Called mil selfish, not proud of myself

[Knitjob]

Mil and fil both late 80s, both mentally all there, fil fine but slow and frail, mil really poor mobility, struggles to get out a chair, can't reach down to get socks and shoes on, can't really twist round to fasten her bra or get a jumper on, falls a lot and needs nurses with inflatable cushions to get her up.
She's in hospital after falling twice in one day. Hospital are reluctant to let her home without a care package. She has always been determined not to need care and elderly fil is basically her carer which is exhausting for him and just not sustainable.

She's come up with this great plan where dh, sil and I will take turns to stay overnight with them, get her up and dressed then go to work, get her ready for bed in the evening. They live in a different town 45 minutes from us with good traffic and maybe 30 minutes from sil. She has even devised a timetable of who will stay when. This is to go on until she's better. Unfortunately she's never going to get better. Her bones and joints are damaged beyond repair.

Dh and sil are seriously considering this plan. I think it's total madness, unsustainable and really unfair. We all have young families. They won't consider moving closer to us.
I said I was not willing to do it. Too much, 3 young kids, work, school, it's just not going to work. She said I was condemning her to a life in hospital apart from her husband. I said she was selfish for not considering carers and she was basically expecting me to live separately from my husband 4 or 5 nights a week. I am not proud of myself for it, I have apologised. But it is selfish.

Hospital have asked dh and his sister to think about whether they are really actually prepared to share living with their parents. They have referred to social services for care assessment but pil won't engage. I am sat quietly in the corner feeling like the bad guy.

But this is not a sensible plan, is it? If it was for a few weeks to recover that would be different but this is an open-ended thing. She's not going to get better and once this madcap plan is in place it will be really hard to stop. And apart from her mobility she is in good health. Her own parents and her brother lived well into their 90s so this could go on for a long long time.

Rant rant rant. Sorry. Thanks for reading

It is a lot to ask of you if you have 3 small children. However, if your dh and sil want to take on the responsibility I would let them get on with it. They'll soon realise if it is sustainable or not.
Very unfair of them to make you feel bad though. It sounds like it was an expectation rather than a request.

She is selfish.

Is she expecting you or your DH to be an unpaid worker for her? Either way you’ll never see each other.

Hope your DH remembers he has responsibilities to his own family, you and your children, before his extended relatives.

I agree with you - this is a very big ask when you have a young family, FT work and live a distance away.

However they are not your parents, so you're not as emotionally involved as your DH and SIL, so you can see things from a different perspective. All you can do is refuse to take part in the rota yourself and if your DH wants to - ask him how he will manage work, you young family and his parents? You may really have to spell it out to him.

Had a similar situation with my DP's parents - one of them needed a lot of care, but the other one refused support from carers. We had to leave it to reach a crisis, which was so sad as we could all see the crash coming but were powerless to do anything about it. It has resulted in such a sad loss of quality of life for both of them. Sometimes stepping away is the hardest thing to do, but it can be the right thing to do.

Her plan is totally mad - you will all be burnt out very quickly. OTOH, if they accept carers twice or three times daily, and maybe make some simple adaptations to the house they can stay in their own home and you will all have the bandwidth to support them additionally to that.

My parents are frail, though mum has dementia as well, and carers (plus cleaner, gardener, handyman, volunteer car service) have meant they are still at home together. I shop online for them, and dad can manage food shopping on his mobility scooter. Things are a bit touch and go at times, and he fought like anything against having carers but it is working.

Don't agree to anything you can't see yourself doing for 10 years. And as your children are small, remember that they will miss out on a lot through this 'plan'

Don’t think you’re being unreasonable at all - it’s all good and well agreeing to something like that but the reality of it will soon hit everyone.

My mum is a carer for her partner who refused to have professional carers - long story short, they argue constantly, my mum is on antidepressants, she has no free time, is at risk of hurting her back all the time from the lifting and the authorities have practically forgotten about him. She finally called it quits, for carers in and is much happier for it, and he’ll just have to accept it. And that’s without a job, kids and the travel!

You did the right thing. Anyone else doing it will soon realise it’s not easy.

