about it last time, he said it’s because he wants people to take him seriously but WE ALL DO!! But after this, his dog lady sent me an email telling me to be nicer to him as I was being nasty.

I regularly drive a 6 hour round trip to look after him, I’ve got LPA, I arrange his carers and OT and phone and bills so on and so forth. I spend my life taking him seriously. And he has a better social life than me!!

Any insight into why he does this? It’s exhausting and I can’t always drop everything to go to him (and my older brother has totally checked out of the family since our mother died).

[PermanentTemporary]

Would it be at all helpful to have a WhatsApp group of his support circle so you can update them yourself and head off alternative info?

[Silverdogblue]

That would be helpful, dog lady doesn’t have a mobile phone though. His carer and I are in touch all the time. Good idea though, she does do email so that might be useful. There are a few others involved so could get a contact list. Thank you.

[hotcandle]

It sounds to me as he's simply lying for attention.

No matter how busy and social you might think he is and how fulfilling that should be, it's obviously not enough to keep him from making up these lies and basking in the inevitable attention.

I would deal with these episodes head on from now on. You know he's lying, he knows he's lying. You tell him he can call the hospital as much as he wants for these escapades but you won't be around to watch it and when the enviable phone calls come through with people asking for more detail you let them know he's telling lies and is obviously having an episode.

I've seen this a lot OP and the reasoning is always baffling but when we call a spade a spade and call out blatant lies the dramatics stop.

[hotcandle]

With the best intentions can I also suggest you start living your life. Your elderly father shouldn't have a better social life than you.

Stop dropping everything to go to the hospital. God forbid when he does become unwell, the hospital will let you know.

Let him feel the effects of some of these lies, and I promise you they'll stop. Easier said than done when it's your father, and you love him, but otherwise, you'll be trapped.

I live by the 'let them' mantra. Let him do whatever he wants in these scenarios, and the fallout will eventually happen to teach him a lesson.

[Riva5784]

These lies cause no end of dramas as these people all make various plans and tell other people and then call me to tell me and I end up having to unpick it all.

You don't have to unpick it all, you know. You can leave things be. Then he will have to live with the consequences of his actions.

[Silverdogblue]

@hotcandle @Riva5784 you are very wise. I do love him and I don’t want him to be lonely but you’re right. Thank you.

[AnSolas]

Its mental health issue if he is stressing so much that he lands in hospital.

Even if you dont have permission contact his GP and the geriatrician and discuss the pattern which is starting to emerge. He may be beginning to loose capacity as this is a "new" cycle of behaviours by telling lies and making up the drama over his hospital admissions. Either way some meds to help with the stress and MH support may reduce the A&E visits.

If he is telling lies in hospital you can bet he is telling lies out of hospital so the dog lady may have been fed a story or two.

If he continues i would ask that the carers track his mood in the care file to see it there is a pattern of depression or fustration about his daily life etc which triggers the A&E trip.

I would go back to SS and if he is able see if he could attend a day service or other social outtings to see if this can improve the outcomes.

You need to take care of yourself too. If it helps look on the pattern as if he has reduced capacity and is trying to gain attention to improve his mood. He is self focused and will not have the capacity to self manage his emotional needs but you can step back a little and let the hospital do its thing and let them arrange getting him home etc.
And if you get calls tell the people that the hospital said he is ok and that the should phone him directly. That way he gets to explain why he is telling lies
🌻

[Silverdogblue]

@AnSolas thats great advice. Thank you.

I will try the GP again, last time I got a call
back and the dr asked why I thought he had Parkinson’s. I was so het up I had to make my apologies and end the call, he’s had it for 15 years and it must have been all over his bloody notes. I wanted to talk about anxiety and low mood but it felt so futile when the GP was asking me whether he had a tremor or not.

I will contact the surgery this week, the reception staff are amazing so hopefully I will be able to get a message to his usual GP (who’s very good but VERY busy).

[anyadvicefor]

Hi op, I don't mean to sound rude in any way but doesn't some peoples Parkinson's develop into dementia ? Could this maybe be a sign your dad's mental health is starting to be affected too? It sound as if he does believe he's not well if he's calling an ambulance

[Silverdogblue]

@anyadvicefor

Hi op, I don't mean to sound rude in any way but doesn't some peoples Parkinson's develop into dementia ? Could this maybe be a sign your dad's mental health is starting to be affected too? It sound as if he does believe he's not well if he's calling an ambulance

It’s definitely possible, the only thing that makes me think not is that it happens every quarter or so and his Parkinson’s doc tests him for dementia symptoms (amongst loads of other stuff). I think I’ll contact his GP and go from there. Thank you for your suggestion.

