Care home 12 Week disregard - No clue what I'm doing!

[brightertimes123]

DM has been in a psychiatric unit for 4 months with delirium. Recovered to a good enough level she is now fit for discharge and has been for some time.
She has accepted that she can't go home and needs to go into care.

I have had zero help from the discharge team or ward manager - I feel like I am totally fumbling in the dark. All the responsibility has been put on me to find a suitable home without any guidance.
Just as I thought I'd finally found somewhere with an available room and had organised a needs assessment, at the 11th hour I have now been told I will need to apply for a "12 week disregard" from social services.
DM owns her own house which will be sold but no savings so would not be able to pay up front.

I am so angry that I've not been given any advice from or guidance on this. I've been waiting weeks to try and get DM moved (who is now incredibly frail and distressed at being in a psych unit). Just as I thought we were getting somewhere now this. I have now got to explain another delay to DM and risk losing the space at the care home.

Does anyone have any experience of this situation or the 12 week disregard? Does the application take long to be processed and agreed. I literally feel like no one gives a shit about DM and can't understand their attitude especially with demands on beds in psych units. You'd think they'd do everything in their power to get her moved

Hopeful bump!

My experience of getting my elderly mil moved out of hospital into care moved at a snails pace.
Has your DM got a social worker? If not, you need to contact the Elderly Social care team to get the ball rolling.

This info may help
www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs38_property_and_paying_for_residential_care_fcs.pdf

Thank you...this is the thing; DM had a social worker whilst still at home but once in hospital I was told they would be dealing with things.
Clearly not and I am so frustrated we have got this far only to have major issues not addressed.
No one has explained what I need to do or the financial assessments that need to be undertaken. Meanwhile my poor DM is stuck in a psychiatric unit terrified and declining.

I feel your pain, it took me weeks to get my DM moved from a psych ward to a CH for respite care. It all fell through at the last minute due to funding..we got there in the end but only with the help of social services. The MH unit must have a duty SW, find out who it is and ask for their help. Also as PP says, contact your local Older persons mental health team, they were very helpful to me.

Will the care home not let her move in while you apply? Otherwise I'm sure they would hold the bed for you if you definitely want her to move there x

Flygirl...it's me under yet another alias!!
This is turning into the most unremitting nightmare.
Ward Manager and some random connected person (who constantly tells me she's not a social worker!) are involved with this but between them are utterly useless.

When I phoned the shortlisted care home manager late yesterday to say I'd only just realised I needed to apply for the disregard, long silence at the other end. The guy obviously thought I already had that in place or DM had funds to bridge the gap. He only has 1 room and now I face losing that.
Utterly infuriating and poor DM meanwhile has totally given up.

I’m sorry you’re experiencing this
Is her home on the market already? It will help to get it sold ASAP.
One other thing to be aware of.... in our area and probably others... the 12 wpd is only available at the local authority rate so even if/when this is agreed there could still be a shortfall if the care home you’ve gone for is more expensive.
Normally either family make up the difference, or the care home agrees to accrue a debt repaid when the house is sold.

Agree that is strange and if it was an acute hospital they’d be under pressure to get her out quickly so it would normally be a quick process
Social care assessment to check they deem her in need of residential care, financial assessment along side that, then funding application for 12wpd.

I would consider -

• Seeing if you can kick off financial assessment process from the council website, that will at least get you on the financial assessment teams radar
• Phone the main social services number and ask who your mothers case is open to

Make a formal complaint/complain via a local councillor or MP. Should not be the case but this is a sure fire way to get things moving in my team....

The discharge co-ordinatior at the hospital SHOULD be helping with all this. But they may have left you to it if they think your mum is ‘self funding’ but if she needs the 12wpd then she is not fully self funding and needs to go through their channels.

Good luck!

Also make sure if she has been on section 3 whether she should have joint NHS funding under section 117
And if not that she has had an NHS continuing care assessment (ask the discharge co ordinator)
Best of luck!

