Getting affairs in order while parents are capable

[upandawaytoday]

My elderly parents do need to seek their own financial advice but wondered if I could ask for thoughts on their situation.

My parents are in reasonable health now but am conscious their situation is likely to change within the next few years.

My parents are married and live in their own home, but all assets are in my dad’s name. The exception is my mum’s personal savings (not substantial). My parents live off state pension and savings (not a huge sum, I estimate in the region of £30-40k).

My dad has a will but my mum does not.

I think it would be prudent to consider applying for power of attorneys - especially as English is not their first language so dealing with health and financial matters will become even more challenging.

My mum has a family history of stroke and dementia, so we are worried about this happening to her too.

Does anyone have advice on what I should try to tackle with them first while they are still in reasonable health? They are practical people but I’m worried their circumstances will be more challenging to deal with if we don’t take steps now.

It is a really good thing to tackle this before a crisis!

My father did leave a will so I’m not clear what happens if someone dies intestate. I know one person who had this, he had to apply for letters of administration I think it’s called, and he found it fine. But no one else came forward with a claim on the estate.

There’s no reason not to tackle both really, but I found making my will really simple. I did it one November which was Will Aid month so gave a charity donation. With LPA, the forms are available online.

Links

www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney

www.willaid.org.uk/will-makers/find-a-solicitor

Thank you for your reply, really appreciate it. So I’m assuming that it would be a good idea for my mum to set up a will? I’ve always thought so, though I’ve not pressed my parents too much on the matter as they seemed to prefer having it all in my dad’s name - not sure why to be honest. Ironically it’s my mum who actually deals with a lot of their financial matters.

Thank you for the links, I will take a look at the information now.

Get POA in place for both health and finances for both of them. emphasise to them that these only come into play if they are unable to make decisions for themselves, some people are very wary of them thinking they mean the kids are taking over.

If they are up for it consider the issues covered in Advance Decisions.

It may be worth them splitting the savings between them - check out the advice about funding your care on Age UK website or similar.

Do they still drive? If so plan ahead for what will happen when one or both of them have to stop driving.

Thank you for your reply also, much appreciated. The steps you advise sound sensible. I will look into it.

I have wondered about splitting savings - will discuss with them.

Yes, one parent still drives ambit recognises that it’s becoming challenging. I’m trying to persuade them to sell the car soon. They only go to the supermarket and back but make the occasional motorway journey, which I’m uncomfortable with since they are not comfortable with it.

When my mums dementia meant she stopped dealing with all their finances, things that would have helped would have been a list of all their different ISAs/savings accounts/private pensions and the utility providers/insurance as she'd been doing those online until she couldn't log in - this was a right palaver to sort out.

Wills will make life a lot easier to sort things out after and don't need to be expensive to set up - Mumblechum on here is highly recommended by many mnetters.

POA makes life so much easier. I can't express how much.

A bit morbid, but I have talked to my dad about funeral wishes. If there was less savings, I would have tried to get them to do a prepaid funeral as well so that it is all sorted for later.

Thank you, that is a good idea to have a list of their accounts etc.

I’ll gently push on the POA. I gave siblings so will try and get all on board to take collective steps with this.

Re. funeral wishes - this will be the hardest but to crack. My dad in particular is superstitious and avoids talking about death! But it is inevitable of course so will see how I can broach this in a way he’ll be receptive to.

Op if he doesn’t want to talk about funerals, I’d say leave it. My dad died far earlier than anybody thought and we didn’t have a clue what he’d want. My feeling is he never wanted to think about it.

Mum is 80 and still hasn’t said anything. If there isn’t an instruction then it probably doesn’t bother them..

I have left a playlist 😂. My poor friends.

I think it’s really good to support them to have their affairs in order. It saves much hassle and potential conflicts later on.
I’d start by helping them understanding the role and responsibilities of a Lasting Power of Attorney for both Health and Welfare. They will need to decide whether they want to name each other or are happy for it to be you, even if the other partner retains capacity. Then they need to register their decision with the Office of the Public Guardian. If it’s not registered, it doesn’t count at all.
Without LPA you cannot give or withhold consent for medical intervention or manage their finances. The attorneys powers only become effective when capacity has been lost and can be rescinded at any point whilst a person does have capacity.

