teacher refused my request to be a parent helper - why?!

[tigermoth]

My year 1 son's class are going to a local park for two hours tomorrow. The teacher said parents could attend. We were given only a few days notice, but as my son really wants me to go on a trip, and I promised him I would try, I arranged to have time off from work. Job done, I thought.

I spoke to the teacher in passing this morning. She said she was not sure I could go as lots of parents wanted to attend (huh?). I told her not to worry about me taking up a seat on the coach as I would be driving there in my car.

The teacher put a note in my son's bookbag. I read it this evening. The note says I cannot go due to demand for places. What on earth is that all about!! The children are walking in the park, looking at various plants and animals. Why can only a set number of parents walk along with them? It is a park, for goodness sake!

Please give me a plausible explanation. I am going to query why I have been refused admission tomorrow at 9.00 am, so any replies before then would be really appreciated.

I've been in a similar situation; and it's not yet resolved. Dd's nursery class are going on a trip to a safari park in June. When I handed in her money, the Nursery Nurse said they were looking for parents to come and help supervise the children. There and then I looked in my diary and said I could probably make it, and dd was pleased to hear I would be coming. The next time I took her to nursery, literally 2 days later, I was told they had enough parents, and I couldn't come. I was gutted, as was dd, and still haven't received a satisfactory explanation as to the reason for their change of mind. It's not as if I don't have first aid and life support qualifications And public liability insurance of my own.....

and I work with children and have a current disclosure certificate

I can quite see that too many adults could be a hindrance, but it's no wonder that breakdowns in communication occur - if all teachers managed to show a little thought and sensitivity when dealing with parents life would be a lot more pleasant. I know how busy teachers are but communication is one area where schools could do much better imo

I think this is something that may have changed very recently so that all helpers have to be police vetted? If its not actually a formal requirement schools certainly prefer those who have their certificate. Going back to the "usual culprits" may be because they are vetted. I've also had the "don't take a group with your own child in" bit.

At my dd's school when there is a trip, a general letter is sent out even though they only ever require a certain number of helpers. Once that number has volunteered/been chosen (?) then anyone else who speaks up is told, "sorry, we have enough helpers". I think your situation is normal, tigermoth but frustrating in the way it has been communicated. I expect there may other mums who have been told the same thing.

Well, tigermoth has the time off this morning and isn't on here so I hope that means she has gone along to the park!

.

Have only read the opening post. I went on a local walk-about with my dd's class with ds in his pram when he was only a few weeks old as dd wanted me there. Obviously as I had the pram I couldn't look after any other children apart from dd, the teacher was more than happy for me to go along with them though.

First of all I am absolutely saying nothing about Tigermoths helping skills here. You sound like a lovely caring mum TM and your ds's teacher sounds idiotic not to accept your help, especially if your ds is not well settled.

But just to play devil's advocate here for a moment - I've been a teacher and frankly some parents are more help on trips than others. I have terrible memories of my very first class trip (with a picnic in a park)as a new teacher. One of the parent helpers encouraged the children to feed their packed lunches to the goats in the 'pets corner' in spite of the notices and me telling the children not to. She swore openly and pretty much encouraged chaos while I tried to line the children up to cross a busy road. After that I never had room for her on my class trips!

As teachers we often first approached the parents we knew could handle the major responsibilities of handling a group of other people's over-excited and possibly badly behaved kids before opening the invite to all parents in general. Not all offers of help should be accepted without question and who knows what mysterious reasons Tigermoth's teacher has but they may be genuine.

And again I am in no way implying that Tigermoth is anything but the best

What happened Tigermoth?

thought she would have been back by now. Assuming that she did go with them.

teacher wouldn't let me go!!

I got to school early so I could chat to her about this - at the very least get a reason so I could tell my son why. The door to the classroom was closed but I could hear voices. The head was talking to the teacher about the trip. Didn't catch what was being said but as the door opened, I heard the head giving the teacher a strong lead about what to do. when the head left, I popped my head round the door and very smilingly asked if I could drive down, son really wanted me there, I knew she would have organised groups, but I would fit in with whatever plans she had.The answer was a firm no - and no explanation except to say that 11 parents had volunteered their services and she had picked 6 of them.

I said 'we have not been given much notice, I hope next time we get more notice as I really do want to make the next trip' steely but eager smile from me. Non committal answer from her. She wouldn't make eye contact, and said she'd let me know when the next trip was planned. Hmmm....

I will not let this lie but will keep reminding her, very nicely of course

Very interesting to read people#s comments about their experiences of this at other schools - teachers and parents. I am in a rush so can't add more now.
School trips - another minefield discovered!

off to dring that voddy in my handbag!

Weird. Sorry tigermoth, I think you're right not to let it lie.

