Has anyone successfully obtained CHC funding for a relative ?

[gunnersgold]

Thanks in advance

Our CHC department were very keen to tell me not to waste money on a specialist company. In fact they were so keen that it made me suspicious.
My relative passed the checklist when they were in hospital, eight months later and still no assessment. Social workers continually lied and lied, then denied their own lies.
There's a massive chasm between what should happen and what actually does happen. The system is broken and I understand that SW are under huge amounts of stress but gaslighting relatives who are also under huge amounts of stress is unforgivable.

There's a massive chasm between what should happen and what actually does happen. The system is broken and I understand that SW are under huge amounts of stress but gaslighting relatives who are also under huge amounts of stress is unforgivable.

I totally agree there! No social worker told me about CHC funding. A poster on a specialist forum told me! When I did a subject access request on DD, I found social workers had filled in the NHS screening checklist for DD three times. The CCG denied ever receiving them! Nobody ever told me, they had filled it in for her!

DD’s latest social worker, once I found out about it, and I’d asked them to fill in the NHS screening checklist, told me DD wouldn’t get it! I was talking to DD’s next social worker about joint funding by Social Services and the CCG, and she told me they didn’t do that!

Luckily, DD passed the screening checklist and the DST, so she got full CHC funding!

Luckily, DD passed the screening checklist and the DST, so she got full CHC funding! For people unfamiliar with the process, the screening checklist is for access to a full assessment. Even if you “pass” the checklist, you still have a much less than 50/50 chance of getting CHC funding. The assessment is done on the basis of the decision tool

In my area about 10% of people who pass the initial checklist will qualify for CHC.

No body told us about it. We weren’t invited to attend the checklist or have any input. It was completed while my relative was in hospital and apparently they managed to agree to it, and were fully involved in it, and agreed to how their data was shared etc. They had absolutely no mental capacity, they didn’t even know their own name. I only found out because I made a Subject Access Request regarding their medical records. A care package wasn’t put in place and no DST assessment.
The people involved will try and justify it any which way but they know very well they’re lying and breaking the SW and Nursing codes of conduct.

I got CHC for my father who had dementia, poorly controlled diabetes and very challenging behaviour . This meant he ticked the “complexity” box , he was unpredictable, there was a link between his sugar levels and his aggression levels. So he scored highly in cognition, behaviour and medication . I did not use a solicitor . I work in the NHS so I was reasonably clued up ( although it’s remarkable how few doctors let alone nurses understand CHC). I downloaded the assessment tools and really took my time reading them. I had dads OT and social worker on my side. I also found the following organisation caretobedifferent.co.uk most helpful, it was founded by a mumsnetter who had 2 parents with dementia. She kindly answered a lot of my questions via email ( free of charge). I strongly believe there is enough information out there for the lay person to navigate the system. Can you disentangle yourself from the lawyer?

There is also the Fast Track for those with a prognosis of less than 3 months, however if you survive more than 3 months it will be reassessed and I've seen funding removed if people have really got better/stabilized

This is where we are. Elderly relative has survived the 3 months and has a review next month.

I'm going to download the tool but any tips on dealing with the review would be helpful.

Sorry for hijacking the thread.

What nursing needs does she have?
Just there is a specific criteria for CHC funding. I'm a nurse and work in care homes. and my grandad has had Alzheimer's for the past 14 years and has multiple health problems that would take too long to go into and he remains self funding for care (he has been self funding for 24 hour care for 9 years.

@PritiPatelsMaker if your relative is still thought to have a short prognosis, and there are features that are unpredictable, then review may be a formality.

However some hospitals will discharge anyone and anything with a Fast Track, with no thought as to whether the patient meets the criteria as it's an easy thing to do. It's those patients who end up in trouble as they never met any CHC criteria in the first place.

Just failed with my DM they said her bmi was 24, it's 17

Thank you for that Anna. Their needs are a little unpredictable. Little balance and regular falls added to a short prognosis and regular colostomy "accidents".

It complicated by the fact that they have no awareness of how ill they are and want to go home. Tonight's gem was that the Oncologist was "pessimistic".

Maeve are you going to appeal?

Yes but for a brain tumour and a diagnosis of max 6 months to live. Was actually 7 in the end. The end to end process was appalling and I threatened to sue. Incompetence upon incompetence and made an already horrendous time a million times worse, compounded by the Dr writing stroke and not brain tumour on the original paperwork. All this for someone who had worked and paid taxes and never claimed a thing from the state in 45 years. Despicable. I became a nasty version of myself to fight for what should have been an automatic entitlement.

