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Elderly parents

I have Power of Attorney - what happens if he tries to change his will?

14 replies

Chocolategirl79 · 21/04/2018 20:20

FIL is in a nursing home and although he doesn't have a dementia diagnosis, he is regularly very confused.
He has a friend (a young woman) who we are convinced he was giving considerable amounts of cash to her when he was living independently. He worries about how she is managing (we are worried about how to pay his nursing home fees) and has mentioned changing his will to leave her money (if there is anything left). Can he do this ? Or can we stop it through POA? She's not a good influence on him - brings him alcohol and encourages his drinking - which he shouldn't be doing.

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DancingLedge · 21/04/2018 20:25

Is the POa activated? - currently being used to manage his money for him?
I'd press for a dementia diagnosis pdq, if you think he's too confused to make decisions.

DancingLedge · 21/04/2018 20:26

Also you could post this in Legal

Chocolategirl79 · 21/04/2018 20:28

Yes it's activated. They won't do a dementia assessment as he had anaesthetic recently which might impact it.
Ah yes good idea to ask in legal!

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wormery · 21/04/2018 20:35

Has he got the mental capacity to make his own decision about changing his Will, it might be worth getting his GP or carehome to carry out a capacity assessment. Has the p.o.a. been registered and which ones do you have, does it state when you can look after his finances. If he has no capacity then the Solicitor would not agree to adding to his Will and you could inform the office of the public guardian that he does not have the capacity to make any financial decisions. If he has capacity then it's his right to do what he likes but maybe his friend is managing. If his friend is bringing him alcohol which you think is harmful and possibly taking advantage of his money you need to speak to the carehome manager and adult social services if you think he is vulnerable to abuse. How would he arrange to add something to his Will. Its so difficult.

Chocolategirl79 · 21/04/2018 20:43

He's only been in the care home three days and she's already planning to visit and he's talking about going out for a drink!! Not sure how that would work at all, but am still concerned! There was very little sign of her for the six months he was in hospital funnily enough!
Will discuss with the care home but imagine she will take it in with her. I think his confused periods are well documented and I don't think anyone would agree he has capacity.

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AnnaMagnani · 21/04/2018 20:44

Solicitor would have to be certain he has mental capacity to make a will.

You having PoA doesn't affect him being able to change his will on its own - but it the fact you have it and are using it would give any solicitor cause to worry before proceeding with a will.

I take it you have cut off his friend's access to his money?

Also how is he going to make said will - does he have ability to contact solicitor himself, go about organizing it? My FIL talked about changing his will when he had dementia but ultimately didn't have the skills to actually do it.

Presumably dementia assessment will be happening soon and once that has happened, if he gets a diagnosis, most solicitors would be v nervy about agreeing a will change without a specialist medical assessment on capacity.

wormery · 21/04/2018 20:48

Do you have health and welfare po.a. You should ask the carehome to tell her he is not allowed alcohol, and if you are really worried say she is not to visit unsupervised.

Chocolategirl79 · 21/04/2018 21:01

Oh it's hard isn't it? I don't want him to get drunk (and fall over and end up back in hospital) but he has so few pleasures in life I don't feel we should deny him a drink. But then I don't know if he would stop at one or two! And I know she won't be a good influence but she makes him happy!!!
He has no cash and no cash card any more (he was very generous with it previously) so that's not so much of a concern but I think he would like to look after her! Argh it's so hard!

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AcrossthePond55 · 21/04/2018 21:15

POA doesn't stop the person from doing anything. He is still legally entitled to transact his own business and access his own funds. All it does is allow you to act as his agent.

To stop FiL from changing his will you would have to have him declared legally/mentally incompetent and a legal conservatorship/guardianship would have to be established. Once this is done, he will no longer be able to access his money, sign any contracts, or conduct any financial business on his own behalf. Any will drafted by him after the conservatorship/guardianship is established would be null and void.