Part of her job is talking to parents, seems like she needs to get better at this.

Maybe you can suggest they have a rota for parents to attend trips? That way it would be fair and people couldn't just choose to go on the best trips. (The class I work in are going to Legoland soon, I can see a few parents wanting to help out on this one! Unfortunately for them, no help is required!)

I know some parents want to help out and get involved in their childs school so this way would give everybody a chance. Sounds a bit suspicious to me, especially if it was the usual helpers that got to go.

Hope you DS had a lovely time at the park.

I think part of the problem is that many teachers don't actually see it as part of the job, talking to parents. OK they do a bit, but it's way down the list of priorities, and they don't really get any training at it.

A friend of mine who is a deputy head, has only now been going on courses in communicating with parents, and she said recently that as a result of the training she has had, she realises that all the comms she ever had with parents in the last 15 years were pretty crap - not her fault, but just the real basics had never been pointed out to her, and when she's had the occasional run-ins with parents, she now sees how some of the situations could have been avoided by better communication. Shame she's had to wait to get to deputy head level to have some really basic training offered to her, that would have made her job so much easier.

Well I'm a bit cross she wouldn't even look at you, tigermoth!

But then maybe it wasn't her decision - when you say the head was giving her a strong lead about what to do, how do you mean? I was wondering if maybe you should approach the head (in a very non-judgmental way of course!) about the way the school in general organises parent helpers for class trips but if it's the head who's laying down the law it probably wouldn't help - maybe the teacher was feeling guilty and that's why she couldn't look at you?

Hope DS2 understood and wasn't too disappointed, anyway.

sorry tigermoth, i was only joking about the voddy, please dont drink it all It hurts so much when the school is like this. i feel so detached from my daughters school so i know how you must feel. especially as you went to so much effort

In my dd's school the first parents asked are the class reps (I am one) because the teachers know that we are mums who are available (oh, ok we don't work outside the home) and maybe because we have been before so we are a known quantity (I'm quite good at pretending to act sensibly when I want to). After that, its a matter of numbers and people's offers of help are turned down.

I think in your case tm, sounds like you haven't been before? Bet it was because the usual suspects had already been chosen.

Tigermoth, could you speak to the head about this incident? You're being entirely reasonable. Don't just yet push for more notice next time, but say you want to understand why they wouldn't "let" you go.

I think I will wait to see what happens when the next school trip is planned. I can sort of see that the teacher might want to limit the number of parents going on a trip,(even a walkabouit in a park). It's a bit like having lots of parents hovering round when you hold a child's birthday party, I suppose.

I quite understand that certain parents are trusted people at the school - the parents who regularly listen to childen reading, been police checked, are at the school a lot during the day going PTA stuff.

However, in my experience of being a primary school mother, when notes come round asking for parents to accompany children on day trips, the request is a more general one. I always felt teachers saw this as an opportunity to give less involved parents a chance to help out? Have things changed, I wonder? On the trips I have been on, teachers have said this it's nice to see new faces amongst the parents, and I have felt it's been those parents, those who can't make a regular commintment to help in the school, those who have taken time off work, who are especially welcome. I've had teachers telling me that's the reason they picked me - the very fact that I am too busy to help regularly. Granted I don't go on many trips - perhaps one a year, and it's been a while since I went on one. Perhaps things really have changed? If police vetting is now needed, why haven't all parents been told?

Janh, you could be right about the head laying down the law - perhaps the teacher had no say about this, and felt a bit embarassed. The teadher is very young, ( early twenties) straight out of college and very, very keen. This is her first year at the school. I am really tryin got see things from her point of view. I think she wants to prove herself and my son, bless him, is not performing to his ability at the moment - just doesn't like lessons much. I know she is very frustrated with him.

I can't argue that she is committed, but we don't see eye to eye on some things. She thinks my son is regularly exhausted on 11 or 12 hours sleep a night - I have told her I can't see this is so, as I see how lively he is when he comes home from school and how at weekends, he is not dropping with exhaustion on this amount of sleep. I cannot get him into bed any earlier tham 8 - 8.30 pm (he gets up at 8.00 or a bit later in the mornings) as I don't come home from work till after 6.00 pm. Homework, music practice, cooking and eating supper, baths, reading takes 2 hours. I had an edgy meeting with her a few weeks ago about my son. I felt she was very much blaming me for my son's inattentiveness at school and asked me if I could cut back my working hours - as if! We didn't exactly argue, but didn't exactly agree either IYSWIM. Still, I left thinking we had reached a compromise (a slightly uneasy one).

I suppose this puts the school trip thing in a bit more context!

I know I have only got the rest of this term to go before ds gets a new teacher, so that's something.