I was a CHC nurse assessor, if a patient has a 'stable' condition they are unlikely to get full CHC, if they have an unstable or unpredictable condition they are far more likely to be fully funded.

Daft question but I've got so much going on that I can barely focus ! My mum is in hospital and has been advised that she is entitled to £561 per week towards her care gone home costs. Today the social worker advised that mum will be now entitled to funded nursing care..is that on top of the weekly £561 or instead of ? Any advice is much appreciated 🙏

It sounds to me, like DM qualifies for this:

www.nhs.uk/conditions/social-care-and-support-guide/money-work-and-benefits/nhs-funded-nursing-care/

It's not a daft question it's something that causes a lot of confusion.

so let's say the care home charges £800 a week as it's basic rate for 24hour residential level care.

the local authority has done their social care 'care act' assessment and agreed that your mum meets their criteria for 24 hour care. They then complete a financial assessment and says of that £800 they will contribute £561.

a nurse then completes a nursing assessment and says that your mum also qualifies for the funded nursing contribution of £209.19 a week as you mum also has nursing needs above the residential care 'social care needs' the local authority has agreed she has.

The care home then says 'yes that's fine we also provide nursing care at a cost of £1009.19 a week (£800 residential rate + £209.19 additional nursing rate). **

nursing care is NHS care and therefore free at the point of access. So the NHS gives the care home the £209.19 directly to cover the cost of the healthcare the care home is providing on behalf of/ by proxy for the NHS.

that then knocks the bill back down to £800 a week to be covered by the person themselves/ the local authority.

** many care homes don't offer both types of care so if the funded nursing contribution is applicable then a residential only care home would either have to say 'no sorry - find a nursing home' or 'we think we can still meet the nursing needs with support from district nurses'.

My father’s nursing home says “if you don’t get the funded nursing contribution you won’t be able to use our nurses, you will have to rely on district nurses”. But they assume everyone would get it, and the rate charged was was the rate exclusive of nursing care.

This is true my DM had dementia and was very poorly as she was "no trouble" she failed

@gunnersgold I wonder how you got on with your application? I am going through a similar process (also using Compass) for my father who has a rare condition which results in memory loss, challenging behaviour, paranoia etc.He was admitted to hospital for a month recently (sectioned due to being a danger to others) and upon discharge was not able to live independently so he had to come and stay with me and then my sister. He is on anti psychotic meds which is levelling the behaviour/paranoia problems but this has led to even poorer short term memory, unsteadiness (he used to be fit and active), he also constantly wants to eat and will eat anything it seems- I found him trying to eat raw bacon once. It is such a difficult system to navigate but hoping very much that he will qualify for CHC even though I know how hard it is to achieve- but hopefully that is where Compass will do their bit. But like you, prepared to take the risk as it is a drop in the ocean compared with a lifetime ahead of care costs.

@lubeloo

Well actually it didn't go well but that's only due to the fact Mum got better !!!

We were told by the hospital after her stroke and diagnosis that she will never live alone , to sell up and put her in a care home . We had full time care in her home for 9 months and eventually I gave up and withdrew it because she was so utterly vile to me and didn't want it . Social services wouldn't help because she has too much money and I was broken .
She actually lives alone now and although still obviously has dementia she is a million times better than she was and can manage .. 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

So in fact I spent that money on the basis things were doomed and she would never live alone again and yet here we are .. 🙄🙄

I literally hate social services because I kept asking them to do a care assesment on her as I wasn't sure if she was safe alone and they kept saying see what the care company say ( the one I'm paying £7k a month🙄) and as I said above in the end I gave up as everyone I saw mum it ended in a row and I couldn't take anymore.

Yes I 'wasted' £5k but we also spent £80 k on care .. she has a lot of money and I don't care .. I would do it again and no regrets . I don't care about inheritance , only that she had enough care / support for her lifetime .

I would be very careful who you deal with. I checked with the FCA and CHC are not regulated.

@calmgreenhare why would a sector of the NHS be regulated woth the financial conduct authority????

Very old post just realised.

Yes, my grandmother received fast tracked CHC and was moved from hospital to a nursing home. She died 10 days later. We were advised that the funding was for 8 weeks initially. Should she have lived longer than this, it would be extended to 12 weeks and after that she would be re-assessed.

Sorry, didn't see the date on this either!