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Thinking of PGCE/SCITT...need to talk out my thoughts with those going through teacher training/experienced teachers

13 replies

ThisBoyDraculaDrew · 13/02/2010 18:10

Hi,

Teaching my second choice of career when I entered my current career as a research scientist. If I am honest the big thing that I was scared of was being able to control (behaviour wise) a class full of children. Now I have matured somewhat (have been in industry for 12yrs) I have been pondering the option on and off for the last couple of years - but the only thing holding me back has been finance. Paying for the course, cost of living whilst training and a substantial paycut compared to my current income.

Thing is I am now facing a substantial threat of being made redundant. It is almost certain that I could be offered a very attractive voluntary redundancy package even if I don't get made compulsary redundant. Hence I could have the funding to make this career change.

Now...I have a 1st Class(hons) degree in Biology. A levels (grade A&B) in Biology, maths and geograpy. 11 GCSEs grades A-C.

I can't decide between primary (KS2) and secondary. I think that I would rather work with younger children (mostly cos controlling a class of teenagers still scares me a little). However, with my 1st class degree and 12yrs in industry am I wasting my biology skills? I think that I would really enjoy teaching biology...if it wasnt for the 15yo's with attitude. I know that there is a shortage ofr science teachers - and the enhanced funding and golden hello for science would be really attractive. I would also really enjoy teaching maths but assume that this would be difficult for me as my degree is science.
Can I overcome my fear of 15yo's???

The other thing that I have been looking at is a few courses. What is the difference between a PGCE and SCITT? Are there any emplyability differences between them?

What should I look for in a course?

OP posts:
MrsDinky · 13/02/2010 18:13

Hello, I can't offer any advice, but would like to watch this thread with you as I am in a similar position (recently made redundant as a chemist after ahem, slightly longer, in industry). Also think I could manage maths but not 15 year olds!

ThisBoyDraculaDrew · 13/02/2010 18:14

Also - how do you get experience before applying? The courses I have looked at require 10 days recent "experience in schools". Do I just go along to DCs school and beg headteacher to let me sit in for a couple of weeks? How do I do this if I chose secondary?

I have just been presented with the pportunity to train as a Brown owl - I think that I might take this oppportunity to add to my CV...assuming that is not a stupid idea.

OP posts:
oxocube · 13/02/2010 18:21

I wouldn't go to your own kids' school TBH. It might be seen as intrusive by some teachers or even by other parent. Why not try another school close by to get experience? With PGCE you can choose to specialise in teaching younger children (I teach Yr 1) or juniors if you chose primary rather than secondary. Upper juniors might be a good balance as you would still get to use some of your science background without having to deal with the scary 15 yr olds.

If I were you though, I think I would try to do a bit of voluntary work with both age groups. The big kids can be less scary than a class full of 5 year olds sometimes

JammyQueenOfTheSewers · 13/02/2010 18:21

A friend of mine is thinking of training to be a teacher - she asked at local 2ndry and is doing 2 weeks experience assisting in classes to see what she thinks.

SnowWoman · 13/02/2010 18:25

Check out the TES website and think very very carefully. There are a lot of qualified teachers who cannot get permanent jobs. The Scottish teacher training colleges have been told to cut their intake substantially this year, and I know of several maths and science teachers who are jobless having finished their probationary year. There are a lot of unemployed primary teachers in our neck of the woods too.

If the school-based on the job training is on a permanent contract, then that would be a less risky way of proceeding, but I don't know enough about it to be helpful.

Get in to schools and see what is going on in the classroom really, and talk to any teachers you know who could give advice.

Having said all that, if it is what you have always wanted to do, then go for it.

wastwinsetandpearls · 13/02/2010 20:46

15 year olds are not scary, a little irritating perhaps but not scary.

We really need good science teachers, especially science ones.

Write to a few schools and say you want to teach science and you would like to see some teaching or do some voluntary work.

ThisBoyDraculaDrew · 13/02/2010 21:16

Thanks for the messages. Is there any way I can find some stats for post training employment rates? I have seen a couple of individual uni's publishing their own stats - is there anywhere I can find a more comparative "league table"

OP posts:
SE13Mummy · 13/02/2010 21:19

I worked in academic research for a few years after university and gave that up to train as a primary school teacher. Although I would have preferred to teach the middle school age range (8-14 ish) that wasn't an option and I knew I wanted to be a class teacher rather than a (science) subject specialist so I went for primary (KS2).

Before worrying too much about which route to take into teaching I'd definitely try to spend some time in schools, both primary and secondary. National science week is coming up in March so it wouldn't be that difficult to get in as a real-life scientist for children to ask questions of.

