Ageing and infirm in-laws

[supersop60]

Not sure if this is the right place. My FiL had a severe stroke almost two years ago, and spent about 15 months in hospital and care home. He has been back home since Sept 17 (much to my Mil's chagrin) and things are extremely difficult. He can walk a few steps with a zimmer frame eg from sitting room to loo etc so spends much of his time in a chair watching tv, looking out of the window, and thinking and planning all kinds of things. The stroke has brought out the worst in his dominant personality, and he is always calling for Mil to fetch him this, that and the other, or to take him somewhere, or accusing her of moving things. He is rather deaf but won't admit it, and he shouts questions and instructions from his chair, and then shouts when no-one answers him (they do). My MiL is at the end of her tether and can hardly bear to talk to him because she feels so resentful.
We live about 250 miles away, and so does DPs sister in a different direction. Work commitments and travel challenges mean that they don't get to see their parents very often, and when they do, FiL tries to have talks with them about his hugely unrealistic vision of the future.
Sorry this is a bit rambly - I'm trying to give a concise picture before I ask my question. Does anyone else have experience of dealing with elderly parents? especially if one is infirm or ill. What happens when the other one gets ill? SiL has just rung us to get legal advice because she doesn't want to be forced to look after either of them in the future.

I don't know how to advise you, but I have a friend of long standing in a similar situation - ie determined not to be expected to look after her parents (she had an emotionally abusive childhood) but scared someone could "make" her step up and step in. I don't actually think this can be the case, but don't actually know for sure.

Report your post and ask MNHQ to move to 'Elderly Parents' - you should get some help there.

Legally, they can't make you do anything. If you have the money to pay for private services (cleaning, personal care, transport etc) then you won't have a problem. But if you are expecting public assistance or govt provided care, adult SS and other publicly funded agencies for the elderly can make it very difficult for you not to provide some type of care. They will deny or limit services for other reasons so that family basically has to step in and do what they want the agency to provide.

If you are bound and determined NOT to help your iLs, you just have to have a very tough hide and a lot of determination.

The best thing you can do at the moment is encourage MIL to look after her needs too. She should see if there is a Carer Support go nearby who can emotionally support her. She could pay for a couple of respite sitters each week to give her a break or if FIL is safe to be left alone she should get out, join U3A or find a knitting group or book club or something she likes to stay sane. There may be a falls group or exercise go she could sign FIL up to to get him out. Would he go to a day centre weekly to give her a break.

I've been through a similar journey. I spoke to Adult Social Services and requested an assessment under the Care Act. They came and looked at the household as a whole, so in your case FIL and MIL, took into account the adult children and their lives. It's not a perfect service but it has helped, only one social worker tried to get my sibling and I to do more than we physically could.
The biggest challenge has been my parents, they have limited capacity and that means they are free to make bad as well as good decisions. I know that's right and proper but I'll admit to finding it a tad challenging at times.

It's not me who doesn't want to do any care-taking, it's SIL. FiL has a very good pension, which SS took half of when he was in the care home. They (PiLs) also pay for extra care during the week, and SS pay for a carer to come in the morning to get FiL up, and in the evening to put him to bed.
It's sad to see a once active man so trapped by his own illness - it's no wonder he's become cantakerous and demanding. In his head, he's still in control and wants everything done his way.

vdb I think MiL is trying to. FiL can't be left for long because he tries to do things eg light the fire, or put more logs on etc. he's fallen twice doing that and she can't lift him on her own - she has to get a neighbour to help. They have sitters occasionally, so she can walk the dog or go shopping. She's an artist, but doesn't paint any more because of the continual interruptions. She used to go to the WI, but has stopped going and taking part in activities because it all takes up time that she can't spare.

Does your FIL get attendance allowance? He may be eligible. It's not means tested and can be used for anything that helps to make life easier. My mum got it when she was diagnosed with Alzheimer's (very helpful Admiral's Nurse helped us). We used her's to pay for a cleaner once a week as her Alzheimer's made her forget to wash things down and we were very hit and miss about how much we could help - if she had multiple appointments during the week the cleaning got missed for example.

Some people use theirs to get a mobile hairdresser to come in, pay for care around the home or for someone regular to sit with them whilst their spouse/partner gets a break. What you do with it is up to you. Worth checking.