If you feel this woman is a gold digger then you do need to go the conservatorship route if FiL is truly non compos mentis. Otherwise she'll just take him to the bank to withdraw funds. She can also have him draw up a new POA with her as the agent. I've seen it happen before.

wormery · 21/04/2018 21:19

You still need to speak to the staff about alcohol, it can interfere with some medication and feel stronger if he's recently had surgery. I do think you need to get a capacity assessment done though for all his care needs. Flowers the carehome will be used to this.

Needmoresleep · 22/04/2018 09:02

The Will thing is awkward. When my mother was widowed she had a whole "poor me, my family have abandoned me" narrative, with just about everyone: neighbours, priest, solicitor. Part of it was early dementia which meant she was agressive and distrustful. But also because I was expressing my concern that she was not coping on her own and encouraging her to move. She also tried to play my brother and I off against each other, so he would phone saying that I was "interfering" and that I visited too often. (Someone who had no fresh food in the flat, could no longer use the bath, had not done a tax retun since my dad died, and whose heating and washing machine did not function.)

I know she tried to change her Will, as there as bits of incomplete correspondence with the Solicitor suggesting she missed an appointment to do so. (Because...err...she had little memory.) Much of the rest of the correspondence has gone, I suspect because she woud not have wanted me to see it, though what there is is very spiteful about me and my brother.

So I am essentially managing what will be a large estate for an unknown recipient. The POA-ship requires me to manage this actively. I cannot recharge any of my legal expenses, though obviously would like some advice. And whoever is the beneficiary will be able to go back what will be two decades, and question management decisions and costs and expenses. (And from what I have heard the big corporate charities can be aggressive.)

In the end I can only do what is right and decide that I have no automatic entitlement to my parent's money.

A friend was in a position closer to OPs, though her FiL had a significant estate and a recently acquired girlfriend three decades younger. She used a Private Investigator who uncovered the girlfriend had a seriously murky past. It was sad really as the FiL was head over heels in love, but when confronted with hard facts, had to accept he had been played.

Chocolategirl79 · 22/04/2018 10:48

Jeez @needsmoresleep isn't it awful! To have to hire an investigator is horrific!! It's so stressful.
To be fair, FIL doesn't have a large estate ( a 3 bed semi) which will soon have to be sold to pay care home fees but I don't think he has any idea and was being very 'generous' (£1000 a month vanishing in cash withdrawals whilst he was in hospital) she had bank card and PIN number! She doesn't now. And he doesn't have bank card now so he can't just give her money which is why I think the will might be her next target! However he is now suggesting going to live with her instead of staying in nursing home but I don't think we will see her for dust if he pushes that!! His care needs are numerous!!

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Needmoresleep · 22/04/2018 12:01

The issue is that capacity is not binary, and that for a while before capacity can be judged to be lost, people are vulnerable and liable to make poor decisions. It is what dodgy telephone salesmen and agressive charities have played on for years. When reading through the correspondance from my mother's solicitor I could not believe that an experienced family lawyer could not recognise the symptoms of early dementia. If she had seen the state of my mum's flat she would have been shocked.

There really ought to be an additional category for people who aren't completely incapable of making their own decisions buit, through disability, alcoholism or age, are vulnerable, and where intervention from a trusted family member or similar ought to be possible.

I actually thought the PI approach was neat. They were worried, and a lot of money was being spent on gifts, so it was a reasonably inexpensive way of knocking it all on the head. The report was shocking. The FiL is lovely, and it was so sad for him to have to admit he was an old fool.

NewspaperTaxis · 24/04/2018 12:20

While on this subject, it's worth pointing out that marriage trumps a will or any other legal tax avoidance scams to put a house in the family name and so on.

Your parent may not be deemed to have sufficient marbles to sign over money to the family to avoid it being burnt up in care home fees. And bear in mind, the Council can enforce that if it wants, esp if you don't have LPA. And care homes are awful in my experience.

But marriage? Not sure there's any way you can stop that unless you stand up and do the 'lawful impediment' bit at the Church. So your parent, delighted to have rediscovered his old zest for life and physical appeal in the winter of his years, may marry some floozy who has mysteriously taken a shine to him and bang! She gets half the house and family savings without doing anything. Here the State will do sweet FA to help you.

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