You might want them to consider what level of care they would want if there was a life changing event. Then perhaps they’d want to consider an Advanced Care Directive. This isn’t simply telling someone you don’t want to be admitted to intensive care and must be properly drawn up.

The Mental Capacity Act 2005 enshrined in statute law the right of an adult with capacity to make an advance directive to refuse specific treatment at a point in the future when they lack capacity. Certain criteria must be met to determine if an advance directive is legally binding. It is these that the team must consider without delay.
Firstly, as this advance directive is refusing life sustaining treatment, it must be in writing, signed, and witnessed and include a clear written statement that it applies to the specific treatment, even if life is at risk.
Secondly, the advance directive must be valid at the time it is put into effect. If there is evidence to suggest the person has changed his or her mind— for example, if they had done something that goes against the advance directive—this would make the advance directive invalid.
Thirdly, the advance directive must be applicable to the current circumstances. If it does not specify the treatment that is now proposed, or if the circumstances envisaged at the time of writing have now changed, then the advance directive may be invalid.
Factors to consider include the length of time that has passed since the advance directive was made and changes in personal life that may affect the circumstances the person is now in.

They’ll also ideally talk to a someone about their wills to minimise any bureaucracy should one or other die. Now might be a good time for joint ownership and shared accounts. Not my area of expertise so suggest talking to their bank or solicitor.

My dad didn't want to talk about funerals either (and neither did I tbh), but I said to him that of course I would arrange something whatever, but I'd feel better knowing that if there was anything in particular he wanted for himself or mum I could make it happen. And as it turned out, what he wanted wasn't what I would have organised. I did say he could just write something down and leave it in an agreed place if he didn't want to say it.

My parents have a file in an easily findable place with the essential phone numbers, lists of their medications, listed health conditions (this goes on a bit) and copies of their advance directives. This is super useful when an ambulance has to be called as everything is in one place

Thank you so much for this advice, really grateful. I wasn’t aware if the Advance Care Directive which sounds eminently practical and is something I will definitely look into and broach with my parents. There’s been some scares in the extended family with relatives of the same generation so this is bringing these issues to the fore and so these kinds of issues will be on their mind.

Thank you once again for the kind advice and guidance, really appreciate it.

Do they have a joint account? It could be difficult to access money for the one remaining if not.

Yes they have joint and individual accounts. I’m not sure where the majority of the savings are - I think in the joint account but I’m not so sure.

Both of my parents died intestate and probate was no more difficult than with a will (DIY in both cases) BUT this wouldn't be the case of there are step families and second and subsequent marriages. I was so glad we had POA in place though - I found it more essential than the will

emphasise to them that these only come into play if they are unable to make decisions for themselves The attorneys powers only become effective when capacity has been lost That's true for Health and Welfare, but Financial can be set up that way, or it can be set up so it can be used wile the person still has capacity - that can be very useful, as it means someone else can deal with savings, or with boring bill paying, while your parent manages their own day to day spending, charity giving and so on.

It may be worth them splitting the savings between them If it's all in your father's name, then all except the last small amount will go to your father's care if he needs it first. If it's half and half, then only his half can be used. On the other hand, if you're sure your mother will need care first, there might in theory be advantage in leaving it all in his name, so the family retain control of how the money is spent. In practice, unexpected events are the essence of old age.

My parents have a file in an easily findable place with the essential phone numbers, lists of their medications, listed health conditions (this goes on a bit) and copies of their advance directives. This is super useful when an ambulance has to be called as everything is in one place I second this. I produced laminated credit-card sized cards with name and contact phone nos on one side, and medications and allergies on the other, then gave them out to all the family and to my DF. It was evident that it was very appreciated by the ambulance service.

Something of less critical importance is to get an idea of the important things in the house - things that mean a lot to them and that they wouldn't like to see go to the charity shop or just to be disposed of.

Thank you very much, there’s some very practical advice here and will try see how we as a family can take this on board.