General nastiness / obsession with others

[JazzyBBG]

Keen to know if anyone else has experienced this.
My DM (73) has always had weight issues/concerns. Nothing extraordinary just a size 16 but has historically always compared herself to bigger people to make herself feel better.

However now wherever we go there is a running commentary of fat people and the state of them. Doesn't matter if it's a restaurant, on the beach, shopping, or she even just rang me from the car to comment upon the people in the motorway services station.

My response is along the lines of why are you so obsessed with other people that's not very kind etc and she then loses it at me.

Other examples include;

• running commentary on how people are sat in a restaurant
• running commentary on my own children's table manners
• running commentary on a group of women in front of us on the beach - clearly quite middle class and on maternity leave and having a great day out but "look no wedding rings, I'm paying for those single mothers to sit on the beach all day"

I'm at a loss as to what to say and find myself avoiding her which is hard as we are close. I feel guilty even asking for advice here. In other ways she is very kind and would do anything for anyone.

Is this normal? I had one Nan who was a bit like this but who had a very insular life so to a degree I could understand all she had to do was observe others. DM does not have an insular life, is always busy, sociable, plenty of money, why be so bothered about these things?

My other nan though (her mother) did have dementia though. And I wonder if this is a pre cursor to that? There are potentially other signs but I don't know if this is one? Has anyone else experienced this?

I know it's inappropriate behaviour, I know it's nasty so no need to comment on that, I'm just keen to know if this is common with age or dementia linked? Thanks

So it's a new behaviour? Not something she'd have done before? Is she less inhibited about anything else? Wondering if this is what she'd always thought but was able to stop herself commenting in the past.

Mine makes similar comments, not just about weight, but loads of other things, but she's always done it. It's like she's trying to bolster her own position in her head. She has however, more recently, forgotten who she's made what comment to, which is how I found out she'd been making awful comments about my lovely DH to several people!

Mine's about six years older than yours and I first noticed the change in who she made what comments to (like she was forgetting to cover her tracks!) when she was around 74 or 75?

It was quite subtle at first and it was only after a while I put some things she'd said together and realised.

Thank you for your replies.
It's not totally new behaviour I would say there have always been odd comments but it's now incessant.
Do either of your parents have dementia?

She's bored. Take the Daily Heil off her and get her a new hobby.

@Summerhillsquare she's not bored though. This is a 73 year old who plays sport countless times a week. Goes to the theatre at least once a month. Eats out 2/3 times a week. Has a v busy social life. Has a husband on hand who adores her. Daily Mail I do grant you though.

No, neither parent has/had dementia - but DDad died 20 years ago so long before it would normally be diagnosed. I wondered about DM last year as I thought there were some changes but no one else I spoke to thought so. There is no family history of it either. Is there anyone else you could compare notes with who knows her reasonably well?

Another thing I've noticed is that mine has always had an active social life whether as part of a couple or a widow, but the people she's spending time with are all people she feels sorry for, can do something to 'help' them. Like she thinks she's superior to them. Then she criticises them behind their back.

@EmotionalBlackmail oh ha yes some of the feeling sorry for as well!
I do ask my Dad what he thinks but he won't hear a bad word said...

If she has a dh I’ve no idea, my dm would apologise for ranting but then she said she used to have df to say it to (he’s dead 15 years), and I thought of the little things I rant about to dh every day and imagined how I’d have to store them and let them out if he wasn’t here (because I wouldn’t want my friends to think I was moany😅)

Do you know anyone she knows who maybe doesn't see her as often? Someone who sees her very regularly might not notice subtle changes until they're really quite pronounced. Whereas a friend or relative who only sees her a few times a year might be more aware.

but the people she's spending time with are all people she feels sorry for, can do something to 'help' them. Like she thinks she's superior to them. Then she criticises them behind their back Or because she’s insecure in her esteem for herself, feels better about herself when she’s helping, then continues by criticising them to reassure herself she’s not the least worthy person on earth.

Yes. I think we underestimate how great the loss is of someone to rant to or discuss all the trivialities of life or the tiny decisions. It took me years to realise that what Dad needed from me most was not shopping or cleaning or cooking, but someone to help with small problems, work out the best way to deal with each item of post, talk endlessly about which building society to transfer some savings into, listen to his opinions of British Gas.