It is selfish and will quickly become unworkable and exhausting.

What happens when one of you want to go on holiday?

I'm all for helping out but this is a complete lifestyle change and not a necessary one. If they want familybhelp then they at least need to move nearer although even then I think it's a bad idea.

It's one thing if she was willing to come to you so that helping her would be manageable but this is madness. She is asking her children to give up large elements of their lives so that she doesn't gave to make any changes to her life. It us very selfish. I come from a culture where it us the norm for children to care for their parents as they get older. If parents want to take advantage of this they move in with their children/ni more than 10 minutes away from children.

You are not selfish. You are absolutely right and you don't owe anyone an apology. As part of my job I advise people who are caring for a relative while working and have seen this sort of emotional guilt tripping hundreds of times before. (MIL is guilt tripping not you.)

Now, before she comes out of hospital is the time to set clear boundaries of exactly what you and your dh can and can't offer. Don't over promise but decide what you can manage that will allow you to continue your own life as you need to. If that's one overnight with MIL a fortnight or contributing to the cost of a cleaner then offer it and don't be swayed by tears or accusations of being the ungrateful lazy siblings. (Accusations will come from dh's siblings too.)

If you are heard to agree to any part of MIL's unrealistic plan then she will be discharged into your care and there will be no way you can change your mind when a few weeks in you are mentally and physically exhausted. She is being selfish not agreeing to consider carers and you have a hell of a lot more to lose by agreeing to this than she does by allowing a carer to help her into bed.

Take my professional advise and for the sake of everyone involved (your dh, dh's siblings, MIL, your dcs and yourself) be the objective 'cold hearted' logical one here and stay firm even if it paints you as the family villain. Believe me the siblings will be relieved and grateful in the long run.

Wow. She is selfish.

Your DH should realise that you and his young family are his priority now. When will he see you if this bizarre plan goes ahead?

I'm confused as to why anyone would reject the help of carers which meant you wouldn't be burden on your family?

Also. I didn't see your SIL's DP in the help line up.

It's madness. I've looked after elderly parents and unless you have done it there is no way of knowing how draining it is.
Some elderly people can have big selfish streaks. I think they don't have enough to do, spending time on,y thinking about themselves and have forgotten the hectic lives of a young modern family.

They need either a live in carer or a carer coming in a few times a day. Or, last resort, a joint room in a home. What's their financial situation?
I think someone has to persuade FIL that's it's time to accept help for everyone's sake.

She is being selfish - please dont feel bad about it.... you are being very sensible

and you will be impacted if your DH goes ahead with it as whose going to pick up the slack in your hime?

as she is in hospital still, ask for an ot assessment of their home and a care assessment for her discharge... it was 'slightly' easier for MIL to accept care as it got her out of the hosiptal and it was temporary.....

I agree with you and cannot fathom why they're not happy with home carers!

Irritates me, my dad was sick with pancreatic cancer and his bloody butch of a neighbour kept hounding me, saying I was a dreadful daughter for not moving down to help my dad in his illness (a year before he died). Dad lived 3 hours drive, I had a baby who was 6 months when he was diagnosed and we were trying for number two (took two years first time). I also had a career job and was married with our own home and husband had a job
Right up TIL he died she was a total shit to me, expecting me to drop my life, baby (house was too filthy and unfit for a baby as dad was a chronic chain smoker and didn't go to the garden to smoke - I didn't dare keep her there longer than an hour or two) it was 1 bedroom too ffs - he did have carers too as he was happy with this - she literally made me feel so bad I was struggling with stress (with everything else youndwal with having a dad who is dying, new baby, new parent, trying to hold down a career house and marriage - she was literally a cunt of the worst order ... oh and because my brother is a consultant doctor then he couldn't possibly help out (no wife or kids!) it was down to me and I was failing - literally had screaming matches on the phone with her when she called me to just lay into me. I wouldn't mind but she was happy taking his money to do his washing

Rant over but whT I'm saying is you have your own lives and they need to face up to the fact they need help and if that's carers going into their own home or moving closer to family who could pop over for maybe half hour to help out, but not such a large regime that is gong to affect your family lives - you're right they're wrong

We had a taste of this when my mum and dad were old and ill and were saying they didn't want a cleaner. One of my sisters who lived away said, "Oh so you just want Jane (sister who lived nearby) to do everything for you? Don't you think that's selfish?" They were very quiet then said they'd try a cleaner "until they got better" - now my dad has died and my mum is better, she's clinging on to that cleaner!