Social services ultimately have a duty of care. If the family can't (or won't) step in social services have to make sure the person is safe. What they organise may not always be the best thing in terms of care but your SIL just has to learn to say she is not able to help.

I went along for an assessment with my mum when she was in respite after a fall. I was fully prepared to say we could no longer support her - mum's Alzheimer's was getting worse, she wasn't eating properly, had falls and we'd supported her through that for five years. We were scared she was going to seriously hurt herself so I was fully ready to say we were going to step back unless Social Services helped. Thirty minutes into the assessment the social worker turned to me and said 'she needs 24 hour care - you can't carry on like this'. My gaster was well and truly flabbered. So they can be extremely helpful. Mum is now in a very nice care home and is improving oddly enough.

It's worth checking out charities like age concern to see if they have advisers who can help with what ILs are entitled to.

Finally, don't forget to get power of attorney in place for both finances and health. We had both with mum and it meant people could talk to us and take our view into consideration. Without it my friend, whose MIL is in a care home, doesn't have any rights and social services are taking control.

Someone,probably not family, needs to try and persuade him to go to a day centre a couple of times a week so she can paint/shop/ walk dog without worrying. Maybe age UK or there maybe a stroke club. It is so important she does something for her or life just becomes unbearable.Has he got a lifeline pendant he could push if he fell whilst she was out.Google Carer Support for her area and see what volunteer organisations are out there to support and advise her. Red Cross often have carer Support available too.

Have they got a falls careline so that the carers can lift him when he falls, it's not a good idea to rely on her and neighbour to lift him, it should be done safely by people who have been trained. I would ask social services and the care agency to re assess his needs.

Oh thank you. I think they have attendance allowance, and they are paying for some extra hours themselves. I don't know about a falls helpline, and the day centre thing is a great idea. I think MiL has POA, and FiL hates it, and wants to take control back. He's had financial control all of their married life and doesn't trust her. Do you think DP and SiL should have POA?

If he has attendance alowancemshe may be able to claim carers allowance. He should have a pendant ormwristmalarm thatmismset up to alarm if he falls, you can choose who,responds, it doesn't have to be family, it can be carers or emergency services, it's all connected up via the phone. He could also have a home occupational therapy assessment through the g.p. or social services to see if there is any home equipment that would make life a bit easier, falls sensor, rails, it's all free of charge. I would say yes to POA., there are two types, one for finances which can be used as soon as itsmregistered and one for health which is used if they lose capacity. You can get the forms from the office of the public guardian, you don't need a solicitor to do it. With the money you can always just be a bank signatory if he agrees and set up,standing orders. Like a pp said there are voluntary services available, age UK and wrvs offer befriending I think, look,at their website. There should be a local stroke association website who may offer advice and support.

My mum attends a day centre 3 days a week. They collect her and take her home. She gets tea and toast on arrival, lunch and tea/coffee before she leaves. This is provided by the health trust. It is attached to a residential home(also trust) but run separately. Hope you can find something like this locally

If mil has full mental capacity, the she should have POA, unless she doesn’t want it. Having a controlling husband and then her daughter and son take poa would be outrageously cruel. The poor woman needs some control over her own life. She’s married to him so it is also HER money.

Also. If they want to take poa from her, then they can take over his care. They can’t have it both ways. It doesn’t matter if she’s spending it on fancy men and champagne, so long as she’s looking after him properly. Poor woman sounds at the end of her tether.

DH has full POA for his DM. (He also had it for his late DF).The idea is that you set it up when you have full capacity, but it only comes into play when you no longer have capacity.

DH explained to his parents that it would allow him to speak to the bank on DF's behalf. They saw it was useful when DF kept forgetting his PIN, then got flustered on the phone to the call centre, so it worked well that they would speak to DH instead of DF. Eventually DFIL deteriorated so that DH was dealing with much more than that - DFIL was beyond being able to ask DH to do things, DH just had to use his own initiative and deal with things directly (eg paying bills, paying in cheques etc).

More recently, we learned that although DH has POA for his DM, it does not allow him to over-rule her, if she is still of sound mind. With POA in place, she can ask him to act on her behalf, but if she doesn't want to, then he has to sit back and let her make her own decisions, even if he thinks they are bad decisions in the long term.