Dilemma state or private primary - aargh (sorry long)

[mrsshackleton]

My dd1 didn't get in to any of her choices of primary schools and the LEA told me firmly that she didn't stand a chance with our nearest and preferred one (or any of the others come to that) as she was far down the waiting list, despite us living pretty close, and nearly all the places had been taken by siblings.

So I found a place for her at a private prep school, which is about a 10 min drive from us, 20 in rushhour traffic. It's a sweet school and I like it but I am not madly in love with it. However, dd paid a visit adored it, adored the reception teachers and is all fired up about going there (plus I told her she could do ballet, swimming, french there all things not offered by state primary to soften the blow as she was a bit confused as to why she wasn't going to the school down the road. None of her friends from nursery are going to either school, so that's no a factor.

So this morning I get a letter saying she's got a place at the local primay after all. I have no idea how, will have to call on Monday, but I assume they're putting on an extra class which they swore blind to me they wouldn't.

So what to do. If I turn down the private school I lose a hefty deposit plus at this point (I think) a term's fees, which makes me think we might as well go through with the private option.

I will move my dcs into the private system at some stage in their education so am wondering if I should just accept it's going to happen a bit earlier than planned and console myself I may not have to fork out for tutoring as all my friends with dcs in the state system do at some point as our local secondary options are dire.

Dh and I are both self employed, some years he in particular, does very well but times are uncertain and my income in particular has been suffering a lot recently.

Otoh, his parents are v generous and have already given us a sum to cover the first few years of school and I am sure if we ran out of funds they'd step in to cover us - don't want to be put in that position though. I also like the idea of dd going to a good primary school within walking distance with all the consequences for having more local friends etc.

What to do? Would esp appreciate advice from teachers with experience of both private and state on the pros and cons of each side. Am so annoyed with the council for assuring me I had no chance, if they'd hinted I should hang in there I'd never have approached the private school and I'd be overjoyed by the letter from the council TIA for any advice.

Go with the state option.

For these reasons:

• she can do ballet/ French/ whatever she wants after school, and would still cost less than the private school
• your financial sit may change. Maybe put some of the prospective fees into savings for secondary/university level.
• local schools have massive benefits in terms of your dd having her own local community. Friends nearby. Prospect of being able to go by herself when she is much older. Feeling part of her local community. Easier journey.
• you weren't completely completely blown away by the private option. YOur dd's feelings may have been swayed by the added extras, but that is easily rectified by making a big deal of how positive the recent news is for her.
• You can always go private at 7 if you feel that the local school is not meeting your expectations.

God that's annoying - stupid council.

The problem with these sorts of questions is that it all depends on the two schools you are choosing between (to state the obvious)>

At what point were you planning to go private anyway? If it was 7 and the ILs can cover you for a few years you might as well go for it now. If it was 11, you might want to do 4 to 7 in the primary then use your (or ILs) money to do the next four years.

Do not assume that prep school parents don't do tutoring for senior school BTW!

I would go with the state-for all the good reasons given by pooka.

i'm a big fan of private education. but, i think in this case, you should go with the state option.
ballet french etc she can do in state as well, you just have to organise it yourself
etcetc

In your position I'd accept you've lost your deposit and go to the state school. One term's fees is still less than 4 years (or however long until you plan to move her).

We're in a different but equally tricky position - didn't get any of our choices but council has hinted strongly we should get a place at some point. dd already at nursery attached to private prep school, loves it, all her friends staying, we love it. But, if she gets a place at the outstanding state school at the end of the road between now and sept, will be hard to say no.

State, for the reasons pooka outlines, plus the fact that you quite understandably don't want to be in the position of relying on grandparents to pay school fees in the future. Seen it with a few other families and it rarely comes without strings attached - even at a subconscious level. I'm sure your parents are lovely and generous, but it means that they will have a 'stake' in your children's lives which is maybe not best. You want to be able to feel all the way through their education that as parents you are the ones driving any decisions.

7% of children go to private schools and over 50% of places at Oxbridge and the better universities are from children in private schools. Children in many private primaries are at least a year ahead the state system academically. BUT if it's a rubbish private school, does not get children to very good academic private schools at 11 or 13+ then think again.

If it the private school you are planning to go to when your dd is older couldn't you just ask the school to defer entry and transfer at 7? I wouldn't turn down a place at a good state school because of losing a deposit and one term's fees. Assuming you are starting school at 5 you will have at least 6 years or 18 terms school fees (assuming you are only doing primary private) plus all the extras.