OP, have you made sure they have all the benefits they're entitled to?

@flumpybear, what the hell did any of it have to do with your dad's neighbour?

It’s such an emotional decision - can i suggest that you ask your DH and SIL why they don’t get their hairdresser to fix their car? Nursing and caring is a trained profession. Are they going to do a care certificate / moving and handling course etc first? Or does their Mum not deserve someone trained to do the job she needs. Obviously your MiL is thinking she doesn’t want strangers etc and I get that but really if she has an accident in the night because she can’t get to the loo does she want her son to clean her up? It’s all awfully guilt ridden. Luckily my Dad and Mum were / are sensible. Of course you can’t work and be a night career. Don’t even entertain it. Suggest that for experience your DH and SIL stay at the hospital a night. Reassure your MiL that you will visit lots and do the ‘fun’ things of taking her out or doing things with her. If she isn’t experienced in employing people offer to liaise with the care providers but insist it’s in place

Thank you for your replies. You know when your thinking is so out of line with everyone else, you start to doubt if maybe it is actually you who is wrong? I'm glad it's not me.

To answer some questions, they have plenty of money. Both us and sil are also ok for money but they have this idea of wanting to keep their wealth for us.

Sil doesn't have a partner. So the rota mil has kindly drawn up for us involves sil doing the 4 nights in the fortnight when her kids are with their dad, and dh and me splitting the remaining 10 nights a fortnight between us. And since I refuse to do any that means dh will be there 10/14 nights. So he might as well just pack up and move back in.

They don't want to engage with ot, physio or anyone else. It is their home, and their children's home (even though their children are well grown up with homes of their own) and they don't want anyone else in it.

Utter madness. I can't even talk about it with them any more. It's my turn to go in and visit tonight but I don't think I will go. Which is mean, but I can't help it.

This is completely unsustainable, and it's better that you call it out now while she is still in hospital - SS are more likely to prioritize setting up a care plan while she's still taking up a bed, it will be much harder to get her back onto their radar once she's home and you're shouldering the burden of care.

Does your dh realise your dc will have a very limited relationship with their df if his plan were to go ahead?

I see this all the time in my job - elderly not wanting to pay for carers or have strangers in their home helping with personal care and they seem unable to fathom that what they are demanding of their family is an unrealistic long term commitment. Overnight stays are not going to work long term especially if it involves getting up frequently at night to assist with toileting. Sometimes what i suggest if money is not am issue is a period of convalescence at a nice rest home maybe with a bit of private physio to help them get back to maximum function. This also helps with people getting used to being cared for by professional carers.

She's utterly selfish. I used to see this all the time as a district nurse. Elderly people refusing care (only paid care though, we were ok as we were free!) and falling about all over the place , in and out of hospital with completely unrealistic expectations of their ability to manage. Keep well out. They have plenty of money, I assume "they've worked all their lives" blah blah blah, well this is what for.. nows the time for them to spend it. If your DH agrees to this madness I would have serious doubts about your marriage.

Just keep saying no ...

if SIL is happy to do the 4 nights a fortnight then thats up to her ... although maybe whne she has no break at all she may change her mind

does your dh really want to wipe his mums bum? and wash her genitals... maybe you need to be a bit more explicit... my bil was all yes yes as didnt want to upset his mum but when it was spelt out exactly what it was he was going to have to do ...he soon realised that wasnt the role for him ..... you need your DH to realise what he's letting himself in for - as you will not be doing shifts...

if he's still keen to stay at theirs maybe he also does 4 nights and tehy get carers for the other days....

That is astoundingly selfish of them.

I would be having very firm words with DH this too.

Is there anyone else they would listen to? Another relative, a minister, a friend?