I would be so grateful for some tips and support

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My situation is not as serious as a lot of posters on here, but is upsetting me and I would be so grateful for your thoughts.

Mother is 72. Basic health is good, but she is crippled with OA in many joints. Mentally, she is OK though I feel she is slow, repetitive and a bit dogmatic at times. She's very hard of hearing even with aids. She lives independently by herself. My issue is that she has become so miserable and negative that I have come to dread the one day a week I spend with her and our 2 calls a week. She moans if we are 10 minutes later than expected, complains continually about everything from Covid, her health, her house, the weather, roadworks etc. I have tried to talk with her about her unhappiness. She won't change anything, won't see her GP, and it's breaking my heart to see her so unhappy.

It's complicated by the fact that I also feel pretty angry with how she speaks to me. She always worries about the heath of my sister (who has chronic bowel conditions and a generally unhappy and difficult life). This occasionally makes her say mean stuff about how I shouldn't tell her to stop worrying about DSis, that I don't appreciate how ill she is etc. My DH and DD witness this and think that Mum takes out some of her frustrations and unhappiness on me.

I should say that I love my mum, and consider that she has been a kind and loving mother and grandmother. I want to be there for her, but I am also struggling to know how to help her when every suggestion I make for improving her worries or living situation is met with a negative response. Anyone been here? How can I be a loving and caring daughter and also not let her depression and decline drag me down? TIA.

You could be describing my mum! I find her incredibly draining and have suggested that she might benefit from speaking to her GP about how miserable she feels-in the hope that she might get some treatment for what seems like depression to me. Of course, she totally dismisses this!

There are many posters on here whose advice and sage words have hepled me immensely and they are more insightful and eloquent than me. But, one thing I have come to learn from reading these threads is that you cannot make someone happy if they choose to be miserable, and you cant be responsible for her happiness.

Since I have taken a step back in feeling that I'm failing her, it has been easier. I think my mum now enjoys moaning and being 'outraged' about things that I would brush off without a thought. I think that the last year has developed a feeling of negativity in many and its difficult to move on. My mum wont go out even though she's been double vaccinated since March and part of her misery comes from watching the news and letting it drag her down.

I expect you will get some helpful responses, so I will watch with interest. You are certainly not alone in this I know!

Thank you Jane. I don't wish these feelings on others, but at the same time, it's good to know that you aren't alone iykwim.

You have my sympathies-my DM also has periods of moaning incessantly. It is so draining and I dread seeing her when she is like this. Only today on the phone she was bemoaning that she has not had a breath of fresh air for weeks-until I reminded her that I took her out for a pub lunch yesterday plus the numerous other trips out she has had!

I really don't know what the answer is apart from not engaging in trying to fix her. You have offered advice, she won't accept it. I would just try changing the subject and move on if she really will not consider any of your solutions. There is only so much you can do, I bet she is much more upbeat with other people but as you are likely the closest to her, you get the negativity.

Sorry not much help but I do know how you feel"

Welcome to the club. So many of us have been dealing with this- as pp says, we cannot make them happy and are not responsible for their happiness.
It's finding ways to deflect before the vortex of doom takes hold- and sucks us in. for me, taking flowers etc helps and dm is much better out.
And cake, chocolate or gin as rewards help.....

At 72, she still has opportunities to make brand new friends and relationships even in these Covid times. Looking back I wish my DM in her seventies had widened her network of people beyond me and my DSis.
I think you will find improvement if she has more people in her wider circle. That will be quite a challenge to engineer but I’d give it a go.

Thank you for your kind messages, and I recognize that they are spot on in terms of advice. I would like very much for Mum to widen her network, but she is very resistant to doing anything outside of her normal routine. Which is possibly due to her depression.

And the sadness of seeing my Mum, whom I love so much, become this crabby, miserable woman, well, it breaks my heart. Her life seems to contain so little happiness. If only I could dole out a package of joy to her every now and again. Or stop her from fretting about my DSis's health. God, this stuff tears you apart.

Maybe you've answered your own question partially ... dole out a package of joy every now and then...
I send my 300 miles away student a care package every month, sometimes with fairy cakes. Not quite joy, but I know they get eaten pretty fast

Same here. DM is mid 80s, but fit(ish) and well physically and mentally, but God is she a pessimist!
I've been her only contact during Covid - DSis lives too far away, so I've been DMs bubble and been doing her shopping etc. I dread going over to spend time with her because she doesn't have a good word to say about anyone or anything. It's draining.

Your situation sounds awful. Your Mum’s mood will obviously rub off on you and make you down.
It’s difficult to advise you without knowing the personalities involved. My thinking is, just as your Mum’s mood affects you then would it work the other way around. If you went in there all smiles and oozing sunshine would it raise her up? I have a friend who oozes sunshine and always come away feeling better when we meet.
I suggest it as I do it myself to an extent. No matter how tired or what problems I have, I maintain a jolly persona when dealing with Mum. Laugh off problems, always turn things around to the bright side. The old ‘fake it till you make it’ style.
If my Mum complained about me being late she’d get a ‘hey! You’re lucky I’m here at all!’ Said with a laugh. If she was getting morose I start calling her a ‘pessimistic Pat’.
My Mum is a worrier, as was her Mum and unfortunately so am I, so I can understand your Mum worrying about your DS. Telling her not to worry is not worth it, she will worry and nothing will stop her doing so. I would acknowledge the health issue when it comes up in conversation but add positive things like ‘she manages it well’ or ‘she’s doing alright at the moment’. Anything positive.
This all works for us, my DB also takes this approach and everything is good humoured. Any sign of the conversation getting negative and we jump in to lead it towards the positive side. As thesandwich posted, deflect, deflect, deflect.
I’m hesitant in posting as I know this would not work with some personalities and as far I know, you may already do this. I just hope it would help a bit.
Look after yourself, transferred depression is a real thing and can be so draining.

