Bristol secondary appeals

[Carrie66]

Does anyone know where I can find published information on the secondary school appeals process in Bristol? Or does anyone have any info on this- in particular on the fact I have been told by the admissions team that any places given up by parents after appeals have been won will go to appeals winners and not to those still on the waiting list? I always thought the appeals places were entirely separate.

The process in Bristol should be the same as everywhere else.

What the admissions team has told you is misleading. I suspect they haven't explained very well rather than actually getting it wrong.

Any child winning an appeal automatically gets a place. However, that means the school is now over PAN in year 7. So no-one off the waiting list will be admitted until it goes back below PAN.

For example, imagine a school has a PAN of 150 and 4 children are admitted on appeal. There are now 154 children in Y7. The next 4 children who leave Y7 will not be replaced from the waiting list, so the number in Y7 will fall back to 150. It is only when a 5th child leaves that someone will be admitted from the waiting list.

I thought that if you were on the "continuing interest list" then you could be offered a place as and when they came up, whether this was before or after the appeals allocation?

They are definitely two separate lists.

If they are operating two separate lists they are wrong. It is highly unlikely that they are doing so. Children who win appeals are admitted immediately. They do NOT go onto a high priority waiting list.

The correct system is as I have described. Any vacancy is filled off the waiting list. If pupils get admitted via appeals the school will be over PAN. A pupil leaving therefore does not create a vacancy as the school is still over PAN. No further pupils should be admitted from the waiting list until the school falls below PAN again.

So yes, you will be offered a place as and when it comes up. However, if there are successful appeals it will be a while until a place comes up as a child leaving will not result in a vacancy.

pr- aren't we really saying the same thing?

You can get a place if a child leaves or you can get a place on appeal- the two are separate issues in a way.

I'm not sure you are saying the same thing? I am referring to entry into Y7 in September. We have not been offered any of our 3 choices of schools and have not got a second round offer for our first choice school, but are now very near the top of the 'waiting list.'
I had thought that any successful appeals would be allocated places anyway but that those of us not appealing but on waiting lists would be alloacted places as and when they became available ie. 2 separate 'lists.'
However admissions told me last week that once appeals are won any spare places that become available will be offered to these pupils ie. to keep as close to PAN as possible.
I just wondered where this system is documented as I have never found any real details about it?.

OP- if you go online to the Advisory Centre for Education (charity with a helpline inc. help on appeals) you will find links to the Government's own website about appeals.

The way I have also seen it- and a close friend/neighbour of mine won their appeal- is that the continuing interest list works separately from the appeals process.

If you win on appeal the school can be oversubscribed as a result but they have to absorb those pupils. If anyone leaves, and numbers fall, then you can be offered a place as long as they are not going to exceed their maximum numbers by offering you that place.

I have known pupils who have transferred from the continuing interest list as late as Year 9, having not won a place on appeal.

Does this make sense t o you?

Carrie - Unless Bristol are breaking the law (unlikely), I think they have simply done an extremely bad job of explaining the system to you.

Imagine the school has a PAN of 150 and it is full. Every time a child drops out, a child will be admitted from the waiting list.

There are some appeals for this school as a result of which 5 children get admitted. They are admitted straight away - they do NOT go onto a separate waiting list. The school now has 155 in year 7.

A child leaves. They now have 154 in year 7. This is still over the PAN of 150 so no child is admitted from the waiting list.

Four more children leave. They are now back down to 150 in year 7. This means they are full up to PAN so they still don't admit any children from the waiting list.

Another child leaves. Now they are down to 149 so a child is admitted from the waiting list, taking year 7 back up to 150.

I hope this clarifies things.

I think there could be confusion over what would happen if there were a PAN of 150 and someone left before the appeals process was completed. Would the first person on the waiting list get in then, even though people admitted through appeal would go over the PAN?

If the LA is operating the process correctly someone should be admitted from the waiting list. The LA should not be holding places open just in case there are some successful appeals. If they did, whoever was head of the waiting list could appeal on the grounds that their child should have been admitted if the LA was operating the process correctly.