Protecting mothers interests when father isn't

[answerdo]

My parents are in their mid-late 70s, no mobility problems and both pretty healthy at the moment, but for their age they are frail and F has increasingly poor memory and several strong risk factors for a stroke/ heart disease, so I think it would be best for them to think ahead about what would happen if one of them was to become unwell.

The problem is that my F just will not think ahead. He seemingly doesn't believe that either of them will ever get sick or more dependent, and he will not have discussions about their future. His GP advised him to plan ahead due to his health issues, but he dismissed this as interference. If it was just him I would leave him to it tbh, but my DM is caught up in this too. I think that if it wasn't for him she would plan ahead, but he has such a dominating personality that she won't enter into discussion of any topics that he would veto.

They live in a home which they are barely coping with at the moment as it is in pretty poor condition needing lots of work which they can't afford to do, too large for them to manage, probably won't adapt well should their mobility deteriorate and they need to drive to get to a shop, GP, pharmacy, anywhere really. F doesn't drive, only DM. I don't live nearby.

F vetoes any suggestion of them moving in any circumstance. If for example he became physically dependent but still mentally sound, he would expect DM to care for him at home, and however unmanageable it got for her she wouldn't overrule him. If she became dependent I honestly don't know what would happen as I don't think he would care for her, but they don't have the cash to pay for carers or a nursing home for her, and I still don't think he would downsize to pay for her care. I suppose they would have the state level of care but I don't think you get much, and I don't think he would do much for her in between their visits, which would be sad for DM.

Their home is in his name and he has refused to put her on the deeds. If she needed care does that mean that the local authority would have to fund it, as she doesn't have assets herself,everything is in his name? If he needed care (he would refuse if mentally competent, but if he developed dementia for example and was put into a home under his best interests), what would happen to DM whilst he was living in a nursing home? He has left the home to her in his will and has written a financial power of attorney naming her, she would definitely want to move elsewhere if he was in a nursing home as she wouldn't cope in their current house on her own, would she be able to sell and downsize using the financial power of attorney, given that buying her somewhere to live wouldn't really be in his interests iyswim? How would this work with the local authority seeking money from his home to fund his care? Would the LA have an obligation to leave her enough to buy herself a new home?

I have encouraged her to seek legal advice, but she has her head in the sand unfortunately, she can't see that he isn't considering her interests.

Any advice would be appreciated about the legalities and how to persuade them to make some plans and seek advice.

That's a good suggestion, he does listen to men more, and he has listened to my husband about smaller financial issues before. My husband agrees with me.

Am I correct in encouraging my dm to push for joint ownership of their home? Would this give her more freedom to sell if he goes into a home? Can she force a sale if the situation becomes impossible and he still refuses to move?

The important thing to consider is the tenancy of the home- is it joint tenants, or tenants in common? If your mum is living in the home social services cannot get their hands on it and force a sale to fund your Dad's care (whatever the tenancy). However, if your mum was to pre decease him, and let's say she'd left it to you, it would automatically go to him if they were joint tenants. I lost out on a home because of this, mum left it to me but it was joint tenants and Dad got it after she died 20 years ago. Fair enough. But what upsets me is if he has to go into a home, the house will be sold and I won't inherit any of it.
I would suggest checking the tenancy of the home (it should be listed on the land registry website and you could access the info for a couple of quid online). Double check what I've said as I may have got the type oftenancy mixed up! (joint versus in common). Get advice from a solicitor if necessary. HTH.

Sorry just re read and saw he made sure your mum is not on the deeds. Not sure if that means it is not listed under her name on the land registry, still worth a check. Really I have to agree with London Zoo, your Dad sounds like and unbelieveable bully and i totally understand you have your mum's interests at heart despite his best efforts.

Having said all this SS could put it to your mum that she does not need such a big home, that she should sell it, use the money to buy a smaller place for herself and put the rest towards Dad's care should he need it. But they cannot force a sale, take all the money and make her homeless even if she is not on the deeds/ co owner.

I think your DF sounds like he has dementia already.

Stubbornness and unreasonableness is a feature of it.

I'd ask your DH to talk through a few scenarios with him, and make it clear to him that his wife isn't his carer, as she's elderly too.

If he refuses to see sense you can contact a solicitor to ask that your mum is the person in charge of his affairs, on the basis of his dementia and forgetfulness.
Sorry I can't remember the name of this.

I'm sorry you're going through this now, and hope you can all come to a peacable resolution. You'll need to support your mum in this I think, and taking sides is never very pleasant, but important to do if one party is being unfair unreasonable and entitled, and it negatively impacts on on other party and their quality of life.

He has been this stubborn and selfish his whole life, Venus! But yes I worry he may be developing dementia, which is why I am persuading my DM to seek legal advice asap, whilst he is still competent to be persuaded and sign forms. So hard when she has always gone along with him before.

What type of solicitor should we see for advice, and does anyone have any tips for choosing one?

You might start with CAB, Age UK or the Alzheimer's Society Forum "Talking Point" who have a legal section.

You might also phone the Office of Public Guardian. My guess is that if your dad won't willingly sign a POA document you may have to go via the Court of Protection. You could ask them about the process and the evidence needed. No need to give any names!

Though your mum's name is not on the Deeds I would have thought there was some way of recognising her rights in keeping a roof over her head. I am not a lawyer but woud see this as a priority.

However lawyers are really expensive, so best to try as many free sources of advice to gain a be sence of options, so you only use them to draw up necessary paperwork.

I think London Zoo is right. Is there anyone else your dad listens to? Old friend, Vicar?

I saw a solicitor for the elderly I found her details n the law society.'s website. She gave me a lot of good legal information and charged a flat fee of about £250. She s he one who told me about joint tenants vs tenants in common. She's in SE London pm me if you,'d like her contact details.

Rules on selling the home vary from council to council, so check, but basically the law is that

1 - if your DM needed care the state (in this case, the council) would pay for it once her assets are under about 25k. So whatever you do, don't put her name on the deeds of the house. Once your DF dies, assuming he dies first, you should use a deed of variation on the will to get the house transferred straight to you and their other kids, bypassing DM, so she won't inherit it and then still have to pay for care.

1. - If your DF needs care, the state will consider the value of the house, but they won't be able to sell it if your DM is still living there, as that's against the care rules. Even if she doesn't own any of it, she's still his wife and the law states that spouses have a right to a home.

But if DM wants to move, she will have to pay DFs care once she has bought a smaller house as she'll have to use any extra cash released from the sale of the bigger house once it takes her assets over 25k ish. And no, she can't give you that cash because that would count as 'deprivation of assets' - ie deliberately giving money away to avoid a bill - and councils are pretty hot on that. DM's second home would be safe from your DFs care bills, but not hers, because she would own the second home and once she went into care it would prob have to be sold.