Thank you Graceofgod. Really good advice. The suggestion about what can say to my mum if she moans about lateness is really good, I will try that! I also appreciate your kindness as I feel a bit low about it all, so am finding it helpful to have this acknowledged.

Sorry you are feeling low. We’ve talked on here about PMT - pre mother tension, prior to visits.
I remember a poster- maybe pickle who talked about the “ oooh look at the cows” approach used with toddlers to distract.
The jollying along can help but it’s hard work- hence the fairly serious suggestion of treating yourself after.

I don't think you can change her. People can sometimes become more rigid as they get older. I've noticed I worry about things more the older I get. It's easier said than done but I think you need to develop your boundaries to protect yourself. When people moan they don't always want problem solving, you can suggest things but then leave it. You are being a loving daughter already.

How is the pain relief for her OA?
Because my late Mum's GP put her on a low dose of AD to help with that (all totally legit afaik, something something neurology) and either because it did help reduce the pain or also because of what the drug was, she was a bit mellower after that.
Would your Mum recognise the names of ADs if you said, say, that your older friend X had found nameofdrug really helped with her OA pain and recommended your Mum ask her GP about it?

It sounds as if your mother has depression. If so,I'm not sure she can be jollied along.

When people moan they don't always want problem solving, This is very true. Problem solving says "this is your own fault - if only you'd do X this would all go away". And if she is depressed, that will add to her feelings of worthlessness. "Oh dear, that sounds very difficult for you" or "Oh dear, you sound as if you are very worried" can work well, especially if you think of it as a formula as this can help you with the necessary emotional distance.

She's only 72 - she's only a tiny bit older than me. You don't have to take responsibility for her yet! Do you remember teenagers (or haven't you got there yet?) - your every fibre wants to smooth the path for your teenagers, stop them making mistakes, but you know you have to let them go it alone, and make mistakes, if they are to learn to be an independent adult. Well, she's still an independent adult, she needs to be able to make mistakes, even though every bit of you wants to smooth her life for her.

Good post@meredintofpandiculation. My mother is 96.Many years could lie ahead.

I do feel for anyone with OA and it sounds as if she's not getting much help from health services - like a pain clinic. I do think the task of repeatedly engaging with health services that constantly want to discharge you is exhausting. Even trying to hope for better when you have a chronic disease like that can seem actively damaging - it can seem better to stop trying.

None of that helps you. I think if you can get her out and about at all, do so, or consider making yourself a little project to maintain at her house - a window box or a bird feeder for eg.

More wise tips. This is actually pretty helpful for me in thinking this through. What Meredint says about wanting to smooth the path for her, yes, THAT IS EXACTLY IT. And yes, I do have a teenager about whom feel the same. I feel a bit angrier with my mum than with DD though. Probably because she's my mum, and I want her to be there to pick me up (which I know is selfish).

Her OA is under investigation. She's had one knee replaced, but it is in many joints. The GP advised against ibuprofen as apparently it can cause stomach bleeds. This is a shame, as it did help. Still, she is having a few x-rays soon, so maybe this will prompt more discussion around painkillers.

I've mentioned that part of my mum's depression is caused by worrying about my DSis. DSis has chronic bowel problems caused by IBS and slow transit constipation and indigestion. Numerous scans and investigations have failed to identify an underlying cause. She is a long term invalid I suppose, and has a sad life of pain and varying levels of illness. She does hold down a job, and have a partner, though it seems she is unhappy (we aren't close, and I don't discuss with her). However, I don't know how to deal with my mum's increasing anxiety and misery about DSis' life. Anything at all I say to try to alleviate Mum's concern meets with increasingly snappy responses that I don't know how much DSis has to cope with, or appreciate the difficulty of her life. (This is possibly true). My worry is my mum, and how I can help her to manage her worry about DSis. I feel that sometimes my mum is almost angry with me because of DSis' suffering. Or maybe that's my interpretation. It feels muddled, and I don't seem to be dating the right things.

Oh blimey did the doctor not come up with an alternative painkiller, or a referral to rheumatology to have a look at her pain levels??

From your posts you would potentially find a course of therapy pretty helpful to try and sort all this out in your head. But in the meantime, perhaps your Mum is feeling hopeless about her own situation but has some hope things could improve for your SIL - maybe just listening to her talk about your SIL will make her feel heard. It does sound though as if for some reason she feels unable to express her distress at her own life as that would be 'selfish' and so becomes bound up in your SIL's life.

Depression might be alleviated by daily folic acid pills, you can get them cheap from that Savers store. It's just a vitamin of sorts so shouldn't conflict with anything else but takes the edge off things.

People moan to feel on top of things, to feel in control. It's why some of us go on review sites like imdb to moan about movies as if it makes us better than the director.

You could get in there first and moan yourself about something! It's true if the response is 'Don't moan it's not a problem' it becomes a bit of an argument, like you're not validating them.