the patient should be front and centre, right?

[TheoneandObi]

I'm having a mare and feel I'm shouting into a vacuum and making my family hate me. My dad is 83. Vascular dementia, neurological problems which mean he's pretty much immobile and continence issues. Cared for at home by my 79 year old mum. She's struggling and tbh as well as always having been difficult is now suffering carers fatigue and so isn't very nice to dad especially when he wets and soils. I have wanted for some time for them to have carers but now I feel he needs a level of nursing care. In this climate we all agree a nursing home isn't appropriate, so given that mum and dad are rolling in cash and have a decent sized house, I've been looking at pretty much full time care at home. But they won't go for it, and my sister supports them in this decision. Dad goes along with anything mum says and woe betide anyone who disagrees. I have! Nicely. I feel his dignity and care is compromise, and have couched it in terms like 'We can't do this any more'.
As background, back in February he was admitted to a community hospital after a fall and my sister helped my mum negotiate him out - social services were contacted and the whole thing was awful. He came home unsupported and was confused and felt unsafe. IMy sister is definitely muttering to my mum that I'm being over zealous and pushy. ut I feel I'm lobbying for the patient. What can I do?

I'm apologise in advance for any drip feedg because it's all been a very long saga. And highly charges too.

Does your dad have capacity? Does anyone in the family have power of attorney for him? If he's telling you he feels unsafe without the care and you feel he's only saying no because of your mum, when is he saying this, just when you are on your own?

Tricky. He sundowns so from lunchtime onwards he is often confused and upset. He is controlled by mum. He has never actually told me he feels unsafe but has frequently told me she is horrible to him - and I've witnessed it. He cries and says he wants to die too. Even my sister has seen it. But she won't put any heft into changing the dynamic.
It's just awful that they're not spending the money when they have it. It all seems to be about mum not wanting anyone else in her home

Going from no care at home to full time care is a massive leap.

Can you not try getting a couple of calls a day in to start with, get him used to it.

A full time carer is a massive invasion of their life.

Capacity is important here but unless you have POA for his health you can't force this care on him. Does anyone have POA?

Does your sister have ££ in her eyes for inheritance? A full time carer would cost a LOT.

How is his skin if he is immobile and incontinent? Is your mum managing transfers or is he bed bound?

Drayco I think you're right. It's just that we've skipped the toe dipping stages. The tasing in should have happened months ago. i think.
Skin as far as I can see is ok at the moment. I've also been lobbying hard for a hospital style 'wobbly' bed to prevent bed sores. But mum doesn't t want the house to look like a hospital sigh.
Basically there is nothing in place. No commode, no lifting equipment. Mum is literally forcing dad to drag himself around with a frame. Sometimes he can't and often he doesn't make it to the toilet. And then he gets in trouble.
Re the ££s. Of course I wonder. She certainly doesn't want to 'upset' mum, whereas I feel Dad is at the centre of this, not mum.

You may be right and it should've happened months ago but it's not too late to start small, let your mum appreciate how much it helps etc.

Most councils are still offering respite care. It's worth thinking about.

@TheoneandObi

I've only just found your thread, if you search me you'll see I'm going through a similar nightmare with my mum and dad. We can't seem to persuade them that it is in their best interests for mum to go into nursing care
I have a feeling that in my parents case we will reach a point where my dad has some sort of health breakdown/hospitalisation himself (he's the carer) or my mum is hospitalised because of an accident (90 year old dad is being supplied with a hoist to move my mum), and that will force the issue.

I have POA but mum still has some capacity and dosen't want to go in a home, and dad is going along with that for now even though it's killing him. I don't want to go against either of their wishes obviously but IMO the current setup is not in their best interests.

Sorry I don't have any advice to offer.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this, it is really shit.

I'm inclined to agree with the pp who suggested it's never too late to start small.

We were told my dad is at 'end of life' at the beginning of lockdown and it took weeks for mum to accept any kind of help.

We're now up to a daily carer every morning, befriender once a week instead of once a fortnight and have finally got EOL meds and a DNAR in place.

We need more help but the problem is when and how as dads needs tend to be ad hoc. Like your mum mine has very little patience...the tiniest problem and she's on the phone screaming that she can't cope, but when you make suggestions she's not interested.

Can you get a sympathetic medical bod, i.e. district nurse to add some weight to your suggestions, or is there a family friend with experience of dealing with a similar situation. I found those factors were quite helpful in convincing mum to accept the help we've got in place so far.