If, 12 years ago, you were worried about the behaviour management side of secondary teaching then I'd recommend making sure that the schools you spend time in represent a real mixture e.g. mixed intake, socially deprived area, high proportion of children with EAL rather than a local school full of middle class children as you never know where you'll end up!

Secondary is great if you want to specialise in your subject but you may find it frustrating to have to teach your specialism to repeated groups of students for approx. 5 hours a week (at GCSE level) and will almost certainly have to study some chemistry and physics (I know when I did my biology degree that there were some PGCE students studying various units with us because their degrees were in physics so had to get themselves up to degree level in the other two subjects).

Primary is fantastic from the point of view of being able to form a relationship with your own class and tailor teaching to their needs, interests and personalities. I love that I can change the structure of the day to suit what we're learning e.g. when studying the movement of the sun I can take them outside repeatedly to measure shadows at different times of day whereas secondary teachers are limited to a single (or maybe double) lesson. The cross-curricular nature of primary teaching is a real strength too as subjects don't need to be taught in isolation - if I'm teaching data handling we can use data from a science investigation, combine it with an ICT session to show how Excel can be used and the literacy input can be related to forming a hypothesis, writing methods/conclusions etc.

Day-to-day primary is a lot more demanding as you are with the same group of children all the time (primary teachers get 10% planning time but no free lessons whereas secondary teachers get 10% planning time plus free lessons) but that can be easier than having to learn the names and needs of 300+ students across KS3/4. Primary teachers only have a couple of parents' evenings a year whereas secondary teachers will have a couple a year per year group and the same is true for reports although in secondary you will only be writing about your subject instead of absolutely everything. Primary teachers are expected to take on a curriculum area as a responsibility once they've completed their NQT year and unless this is a core subject there will be no additional pay/time given whereas secondary schools have more staff and are organised in departments so the workload is shared.

Behaviour management is an issue regardless of which age you teach; I encounter far more challenging behaviour in the primary school I teach in (deprived estate in inner London) than my secondary school teaching DH does (grammar school in outer London) but I enjoy teaching in my school and would probably be hopeless in a grammar school! When it comes to choosing a course do make sure that you choose one which will give you proper behaviour management input. Lanky 15 year olds may be scary but so are weapon-wielding 10 year olds so don't be fooled into thinking that it is easier to manage the behaviour of younger children. It will depend upon your own skills, the school's systems and the children.

In terms of courses you will also want to check if all of them mean you are entitled to the golden hello schemes; when I did the GTP I received a training salary (taxable) and was then not eligible for the golden hellos. By the end of the year I was no better/worse off than those who had completed a PGCE but had had the advantage of being paid a monthly salary which helped with the mortgage. Your employability will depend upon the area you live in. There are always jobs in London but the South West, including Bristol seems to be overrun with teachers (and has a fresh supply of cheap ones each year due to the high volume of training institutions they have down there).

Contact some local schools and ask if you could shadow a member of staff for a day, ideally someone who teaches the full range of students and that may help you to make a decision.

Personally I think teaching is the best job in the world; it's hard work, frustrating and can be emotionally draining but is a truly privileged position to be in and is a lot of fun (eventually!).

TheFallenMadonna · 13/02/2010 21:22

There's a shortage of Science teachers, but not of biology teachers. How would you feel about teaching Chemistry and Physics to GCSE as well?

Biochemist, teaching Physics...

SE13Mummy · 13/02/2010 21:26

www.tda.gov.uk/Recruit/adviceandevents/tttlandingpage2010/Subpages/whattoexpect.aspx

Might be helpful?

Apologies for the messy link - it didn't work even though I followed the instructions!

ThisBoyDraculaDrew · 13/02/2010 21:42

Thanks,

I have been looking on the tda web-site.

I would expect to teach mixed science...but have only studied Chemistry and Physics (and even then as a dual award science rather than pure sciences) to GCSE standard myself so was assuming that could cause problems.

OP posts:
ThisBoyDraculaDrew · 13/02/2010 21:44

P.S. I am not even a biochemist...just pure biology.

I was very competent to GCSE but I know that the A level chem and physics were another kettle of fish so would worry that I could struggle.

My employer normally does soe science week activies in local schools so I will make sure I get my name down to get involved...for both experience and brownie points at interview.

OP posts:
wastwinsetandpearls · 13/02/2010 22:10

That would be a good idea Thisboy.

Could you put an add up to do tutoring, you could earn some money and experience GCSE work?

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