Oh and if the home you’ve found would be too expensive for the council rate for 12wpd ask them where there is an appropriate bed at the right rate

@Diddlysquatty

I’m sorry you’re experiencing this Is her home on the market already? It will help to get it sold ASAP. One other thing to be aware of.... in our area and probably others... the 12 wpd is only available at the local authority rate so even if/when this is agreed there could still be a shortfall if the care home you’ve gone for is more expensive. Normally either family make up the difference, or the care home agrees to accrue a debt repaid when the house is sold.

Agree that is strange and if it was an acute hospital they’d be under pressure to get her out quickly so it would normally be a quick process
Social care assessment to check they deem her in need of residential care, financial assessment along side that, then funding application for 12wpd.

I would consider -

• Seeing if you can kick off financial assessment process from the council website, that will at least get you on the financial assessment teams radar
• Phone the main social services number and ask who your mothers case is open to

Make a formal complaint/complain via a local councillor or MP. Should not be the case but this is a sure fire way to get things moving in my team....

The discharge co-ordinatior at the hospital SHOULD be helping with all this. But they may have left you to it if they think your mum is ‘self funding’ but if she needs the 12wpd then she is not fully self funding and needs to go through their channels.

Good luck!

Also make sure if she has been on section 3 whether she should have joint NHS funding under section 117
And if not that she has had an NHS continuing care assessment (ask the discharge co ordinator)
Best of luck!

Oh and if the home you’ve found would be too expensive for the council rate for 12wpd ask them where there is an appropriate bed at the right rate

Thank you Diddly

Uurgh this goes from bad to worse.
What a farce. Yet another thing I hadn't considered was that the 12wdisregard might not be the full amount.
1st thing Monday I'm going to get straight onto SS elderly services.

Section 3 doesn't apply, she was in the unit under DoLs and not eligible for aftercare funding

This could be a long shot but your council may have an accounts team within the Elderly Care area of their Social Work department. I would try to speak to someone from there and ask them to show you how to work it out . The accounts assistant at my DM’s place was amazing and metaphorically held my hand until I understood. She had so much practical knowledge of unpicking everyone’s complications that she really clear at explaining

@DorsetCamping

Flygirl...it's me under yet another alias!! This is turning into the most unremitting nightmare. Ward Manager and some random connected person (who constantly tells me she's not a social worker!) are involved with this but between them are utterly useless.

When I phoned the shortlisted care home manager late yesterday to say I'd only just realised I needed to apply for the disregard, long silence at the other end. The guy obviously thought I already had that in place or DM had funds to bridge the gap. He only has 1 room and now I face losing that.
Utterly infuriating and poor DM meanwhile has totally given up.

Oh Dorset I thought the situation sounded similar to yours! So sorry you are still in this mess, I was only thinking of you recently and wondering if you had managed to move your poor DM. I can't believe she is still in hospital, what an absolute nightmare.

Could you try and ring the accounts dept at the care home first thing tomorrow and explain the terrible situation you are in? Once I got the ball moving with SS (by having a complete meltdown on the phone to the dept manager!) things happened very quickly. Funding was approved in less than a week (although not 12 week disregard) so hopefully the CH will hold the room for you.

Keep us posted and best of luck. You will get there..

Would have thought social services should help with this.

You can always request a deferred payment arrangement if unable to sell the house quickly.

Finally tracked down a SW who is responsible for DM

I have been told to apply for the 12 week disregard but yet another hurdle is that bank statements will be required as evidence of financial status. If they can't be provided the disregard won't be granted.
All of DM's banking is online and there is no way she will remember her log in details, nor will she be compus mentis enough to get them reset. All she does now is cry and complain about how much pain she is in; a conversation regarding anything official is completely unrealistic.

I am so exhausted by all the this; literally feels like no one gives a shit and are just trying to make my life as difficult as possible. Aside from trying to manage DM, DB is also having serious personal problems and I am the only person who is supporting him. I'm being pulled in so many directions am in danger of going under myself.

Am seriously wondering what would happen if I said to SS that I'm done and DM is now their problem!.