Go for the state one. If you have good and bad times as self employed persons you don't want to be with the constant pressure that you may not have enough to pay the fees.

Loosing a term deposit will save you many many thousands over the next years.

If you were tremendously pleased with the school then it is ok to go for it, but not for not loosing a deposit.

I wouldn't pay for education unless I really loved the school-you have already said that you don't.

You havent told me enough about the 2 schools, your personal attitudes to education and your DD to enable me to give much advice. The only piece of advice I would give is please do not choose a school based on the fact that it is close by, she can walk to school and will have local friends. I moved my DD from the local school and like most other people she has local friends and friends further afield. That said I would have removed my DD from that school anyway even if I couldn't have found her place immediately.

Think about the things that are important to you. What sort of child is your DD, what approach to different ability levels do the schools have, how big are the schools, what facilities to they have, do they have mixed year classes (if so are you happy with this), how many children are there per class and what is the mix. I could go on. IMO if you have a choice i.e you could go state or private there are many many things to consider. Good luck.

i agree with aintnomountain, there is more to consider than just the money and the extras. my daughter is presently in yr 1 at a private school where her educational opportunities and academic learning is second to none. she presently does year three work but due to the gender mix (9boys 2girls) her confidence in herself and her social friendships(the other girl is a tomboy, my daughter is a pink fluffy girly girl) are suffering and we are moving her to a catholic state school next term. we are aware that her learning will probably drop somwhat but it is more important for her to build her social skills and be a little girl at the moment. we will worry about later,later.
Only you know your daughter, where would she be happier?

I'm another one agreeing with aintnomountain. Personally, I would always go for a private school, given the choice, but that's a generalisation: you know your child, and you know what the two particular schools are like. Only you can know which school will suit her best.

FWIW, it's perfectly possible to have local friends despite going to a prep school!

We have an excellent small state primary near by where my dc do exceedingly well (dd age 10 has reading ability of 16 y.o), they have free violin/cello lessons, lots of sports,trips, after school clubs etc and tiny class sizes so are able to cater for the individual. There are SN children who have their own personal Teaching Assistant so disruption is kept to a minimum.

I'd say a good state primary is as good if not better than a mediocre prep school.(You could also compare their inspection reports to get another view.)

The secondary is listed in the Independent's list of top 100 Comprehensives in the country, so for us there would be no reason to go private. In fact it would be utter madness and a total waste of money!

If your going to go for independant at some point why consider state now???

Find a good private now!!!! I don't really understand your worries - sorry!

Thanks for your very helpful comments

I've been all over the place, my first reaction was to stick with the private school as I'd been selling it to myself for the past few weeks. Overnight I decided the state option was probably better for the many reasons outlined above.

I like and dislike things about both schools - the state one is rated good with outstanding features by Ofsted and the private outstanding in the early years. Sadly, the private is undersubscribed and I know they will bill me for the term's fees and understand why.

MollieO, your idea is a good one but I wouldn't transfer dd there at 7 - the school is very good pre-prep but less good at the prep stage (imo) and my plan was to send her there until 7 and then transfer her to one of a handful of prep schools that start at 7, have an excellent reputation and are within walking distance.

Chillie yours is a good point too: my main concern about the private school is it's almost too small and cosy and dd may not be within a wide enough pool of friends.

I think I am going to accept the state school place until I've returned to the private school for a party for next year's reception which they hold mid June. The state school also does an induction morning around the same time. Then I'll be able to make comparisons and see exactly how big the classes will be, how girl/boy heavy etc and that will help us make a decision. It's so hard and frustrating though.

I would go for the state option but then I would say that

If the main reason for going private is that otherwise you will lose a term's fees, well, that's not really a great reason, is it? You'll spend a lot more than that in the long term, won't you?

I would personally never consider a school that was a 20-min drive away unless there was no other option. But not everyone agrees with me, I realise.

Plus what pooka said about local school and advantages thereof.

If you were going to change at 7 anyway go for the state primary school and then change to a prep school you think is suitable. You'll lose a term's fees but save 8 terms'.

I think, since reading your second post, I would go for the state primary.

I was going to say to think about the private schools you would like your child to be in later and think about how competitive they are to get in to.

From what you say, the private school would not prepare the children anyway to get into other schools if they have their own prep. So I would stick with your local school and save yourself the money.

You may need to factor in tutor costs for entry at 7 if you are doing the selective prep route.