Dh’s old aunt (no dementia) certainly lost her ‘filter’. It got very embarrassing being out anywhere with her since she’d say at the top of her voice, E.g., ‘So many blacks around here now!’ Not to mention while having lunch, ‘Why does that waitress wear such a short skirt with legs like that?’ 😩

Sounds like my late mum. Everybody got it, newsreaders on tv, people in restaurants. When she was diagnosed with dementia it was worse. Comments at the top of her voice. Spend my time apologising for her.

Plenty of single mothers work to support themselves and their children entirely! A friend of mine doesn't even receive family allowance as her income is so high! Homeowner. Business owner. Kids in private school....
Plenty of single mothers are only single mothers because they've been widowed.
Also, plenty of people are overweight because they're prescribed steroids for things like chronic arthritis or CANCER! What a horrible, horrible woman.....!
Have you said any of the above to her?

My mother was like this, absolutely not dementia, criticised everything and everyone, loudly (she was deaf), generally unpleasant comments too.
It got to the point that I stopped taking her out, many comments were racist/sexist etc.
I had ‘If you can’t say anything nice then don’t say anything’ all my life but it didn’t apply to her once she was elderly.
Correcting her got nowhere.

That may be unfair if OP's mother is actually ill, @SquirrelFeeder . But I know what you mean. I think @MereDintofPandiculation is bang on the money with her observation about low self esteem, and describes perfectly my pre-dementia MIL's insistence on 'helping' people (on her own terms, whether they'd asked for it or not) then tearing into them in private. She'd complain about some of them to me, not knowing I was aware she also complained about me. Her voice carried a great deal further than she thought! She was very self-conscious about her lack of education, and gave herself no credit for bringing up bright children with high moral standards and a great work ethic.

I have started refusing to talk to my mother as soon as it gets nasty. I actually break the conversation with “nope, sorry, I don’t do hate today. I’ll call you end of the week” then I hang up. It’s started to lessen now as she knows the phone goes down.

Is it a generation thing? My mum prides herself in being the same weight as she was in her 20s. She ALWAYS comments about people to me if their weight has gone up “you should see x now - she’s enormous !“.

She always asks how much I weigh when I see her and it irritates me so much I just tell her I don’t know.

JazzyBBG

No this is not a precursor to dementia nor a generational thing. Your mother was once young and nasty and now she is old and nasty. She has not fundamentally changed in all these years and any people she feared in authority have died off.

You need to understand three truths about people who have Narcissistic Personality Disorder:

1. They suffer from “One-Mindedness.”
2. They lack emotional empathy.
3. They feel entitled to criticize people that they view as “low status.” Hence all this swooping in she does to "help" others whilst criticising them behind their back.

You need to keep well away from her going forward because no good to you will come of having any interactions with her.

Narcissistic disorder affects between 1 and 5 percent of the population, and more males than females, except in the MN population where it affects almost exclusively older females and the frequency is nearer 50%.

I’m early 60s and I recognise this behaviour in friends similar age or a bit older - “helping” people in particular. It’s self aggrandising. But surely the decline into this behaviour isn’t inevitable? I still work management level/professional so I wonder when I retire is this what I’ll become?! Scary to hear so many people recognise it in their own parents (people not much older than me I bet 😱)

My mum always used to go on about my weight and I got a comment about how fat or thin I was whenever I saw her. I ended up pulling her up on it every time, pointing out that she always commented on people's weight and it was weird, and it did eventually stop. She now finds other ways to wind me up though.

Doubt you can do much about the root causes of the behaviour.

What happens though if you (lying through your teeth if need be!!) say,

"That's not like you Mum, you always used to be so kind and thoughtful, is anything the matter?!" in deeply concerned tones.

I mean ... any tactic to get her to leave it off (while you're around, at least!) is worth it if it works, eh.

I remember someone griping about his grandson, whose main problem was that, well, he was a teenage boy (and all that comes with it). I said mildly, "Do you actually love him, because that's not how it's coming over right now?" and he went a bit quiet, which was a relative win ...

She may be very active and social which is great but, she is still a retired person with no dependents, big responsibilities and a lot of spare time on her hands which leaves plenty of time for bothering herself too much with how other people behave and look. Also, reading nonsense such as DM, Facebook (if she does social media) fake news, etc. Just keep calling her out on it every time.

Sounds like my grandmother. She was large herself and would sit around in cafes/ at the airport / wherever in her loud voice like a foghorn saying stuff like look at that fat girl or look at them, do you think they’re married or is that his mistress ( said in a cafe about people 2 tables away) . She was always like that but maybe got more disinhibited with age.