Do you have financial Power of Attorney for your mum?

@Purplewithred

Do you have financial Power of Attorney for your mum?

Nope, was in process of sorting when DM became suddenly unwell

So you have no access to your dms finances, and she doesn't have capacity to manage them? Or to grant you poa? So for you to take over you’re going to have to apply to be her deputy, and that can take several months.

In that case its back to the social worker in the immediate term. Push back on them and on the discharge team at hospital: during covid the NHS is (I think) still funding 6 weeks’ care to make sure people can be discharged quickly. Emphasise that you do not have POA for health or wellbeing for your mum, and that they must see that it is in her best interests to be discharged from the hospital to a suitable home asap. (Use the phrase ‘best interests’ early and often - its their responsibility to act in your mum’s best interests).

Is there a branch of Carehomeselection.co.uk near you? They have been working with our acute hospitals during covid and have been fantastic.

@Purplewithred

So you have no access to your dms finances, and she doesn't have capacity to manage them? Or to grant you poa? So for you to take over you’re going to have to apply to be her deputy, and that can take several months.

In that case its back to the social worker in the immediate term. Push back on them and on the discharge team at hospital: during covid the NHS is (I think) still funding 6 weeks’ care to make sure people can be discharged quickly. Emphasise that you do not have POA for health or wellbeing for your mum, and that they must see that it is in her best interests to be discharged from the hospital to a suitable home asap. (Use the phrase ‘best interests’ early and often - its their responsibility to act in your mum’s best interests).

Is there a branch of Carehomeselection.co.uk near you? They have been working with our acute hospitals during covid and have been fantastic.

Just about sums it up and doesn't matter what I do I'm met with a brick wall. I am exhausted and given what else is going on here is making me ill now given what else is happening and I just feel sick thinking about how poor DM is being left to rot.

I have yet another (probably futile) call with the Ward Manger this morning. Am likely to have a total meltdown which won't help matters

Have a meltdown - they are all failing in their duty of care to your mum.

Call Citizen’s Advice too - they might be able to help or to point you in the right direction.

Meltdown at the ready! Phonecall in 5 mins

AGEUK might be another source of advice.

What a nightmare. Does your mum have the capacity to agree to move into a carehome and pay for it? Like a pp says if not how can anyone move her and access her funds without applying to the CoP.

So sorry you are going through all this.

When I managed my late DM's finances, I found I could do pretty much everything with her account. Including asking for a password reset, which caused a new password to be sent to her home address.

I picked that up and took it from there.

Would that be any help to you ?

Is she sufficiently recovered now to grant you power of attorney?

You can download the forms from the gov. Uk website and complete them yourself - no need for a solicitor. You will need to have two others present when your mother signs to countersign - a witness and someone who has known your mum for over two years who considers she has sufficient capacity to sign.

@Bills2pay

Is she sufficiently recovered now to grant you power of attorney?

You can download the forms from the gov. Uk website and complete them yourself - no need for a solicitor. You will need to have two others present when your mother signs to countersign - a witness and someone who has known your mum for over two years who considers she has sufficient capacity to sign.

If only it was that simple Yes she has capacity but she's currently only allowed 1 visitor and the hospital would not act as witnesses/counter-signatories. I imagine the same will be the case for a nursing home and possibly not even allowing me as a visitor.

The only realistic way to get The POA signed is to get Mum to a solicitor and hers is insisting she needs to do it in person (won't do Zoom). No way we will be able to arrange as things stand

@FinallyHere

So sorry you are going through all this.

When I managed my late DM's finances, I found I could do pretty much everything with her account. Including asking for a password reset, which caused a new password to be sent to her home address.

I picked that up and took it from there.

Would that be any help to you ?

That's a thought; I shall give it a go! As I have her bank card Im also wondering if I can order paper statements from the machines inside the branch. Thank you

If you go to her bank you could ask about setting up a 3rd party agreement to manage her account

@YesMeLady

If you go to her bank you could ask about setting up a 3rd party agreement to manage her account

Didn't realise that was a possibility!