[anyadvicefor]

@Silverdogblue I hope you get some answers soon, must be so tough

[newnametoday11]

Has he got capacity to make decisions (even if they are unwise) we get people all the time going 'i have LPA' and they don't realise it doesn't start till the person no longer has capacity to make that decision (even if the person with lpa does the arranging of bills, carers etc)

[Finishingoff]

@anyadvicefor

Hi op, I don't mean to sound rude in any way but doesn't some peoples Parkinson's develop into dementia ? Could this maybe be a sign your dad's mental health is starting to be affected too? It sound as if he does believe he's not well if he's calling an ambulance

I wondered this too. I have a relative with Parkinson’s dementia and the first signs were delusions. I wonder if this could be an early symptom? I’m not a doctor but it’s worth asking the Parkinson’s consultant about this.

[newnametoday11]

While he has capacity I would just leave him to sort out his own stuff

[Silverdogblue]

@newnametoday11

Has he got capacity to make decisions (even if they are unwise) we get people all the time going 'i have LPA' and they don't realise it doesn't start till the person no longer has capacity to make that decision (even if the person with lpa does the arranging of bills, carers etc)

He defo has capacity. The only time I’ve used one of the LPA is when I applied for attendance allowance and he had delirium when the assessor visited. She didn’t think he understood so I made the decision about which bank account to get it paid into. Otherwise, he’s competent - the nurse I spoke to today was very clear about that

[AnSolas]

Capacity is not an all or nothing state.
He can be able to make a lot of decisions with reduced capacity.
So he would be able to pass the memory test and do maths etc but not be able to make the best decision.
And with reduced capaicty given the same information and choices 10 years ago he would see X as the better choice but now can not account for one data point which will change the outcome and would choose Y.

Eg he has grest ecgs etc in the last 4 hospital /A&E visits and no heart problems but has a medical issue. Is it stress or a heart attack?
He is afrraid and chooses A&E and once there he decided to call people and make up a lie.

His MH has reduced his ability to work out that this happens every 3-4 months, then he wants the feeling of being "loved"/"seen" and decided that a lie is a good choice.

Now he is forgetting that other people dont like being lied to and that this will end up with people not trusting him or wanting to help him.

Most people would say he is not as sharp as he use to but in reality he is nolonger able to balance all the data needed to decide it is better not to tell a lie.


Re the GP had your dad given the doc's permission to discuss his medical file and all conditions with you? If not I would ask that your dad do that and do up a letter confirming it for his file.

it may be helpful to have the GP do up a referral/admission letter as it will give a summary of his medical history in one place and you can refer to it if you are speaking to the GP's who dont normally deal with him and there is a letter on hand to go to hospital with him if it is needed.

Most GP's will want background on his physical symptoms as where he is in time physically can impact his MH.
Which is where the "no stupid question" comes in. Both you and the HCP can ask them and get an answer as there is a reason it was asked and the thought process can lead to a solution. (And sometimes the question badly worded to find out how you are doing and dealing with everything etc)

[CMOTDibbler]

My sympathy is with you. My dad had a similar thing going on and would call 999 at the drop of a hat and there would always be a big drama (though he never phoned anyone else).
Between the two of them (mum did have dementia so he had massive anxiety about the both of them) they had so many call outs that the 'keeping frequent fliers out of hospital' team (who were brilliant but alas a short lived initiative) got involved. They put in place a flow chart on the wall in the hall to follow, and got him things like an easy read thermometer so he could measure mums temp and feel in control of stuff as well as having the reassurance of an official guidance on what to do when. They did also do a load of things of bringing together their squillion health teams as there was a lot of things wrong.

If your dad had delirium before, do you think he might be getting UTIs every so often which leads to all this? If so, maybe his carer (poss in partnership with a PD nurse) could push more fluids routinely, do dip tests to check nothing is brewing? Its so common for people to restrict fluids when they have mobility issues to limit the number of times they go to the loo and then UTIs breed nicely.

[Silverdogblue]

@CMOTDibbler its like you know him!! His carer is excellent at the fluids thing and you’re right, he restricts because of mobility. Slightly better now he’s got a commode.

I think on this occasion it might have been made worse by his carer being at a family funeral and therefore not available (read at his beck and call) all day. It seems like a control/attention thing sometimes as he would do it to me before we got carers. I’d have something planned or a significant work thing on and all of a sudden he’d be all over the place and phoning me in the wee hours to get me to go to him. When I got there he was always “oh thanks for popping in, shall we go for lunch”. Three hours each bloody way!!!

Im going to email his GP tomorrow to ask about anxiety/depression.

Oh by the way! His doctor (not his retired HCP daughter or his professional carer) told him how important his hydration was and he actually listened… he gets delirium from constipation as well which is obviously affected by lack of fluids. Once his actual doctor told him, he made a bit more effort.