DoL

[NettleTea]

my FIL has dementia. I have another thread (very short) wondering if they would let hiom home. So far he has been in for nearly a week. Today he has ripped the catheta out and they have slapped a DOL on him.

Things are moving fast and unexpectedly/unpredictabley

can anyone tell me what this means - will they move him into a home? I did think I read somewhere that a DOL means he wouldnt have to pay for care? Is that correct?

Its all a bit much to take in

Hi OP, sorry to read your FIL is not well. DOLs stands for Depravation of Liberties, has he got an infection or a dementia/ worsening of his dementia? Many people - usually elderly - in hospitals have a DOLs placed on them whilst the hospital staff are concerned they are trying to leave the hospital/ refusing care / refusing medications that will help them to get better. These are usually stopped as soon as the patient regains their capacity or returns to their baseline.

I haven't seen your other thread sorry but I'm assuming he is in hospital?

A Deprivation of Liberty Safeguard order is very very specifically an authorisation to keep someone in either hospital or a care home when they don't have capacity to agree to stay themselves.

Anyone in a hospital bed who lacks capacity to agree to be there should be subject to a DoL but in reality they only generally use them for people who are expressing some unhappiness at being there.

It absolutely doesn't mean that a transfer to residential care is imminent. It's specific to any confusion he is having in hospital.

It also doesn't mean that any care will be paid for. He will be subject to the same social care/ continuing healthcare/ financial assessments as everyone else, the DoLs is irrelevant to care funding.

yes, he is in hospital with a suspected UTI, he is only a month out of having been in previously. He has dementia and was pretty confused when he went in, and is usually worse while he is there as unfamiliar surroundings
He ripped the catheter out and has hurt himself in doing so, then refused treatment or to have it put back in.

Regarding funding I think I was confused with a thread I read here where somebody's mum was sectioned. Thats different. I think they did a DoL on that lady, and she should have still been under the section.

DoLS can be very short term - my father had one when he was in hospital for heart issues and an infection, and became very confused and agitated, and at times aggressive, possibly due to the infection but also reaction to some medication. He settled down within a few days and was discharged home.

The lady who was sectioned that you mentioned may well also be subject to a section 117 which means that her social care will be covered.

@kookiekook

The lady who was sectioned that you mentioned may well also be subject to a section 117 which means that her social care will be covered.

i think you are correct, I was just mistaken about which bits of legislature have which consequences. It was a very sad thread

First of all I’m sorry to hear that you’re going through this with your dad. It’s very upsetting.
As pp have explained a Dols can be very short term and it’s primarily to keep him safe while he doesn’t have the capacity to make safe decisions for himself.
As for his future placement, how was he at home? Is there someone with him 24/7 to keep him safe? Does he have carers?
He may be discharged to an assessment bed which to begin with he wouldn’t pay for. There they would assess the best place for him for the future, would he be safe at home with carers or family of would a care home better suit his Needs.
Ask to speak to the nurse in charge so they can explain the medical side for you and ask to speak to the discharge team who will better guide you on his safe discharge.
Good luck

Your poor fil, I imagine that pulling his catheter out was pretty painful. Does anyone have power of attorney for him, the carehome may have applied for a DOL to give him covert medication , any care or treatment t they give must only ever be in his best interests. They may not try and put the cather back in unless it's for a medical reason, it would be very stressful for everyone concerned. It will be hard for the staff to assess his needs at the moment if he is still confused and agitated, have the staff made any plans to involve family in a best interests meeting. They may not move him while he is unwell, the doctors will decide when he is medically stable enough to be assessed. What's the situation at home, would he be safer in a carehome.

My partner has POA and spoke at length to the medical team when he was admitted last Monday www.mumsnet.com/Talk/elderly_parents/4278131-Will-they-let-him-go-home

he had been walking midweek, the week before, then Friday seemed unable to walk and according to carers (4 visits a day) hadnt walked all weekend, Monday he got up early as usual and seems he had fallen when trying to stand up.

He has dementia, He lives alone but there are people around alot, and DP lives very close.

We hope to find out more tomorrow, but of course the issue with the catheter means he has set his recovery back, so who knows what will happen now. He is on an acute medicine and gastro ward at our local hospital

he is going to be confused because he is out of his normal place - he isnt aggressive, that would be out of character. His short term memory isnt great at all, and the UTI wont have helped, but he had made quite a good recovery after the one he had at Christmas - made the effort by himself to get up and about again and get moving. Im worried about how he would cope if he were not mobile, or he was alone and they had a side on the bed to stop him trying to stand and he felt trapped there. But similarly he is relatively content in his home and has always said he will never leave it. In his surroundings he can see out over the fields, watch the birds, which he always has loved, he has his cat and his two dogs who he chatters away to all day. And he has people come in to help in addition to the the carers